Purchased HK 347, questioning decision.

[dspears2]

Hi Guys,

I have really enjoyed all of the info from forum in the last few days. I listened to the stuff at best buy, and was about ready to pull the trigger on the synergy F-3 surround system. Got to talking to another customer, he was telling me about a store in the Raleigh area that carried the reference series. Anyway those guys were great to deal with today. Orderd the rf 82 system with 52 ctr channer spkr and 52 rears with 10" sub. Trying to keep this short. I read as much as possible about the hdmi 1.1 and 1.3 and ended up buying the HK avr 347 on JR last night for 529. Best buy was out and theirs was still over 800. Everyone says that the Klipsch don't need that much power. Just wondering if anyone has experience with both receivers. This system will be for HT and just music. I have a lifestyle 48 in my upstairs den, (I know, I know, Bose, but my wife likes the clean look). This downstairs system will replace a nice old pair of Polk RT-12b and Carver 2 channel amp that I jam with. I guess I am rambling, but just wondering if I shold have spent the extra 300 for the Onkyo. Any help will be appreciated. My room for this about 18 x 25. For now I am just going with 5.1. Looking forward to your input. Thanks in advance for your help, what a great site...

David

 

[Alex2507]

The HK stuff can be had for a little less at this site. You can see what this one ends up selling for.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Harman-Kardon-HK-AVR-347-7-1-Home-Theater-Receiver-HDMI_W0QQitemZ170190753098QQihZ007QQcategoryZ14981QQcmdZViewItem

 

[Seth=L]

Which Onkyo are you talking about? The TX-SR805?

The H/K should be fine with the Klipsch, and I wouldn't power Bose with anything more than a $150 Insignia receiver because they don't need anymore than that.

 

[dspears2]

Yes, the 805. Saw that it was 1.3 hdmi, but from what I am reading, that probably does not matter. The bose is the 48, it is all in one. dvd, sub amp etc. It sounds ok, my wife likes it because it is out of the way and simple to operate. I would have never forked out 4000 for that system. I purchased a lifestyle 35 6 or 7 years ago, had some problems with it and they basically allowed what I had paid for it against the new one. I don't really care for the bose stuff. You live and learn. For 4000, I can put together something that sounds 5 times better.

Thanks for the input.
d

 

[Neigel]

The receivers from Harmon Kardon have a fairly bad track record when it comes to overall reliability. The 805 does have 1.3a but the real difference to me would be the burr brown dacs and audessey mic. Which is a bit better than HKs. Onkyo for the extra cash I think is a good bet.

 

[Sesquipedalian]

The thing that makes me hesitate with Onkyo is comments from pro reviews about the video performance in models below the 875 model.

 

[Seth=L]

The DACs won't be much if any different. H/K uses good DACs in their receivers.

 

[Addy]

ouch i guess i really have to replace thouse bose.....its sucks that im using a 3808ci to power them

 

[dspears2]

I appreciate all of the comments guys. The HK came in today, speakers should be available for pickup friday. I think that I will probably try the HK, If I don't like it, will sell and get the onk. I am enjoying all the info on the site...thanks.

 

[Alex2507]

The DACs won't be much if any different. H/K uses good DACs in their receivers.

And the word on the street is that their amp sections rock. One thing for sure is that they weigh a ton.

 

[Greywolf00]

I have the HK avr 347 and for the price I think it's a great buy. Great sound quality.

 

[PENG]

And the word on the street is that their amp sections rock. One thing for sure is that they weigh a ton.

This thing has become a myth! I think HKs weigh a ton because of their relatively bigger power supplies needed to rate their amps ACD. If you read some of the available lab measured data you will see that their amp sections (purely from power output standpoint) do not rock at all. It is $ per W, using real watts verfied by lab measurements that counts. Compare the lab measurements data of the RX-V659 and a HKAVR330 (yes a little heavier) and see it for yourself. HK products are great, just don't buy them in the belief that for the same money you are getting more power (so call real watts).

 

[Alex2507]

This thing has become a myth! I think HKs weigh a ton because of their relatively bigger power supplies needed to rate their amps ACD. If you read some of the available lab measured data you will see that their amp sections (purely from power output standpoint) do not rock at all. It is $ per W, using real watts verfied by lab measurements that counts. Compare the lab measurements data of the RX-V659 and a HKAVR330 (yes a little heavier) and see it for yourself. HK products are great, just don't buy them in the belief that for the same money you are getting more power (so call real watts).

Party pooper! 10 of my HK watts are better than 20 of your Yammy watts! Actually what I heard is that HK tends to do very well on bench tests compared to their own ratings. I also heard that other manufacturers often fall short of their own ratings.

