Purchasing New SUB Need some advice.

[quiksr20]

He had problems with one of his neighbors a little while back and that is why the sub is located where it is. He's looking for more output without the help of room gain.

The SVS and HSU would be on my short list in his situation and then just keep an eye on what it's set at.

T

Yes I am in a Condo and I did have problems with the neighbors but since I moved the sub everything has been great. We exhcanged numbers and let them know if theres ever a prob to call.

These 2 are both nice subs.

HSU - VTF-2 MK 3
SVS - PB10-NSD

I will purchasing one soon that wont be able to be played to its full potential late but in the day time i havent had any issues than again these both will probaly be much more capable then what i currently have.

If I go with the SVS theres no x-over adjustment and I will have to figure out how to adjust it from within the receiver. I remember the bass mgmnt settings are a little strange.

 

[Halon451]

Quick question for you, Since you own a PB12.. In my Condo I can play it loud but not reference levels. Will the PB12 play everything not neccesarily louder but better than the PB10?

Im looking into all subs mentioned at this point but still contemplating PB10 or PB12.

Going fwd I will be checking out all the above.

Im sure any sub listed in here will put the KSW to shame and back!

I think someone already beat me to the answer, but if you calibrate your system properly, either the PB10 or PB12 will work swiftly within the parameters of the settings and levels you choose - probably without so much as breaking a sweat. But that's a good thing. Better to have more than you need and not push it, than have less of what you need and drive it past it's limitations. The 12 obviously has a lower end frequency response than the 10, so it will hit the lower notes more easily. The PB10 may be a tad "quicker", due to it's relative driver size (maybe someone here can back me up or correct me), but either one will still provide very comfortable low end response for your system overall.

I have my PB12 adjusted about 4 dB 'hot' - meaning I have it adjusted about 4 dB above reference level, for that added kick and punch during action scenes. Let me tell you... I watched 'The Kingdom' not long ago on DVD - the explosions literally hit me in the chest. That is one bada** sub, no doubt about it.

I'd really like to hear the Hsu's at some point - they get recommended nearly as often as the SVS around here, and I am sure they are every bit as fantastic as the SVS line.

 

[Davemcc]

Cool I am looking into this sub now.. Any Pros & Cons to a downfiring vs front firing sub etc?

I like the fact that the HSU is a 12 vs a 10 ( no scientific reasoning )

The only advantage to a front firing sub that I can see is that at extreme spl, the driver firing right towards you would give you more direct impact, that feel the wind generated by the driver feel. But that's not your listening level in your situation, so no, I see no advantage of one over the other.

From my perspective, owning a PB12-Plus and a Hsu STF-3, I would choose the Hsu in your situation. I find the Hsu driver more tightly controlled than the SVS and it would be my choice for a music only system. Having said that, 1) the SVS is still an awesome sub but just doesn't seem to offer the same tightness, or clarity, that the Hsu does, and 2) the Hsu still performs admirably as a home theater sub. That's simply my subjective evaluation of my two subs which, granted, are two different models from what you are considering.

Relating this to your situation, where max spl is not a factor, I would choose the Hsu for it's tight, smooth, well controlled dynamics. Because spl is not a factor, you can run the VTF2-MK3 in it's maximum extension mode and still get solid response down to 18Hz without worrying that you may have given up some spl to achieve it.

A final subjective note on the Hsu, mine is a real trooper especially for it's cost. It simply does everything it's asked, very well and leaves little if anything wanting.

 

[quiksr20]

Awesome guys, I cant wait to purchase the new sub. Mine has a problem with the RCA Connections and it cuts in and out unless you jiggle the wire and it is so annoying esp when an explosion sets in and you just realized the sub is not even on..

I wish I could demo both but, at this point both are going to be a huge improvement.

 

[Halon451]

Awesome guys, I cant wait to purchase the new sub. Mine has a problem with the RCA Connections and it cuts in and out unless you jiggle the wire and it is so annoying esp when an explosion sets in and you just realized the sub is not even on..

I wish I could demo both but, at this point both are going to be a huge improvement.

From what I understand the Hsu's are much better for music, and the SVS subs are much better for Home Theater, for the reasons Dave mentioned. I use my SVS for mostly HT (movies and TV), and some music, but I can't complain about it's ability to handle music sources at all - it does very well, maybe not as good as the Hsu, but I'd have to do a side by side comparison to be sure. For movies though - my SVS kills.

