Question about what I need

W

Wchilds

Audiophyte
I am a coach at a small high school in Texas and our kids and coaches want it loud in there. Our weight room is about 20x80 with 9 ft ceilings. I have a limited budget of 200-300 dollars. What do I need to buy to give the kids what they want? Any help would be greatly appreciated. If this is in the wrong forum I am sorry. Thanks in advance. Coach :cool:
 
Soundman

Soundman

Audioholic Field Marshall
I am a coach at a small high school in Texas and our kids and coaches want it loud in there. Our weight room is about 20x80 with 9 ft ceilings. I have a limited budget of 200-300 dollars. What do I need to buy to give the kids what they want? Any help would be greatly appreciated. If this is in the wrong forum I am sorry. Thanks in advance. Coach :cool:
That is a tough one. Hmmm That is a pretty large space, so filling that area with sound with such a limited budget will be difficult. I'll have to think that one over. Maybe someone else will chime in in the mean time?
 
Soundman

Soundman

Audioholic Field Marshall
BTW, you're not on the wrong forum. Welcome aboard, Coach! :)

..oh, and what do you coach? :confused:
 
Soundman

Soundman

Audioholic Field Marshall
OK, this is going to be tough. That's 14,400 cu ft of space you're trying to fill. :eek: OK, so, is what your trying to setup just for music? What type of music? I assume high fidelity is not important. You just need something that will play very loud. Correct? Also, is this budget just for the speakers? or will you need something to power them as well?
 
W

Wchilds

Audiophyte
First off thanks for replying. Second that is for everything. I am a big craigslist believer and eBay user. Our kids really want a lot of bass if you can hear the words that is just icing on the top. Football, Powerlifting and track is what I coach. Thanks again for the help.
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
First off thanks for replying. Second that is for everything. I am a big craigslist believer and eBay user. Our kids really want a lot of bass if you can hear the words that is just icing on the top. Football, Powerlifting and track is what I coach. Thanks again for the help.
Okay, that will help, as it will be much easier to get something used that will work for you. Since you have not said what sources you will want to be able to play, I am going to assume that you want to play CDs and radio and nothing else. If you want to play something else, let us know, and I may modify my advice.


I recommend looking at professional speakers that are designed for filling large rooms with sound. Typically, such speakers are very efficient, so they take little power to drive them, so that you will not need to spend so very much on amplification. Most likely, you will end up with speakers with horn tweeters and large woofers. Since you will be buying used, it is a bit difficult to give specific recommendations, especially on your tight budget. You will want to be open to almost any brand, as long as it does the job.

There are also similar speakers that are made for home use, and I would not rule them out. Basically, you want something with a big woofer that plays loud and is relatively inexpensive and probably quite efficient.

Select the speakers first (unless you can find a whole system that fills your need). If you have selected very efficient 8 ohm speakers, then you can look on Craig's List, thrift stores, etc., for a receiver that is inexpensive, and a CD player that is inexpensive. In my area, it is easy to get a used CD carousel changer for about $30 at thrift stores, and that is what I recommend you buy. You can sometimes get a receiver for a similar amount of money, though you may need to spend a little more.

With such a system, you could plug in other sources as well. For example, with an adapter wire (that is cheap), you can plug an Ipod into an ordinary stereo and listen to it.

If you were not half way across the country from me (and if it also did not violate forum rules to sell in this forum), I would be able to sell you something that would probably work for you well under budget. I expect that you will be able to find something that will work for your needs.


If you want the sound volume to be more even in the room, you might want to go with more than one pair of speakers. The problem with that, though, is that not only will it cost more to get more speakers, you will also be buying long speaker wires and will need to run them such that people won't trip on them or otherwise disturb them.

Speaker wire can be had cheaply at large hardware stores, or places like:

http://www.monoprice.com

Whatever you do, as long as the gauge of the wire is large enough, try to spend as little as possible on the wire. For advice on wire gauge, see:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

For interconnects between the CD player and receiver, use whatever comes with the CD player, or the cheapest interconnects at monoprice (if you order speaker wire from them).

Once you get the system, ideally you will leave the grills on the speakers to help protect them from damage. It would be good if you could mount them up near the ceiling for the same reason, plus it will not be quite as loud for the people below them and it will more evenly spread the sound in the room, as there won't be people blocking the sound by standing in front of them.
 