 

[Davemcc]

Don't get me wrong, the SVS is still an awesome sub. I keep my SVS in my main system which is 70/20/10 music/tv/movies and I'm happy with it's performance with music as well as HT. I currently use the Hsu in my bedroom system, but I have directly compared them in the same room. I'm just suggesting that in the OP's situation where SQ is the key factor and spl is not an issue, the Hsu is my suggested choice and even then, it's a hair-splitting decision. Believe me, I'm not attempting to bash the SVS in any way. It's my choice for my main system. But the budget and the expected usage of the sub, in my mind, lead directly to the Hsu.

 

[Alex2507]

how to adjust it from within the receiver. I remember the bass mgmnt settings are a little strange.

I've got the same receiver and just thought I would say that the bass management is actually pretty good. I think they call it a multiple variable cross over. If you need help with it, I might be able to help.

I'll also say that my vote would go for the Hsu. I think it was Davecc that said some things about it that I've heard elsewhere.

 

[quiksr20]

Cool Ill tell you guys I do about 55% HT/XB360 5.1 and 45% Music

I've got the same receiver and just thought I would say that the bass management is actually pretty good. I think they call it a multiple variable cross over. If you need help with it, I might be able to help.

I'll also say that my vote would go for the Hsu. I think it was Davecc that said some things about it that I've heard elsewhere.

At first the SVS was one of my only choices and im glad you guys let me know about the HSU, Now I am definitly interested in it and actually leaning
towards it.

Alex,

I would definitely want to pick your brain on some crossover questions.. With the SVS the only settings can be made on the receiver, On the HSU it appears you can adjust at the sub as well..

Is it a better practice to use your receiver to do the adjustments? In my receiver I have never really been able to fully understand the SUB Settings. Is there a way to adjust it by Hz.

Most were saying that you could just do it by the size but the options on the SUB section threw me off.

Mostly im just not understanding it and that’s probably half the problem.

 

[Kolia]

The "size" option is fairly straight forward where below a given frequency, ALL signal from all the "small" speakers are routed to the sub only. A "large" speaker will get to keep it's own bass signal.

With the frequency settings I see on the picture it looks like you can select below what frequency the signal gets sent to the sub. Select whatever frequency according to how low each speaker can go.

Then on the sub, make sure its own xover is either defeated or set at a frequency HIGHER than the highest frequency selected on the receiver. Otherwise, you'd endup with a soundless gap in your setup.

Others can chime in with info specific to your receiver.

 

[Halon451]

I'm not sure about the SVS PB10 NSD, but the PB12 does have a crossover adjust on the plate amp. However, with the receiver's built in crossover, this point is moot anyway, as you don't want to cascade the filtering by trying to incorporate both. This could lead to undesirable phasing issues, etc.

Whichever sub you buy, you'll want to make sure the sub's crossover is either bypassed completely, or adjusted to its max setting, so that you only have to use the receiver's setting to adjust the crossover frequency to its appropriate value, dependent upon your speakers' FR.

 

[quiksr20]

Cool,

Couple of last minute questions ( you guys are great! )

Is 100Hz good for my fronts or should they be at 80Hz? I put a link to the specs below..

Mains are Klipsch SB3's [ 8' woofer ]
http://www.klipsch.com/products/discontinued/details/sb-3.aspx

Center is Klipsch SC1 [ 5.25 x2 woofer ]
http://www.klipsch.com/products/details/sc-1.aspx

One last concern is, With the size of these subs they will stick out from the
wall considerably If i need to pull it out from the wall. The SVS should be fine
since its port is in the front. How much room behind the sub to the wall is
recomended on a sub like the VTF2 MK3 ?

Thanks again guys, Everytime I read / post on this forum my rig gets better and better sounding!

 

[Alex2507]

Alex,

I would definitely want to pick your brain on some crossover questions.. With the SVS the only settings can be made on the receiver, On the HSU it appears you can adjust at the sub as well..

Is it a better practice to use your receiver to do the adjustments? In my receiver I have never really been able to fully understand the SUB Settings. Is there a way to adjust it by Hz.

Most were saying that you could just do it by the size but the options on the SUB section threw me off.

Mostly im just not understanding it and that’s probably half the problem.

On that screen set your LFE to surrounds and the sounds below 100hz will be put out by your sub. On the SIZE screen make sure everything is set to small with SUB set to just sub. The way it is set now you are missing any info in between 80hz-100hz being sent to your surrounds.

Set your subwoofer to LFE as opposed to normal as this will bypass the sub's crossover.

Once that is out of the way the Channel Adjust settings are going to make the biggest improvement to sound. Forget about the E-Z Set thing and get an Analog SPL Meter from Radio Shack for less than $50.