W

Wchilds

Audiophyte
So in a nut shell you are saying get the best biggest speakers that I can find correct? Now as far as a receiver are we talking like a 5.1 surround sound system or just a stereo receiver? Right now we have a shelf system that is pushing the speakers that came with them and they are mounted about 7 foot above the floor and wire runs to all four corners of the room. Is there any special way to hook up the four speakers? I am in Central Texas if I am aloud to say that. Thanks again for all the help.
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
So in a nut shell you are saying get the best biggest speakers that I can find correct?

No, not exactly. They will almost certainly be big, but you are not getting them because they are big. You want something that is very efficient, and can play loud. Little speakers typically are not terribly efficient, but being big does not automatically make the speaker efficient or capable of playing loud.

Usually (though not always), you will be better off with horn tweeters for high volume with a low price, and with large woofers (think at least 12", but probably 15"). But you are not wanting them because they have horns and large woofers; you are wanting something that is efficient and can produce a lot of bass. So the best choice might not be the biggest you can afford, but it will almost certainly be big.

I recommend looking for efficiency of at least 95 dB @ 1 meter @ 1 watt. A higher efficiency, such as 100 dB @ 1 meter @ 1 watt would be better, if all else is equal. And there are speakers that are even more efficient than that.

The reason for the interest in efficiency is that to get the same volume level from two speakers, if one is 90 dB @ 1 meter @ 1 watt, and the other is 100 dB @ 1 meter @ 1 watt, it will take 10 times the power to get the same volume from the less efficient speaker (90 dB @ 1 M @ 1 W) as you would get from the more efficient speaker (100 dB @ 1 M @ 1 W). It takes 10 times the power to raise the volume 10 dB. So with a speaker that is 90 dB @ 1M @ 1W, it will be 100 dB @ 1M @ 10W, and 110 dB @ 1M @ 100W, and 120 dB @ 1M @ 1000W [assuming that the speaker can handle the power, which most cannot handle anywhere near that kind of power; also, there tends to be some "compression" of the sound as one pushes a speaker to its limits, so one will typically not get quite as much volume as the idealized theoretical amount].

As for bass, you will not need the speaker to have the deepest bass; you are looking for loud bass. Very often, professional speakers designed for auditorium use do not go as deep as full range home high fidelity speakers, but they do tend to be able to play the bass that they can reproduce quite loudly. It will probably be best to judge this by hearing the speakers, rather than by going by some number for bass response, but remember this: If you are listening in a room that is much smaller than the one you are going to be using them in, they will typically need to play much louder in the little room than the volume you are wanting in the larger room. So if you go to someone's home to listen to their speakers that they are selling, if their room is an ordinary size, you will probably want the speakers to be able to play so loud that it is painful, while still being clear and undistorted. (Don't listen to them long like that, as you can damage your hearing that way.)


Now as far as a receiver are we talking like a 5.1 surround sound system or just a stereo receiver?

For your application, you probably want just a stereo receiver.


now we have a shelf system that is pushing the speakers that came with them and they are mounted about 7 foot above the floor and wire runs to all four corners of the room. Is there any special way to hook up the four speakers? I am in Central Texas if I am aloud to say that. Thanks again for all the help.

Most stereo receivers have connections for two sets of speakers, an "A" pair and a "B" pair. Just hook up the four speakers to the terminals on the receiver, and select both "A" and "B" to play all four speakers. You will be getting the same sound from both the A and B speakers, though the right and left will still be different with a stereo source, as they should be.

If you are buying two pairs of speakers to use, you probably want to make sure that they are 8 ohms nominally, and that the receiver can handle 4 ohm loads, because two sets of 8 ohm speakers wired in parallel, which is the most common way, and the best way, will present a 4 ohm load to the receiver.

Also, if you are going to use two pairs of speakers, if you want them to be the same loudness as each other, you will want them to be the same efficiency. Most likely, you will want two pairs of identical speakers, but since you are buying used, that might be difficult to obtain. A slight difference in efficiency might be okay, if you do not mind one pair being slightly louder than the other pair. Keep that in mind when deciding which speakers go where. You might want to try them out on the floor before you mount them, just in case someone made an error in their efficiency claims.

Also, if the speakers you buy are efficient enough, you might be able to simply continue using your shelf system. How efficient is efficient enough is something that is impossible for me to say, as I do not know the exact acoustics of your room, and I do not know exactly how loud you want the sound to be.
 
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W

Wchilds

Audiophyte
Thanks for all the replys and please keep them coming with suggestions. Will yall have a problem if I start posting what I am looking at buying and then steering me in the right direction. Thanks
 
W

Wchilds

Audiophyte
Mitsibishis Big, loud, clear, stereo speakers. In wonderful condition. Screens in very good shape. 12 inch woofers and 8 ohms 100 watts.
Would these be a good start? Thanks Again ;)
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
Mitsibishis Big, loud, clear, stereo speakers. In wonderful condition. Screens in very good shape. 12 inch woofers and 8 ohms 100 watts.
Would these be a good start? Thanks Again ;)
What is their efficiency? If you knew the model number, you could search online for information about them to help you decide if they were worth going to audition.

You don't have to know the efficiency of the speaker, but if you don't know the efficiency, you will want to know the power output of the amplifier driving them when you listen to them, because you want to know what you need in order to get them to play as loud as you want them to play.
 
W

Wchilds

Audiophyte
Ok so I think I have found speakers and a reciever would yall tell me what you think please and any suggestions about how to set up and type of wire to use. The speakers will be about 30 to 40 feet from the reciver in corners of the weight room.

The speakers
Meticulously cared for 1985 Pioneer CS-705 Speakers. They are 4 way speakers, each with a massive 16” woofer, 4.75” mid, hone type tweeter and horn-loaded ribbon type super tweeter. Each speaker has a power indicator light on the front, and a frequency response of 20 Hz to 40,000 Hz. Maximum music power is 200 W. Sensitivity 98dB / (at 1-meter distance). They weigh 44 lbs each and are 18” wide, 28” high and 11” deep. I don’t know of a single mark on them. I have the original operating guide for them. They look good and produce great sound.

The Reciever is a Kenwood KR-A5020 200 watts 120v 60hz with remote
Thanks again for the help.
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
Ok so I think I have found speakers and a reciever would yall tell me what you think please and any suggestions about how to set up and type of wire to use. The speakers will be about 30 to 40 feet from the reciver in corners of the weight room.

The speakers
Meticulously cared for 1985 Pioneer CS-705 Speakers. They are 4 way speakers, each with a massive 16” woofer, 4.75” mid, hone type tweeter and horn-loaded ribbon type super tweeter. Each speaker has a power indicator light on the front, and a frequency response of 20 Hz to 40,000 Hz. Maximum music power is 200 W. Sensitivity 98dB / (at 1-meter distance). They weigh 44 lbs each and are 18” wide, 28” high and 11” deep. I don’t know of a single mark on them. I have the original operating guide for them. They look good and produce great sound.

The Reciever is a Kenwood KR-A5020 200 watts 120v 60hz with remote
Thanks again for the help.
Those speakers should work well. I currently happen to have a pair of Pioneer CS-703 speakers, which play loud and can produce a lot of bass. I believe yours are the replacement model for mine, and are probably quite similar. If you are mounting them near the ceiling, you might want to put them upside down, so that the tweeters will be closer to ear level, and the bass will be more reinforced by proximity to the ceiling.

The Kenwood KR-A5020, I believe, puts out 80 watts per channel (you appear to be listing the power it uses, though that would mean that it must be very efficient if the information I found is correct, and if what you are listing is found near the power cord on the back).

That should be enough power to play quite loud. In any case, if when you turn up the volume, things start to sound distorted, turn it down until the distortion goes away. Also, if the last light on the speakers light up, turn it down. That feature, though I find unattractive, is actually quite useful to help prevent one from overdriving the speakers. If it sounds distorted before the last light comes on, you could, if you wanted to play it louder, get a more powerful amplifier to use with those speakers.

For wire, read this:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

There is a chart that discusses gauge, and plenty of information to help keep you from being suckered into buying "magic" wires.


Anyway, I think you have done quite well in your choice of speakers. At your price point and for your purpose, you could not reasonably expect to do any better.
 
W

Wchilds

Audiophyte
Pyrrho, thanks for all the help. I will let you know how it all turns out.
 

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