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103668&cp=&sr=1&origkw=sound+level+meter&kw=sound+level+meter&parentPage=search

The HK manual makes it sound like the E-Z Set thing has you covered but believe me, this is a huge improvement.

 

[Halon451]

One last concern is, With the size of these subs they will stick out from the wall considerably If i need to pull it out from the wall. The SVS should be fine since its port is in the front. How much room behind the sub to the wall is recomended on a sub like the VTF2 MK3 ?

With the SVS you're looking at about two feet from the wall, possibly a few inches more. Mine runs just over two feet without affecting the bend radius of the subwoofer cable/power cable beyond it's limit.

 

[quiksr20]

With the SVS you're looking at about two feet from the wall, possibly a few inches more. Mine runs just over two feet without affecting the bend radius of the subwoofer cable/power cable beyond it's limit.

Gotcha now from what im seeing the port on the HSU is towards the back and would have to be further from the wall than the SVS.

I can cover the 2 ft no problem any further and it will start to poke out way
past my audio rack/shelf.

 

[quiksr20]

On that screen set your LFE to surrounds and the sounds below 100hz will be put out by your sub. On the SIZE screen make sure everything is set to small with SUB set to just sub. The way it is set now you are missing any info in between 80hz-100hz being sent to your surrounds.

Set your subwoofer to LFE as opposed to normal as this will bypass the sub's crossover.

Once that is out of the way the Channel Adjust settings are going to make the biggest improvement to sound. Forget about the E-Z Set thing and get an Analog SPL Meter from Radio Shack for less than $50.

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103668&cp=&sr=1&origkw=sound+level+meter&kw=sound+level+meter&parentPage=search

The HK manual makes it sound like the E-Z Set thing has you covered but believe me, this is a huge improvement.

Alex,

I set my levels but with the REMOTE. I will purchase a Radio shack meter to perfect them more.

What about info sent to my mains below 100hz? Will that be also sent to my sub when it is set to surrounds?

I dont know if the KSW has the LFE Setting but im not keeping that sub anyway ( that is a setting on the sub right? )

Sorry if some of this stuff is basics im new to all this. As in doing it the right way

 

[Halon451]

Gotcha now from what im seeing the port on the HSU is towards the back and would have to be further from the wall than the SVS.

I can cover the 2 ft no problem any further and it will start to poke out way
past my audio rack/shelf.

Well, with either one - I wasn't speaking lightly when I said butter your girl up before it arrives. She will freak when she sees the size of the box these things come in, it's borderline ridiculous.

 

[Alex2507]

Alex,

I set my levels but with the REMOTE. I will purchase a Radio shack meter to perfect them more.

What about info sent to my mains below 100hz? Will that be also sent to my sub when it is set to surrounds?

I dont know if the KSW has the LFE Setting but im not keeping that sub anyway ( that is a setting on the sub right? )

Sorry if some of this stuff is basics im new to all this. As in doing it the right way

The mains being set to 80hz should set the crossover point for them at 80hz. All the info for them below 80hz will go to the sub. I think. I've had my AVR 430 for about 3 years and still go through the manual periodically. The manual should have a 1-800 number and you might ask them for a definite answer. All my speakers can do 80hz so that is where they are all set. That's why I'm fuzzy on the answer.

LFE is a setting on the sub. It just by passes the sub's crossover allowing the .1 to come through in all it's glory and then you only end up using the crossover in your receiver avoiding something called cascade effect. I'm fuzzy on that too but it's not good and you end up with it when 2 crossovers are used on the same signal.

Everybody has a beginning so there's no need to apologize. If you click on my user name and pull up my profile you can see all the threads I started. There are some relating to sub's and LFE. I'm not exactly the brightest bulb around here but do have the same receiver and will also recommend that you use fiber optic to connect your audio so that you can get Dolby Digital. Then you can use the Night setting aka Dynamic Range Control to further keep from driving your neighbors crazy. It took me 2 years to figure that one out.

 

[Davemcc]

Gotcha now from what im seeing the port on the HSU is towards the back and would have to be further from the wall than the SVS.

I can cover the 2 ft no problem any further and it will start to poke out way
past my audio rack/shelf.

You can turn the Hsu so that the narrow side is parallel to the wall and the ports won't face the wall at all. You can keep it from intruding on your living space that way. Ultimately, sub placement will depend a bit on trial and error to find the perfect spot for your taste and situation.

 

[quiksr20]

Thanks Guys, Tax returns should be here soon and this will be my treat to myself.. No more jiggling wires and boomy muddy bass

 

[Halon451]

Prepare yourself for an amazing treat...