I now see that spreading rumors might not be beneficial. Using a $/watt comparison sounds fair. I just want to point out that the $ part in HK's case is very variable due to the number of refurb's out there. Holding them to their MSRP would severely skew that figure.

I also want to point out that I'm not in love with HK. It's just a matter of this being the first and only rec' that I have ever owned. Wait a minute, maybe I am in love with HK.

-Alex

 

[Davidt1]

I am still enjoying my 7 year old HK AVR320. I recently bought the entry level AVR146 and found the sound thin and weak compared to the AVR320. Yes, HK does not the best reliability record and they are usually behind other companies in implementing new technologies. However, the sweet sound and particularly logic 7 make the short comings tolerable.

 

[leo1058]

looked at the new Yamaha 663.

 

[PENG]

Party pooper! 10 of my HK watts are better than 20 of your Yammy watts! Actually what I heard is that HK tends to do very well on bench tests compared to their own ratings.

I think 10 HK watts are probably better than 15 or a little more Yammie watts, beyond that you may be stretching a little. You can read the S&V bench tests of the Yammy 657 and the 330 and you will know what I mean. The 330 actual shutdown at 25W during the 2 ch 4 ohm test. May be something went wrong in that test but in general the HK did well in ACD whereas the Yammie did better in 1,2 Ch. This is one reason why I thought HK models have beefier P/S but not necessarily beefier amp sections. If you go with $/W, then the Yammie may be at least as good (better in 5 ch) as HK even in ACD watts.

As you said, it is not beneficial to spread rumor. If you have time to quickly browse through some bench tests, here are some links:

HKAVR330 List price $799
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/assets/download/322004163324.pdf

Yammie 657 List price $550
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/receivers/863/yamaha-rx-v657-digital-surround-receiver-page3.html

Yammie 661 List price $550
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/receivers/2276/test-bench-yamaha-rx-v661-av-receiver.html

Yammie 659 Price $399
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/receivers/yamaha-rx-v659/rx-v659-measurements-analysis

Yammie 2600 List price $1400
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/receivers/1497/test-bench-for-shootout-three-mid-price-av-receivers-page3.html

HKAVR630 List price $1299
http://hometheatermag.com/receivers/804hk/

Denon AVR3805 List price $1199
http://hometheatermag.com/receivers/804denon/index2.html

I wish they all specify their watts the way HK does, that will make it easier to compare, without having to search out those bench tests and then calculate the $/W. I love HK products as well and I almost bought the 7200. I have not yet seen any receiver more powerful than the HK7200 and 7300, except for the Yammie, Denon, Onkyo flagships. At the moment though, I would like to know more about their recent reliability rating/track record, especially knowing where they are made now.

 

[Alex2507]

Thanks for the links. I will read those. The HK that shut down driving a 4 ohm speaker should never have been driving a 4 ohm speaker. What kind of test is that? Correct me if I'm wrong (and that's been happening a lot lately) but I thought they were rated for 8 ohm.

Edit: I just looked at a couple of those tests and now see that it's just done that way, the 4 ohm thing. It's live and learn for my kind.

You have made my point about the price thing though. That AVR630 listed for $1299 is crazy. A friend of mine bought a 635 (newer) for under $500 a couple of years ago. The current HK flagship AVR745 can be had for around $900. It however does not have the power of the old AVR7300 which is now in the $600-$700 range due to not having HDMI.

The links are greatly appreciated.

BTW the HK watts was a joke. I'm sure you got that.

-Alex

 

[PENG]

You have made my point about the price thing though. That AVR630 listed for $1299 is crazy. A friend of mine bought a 635 (newer) for under $500 a couple of years ago. The current HK flagship AVR745 can be had for around $900. It however does not have the power of the old AVR7300 which is now in the $600-$700 range due to not having HDMI.

When I said I almost bought the AVR7200, I meant from the states. I changed my mind mainly because I was told by the HK distributor in Montreal that I would be on my own if I needed warranty service. Take a look (search for) at our prices here in Canada you will know how lucky you guys are in the U.S.

http://www.futureshop.ca/catalog/proddetail.asp?logon=&langid=EN&sku_id=0665000FS10086972&catid=10551

The list price of the AVR745 in Canada was C$3699. Futureshop.ca apparently had them on clearance for C$1699 last summer, but that was a rare event.

I would suggest to anyone in the U.S. to consider HK as a viable alternative to Yamaha and Denon because chances are good that they will get the same $/watt (real watt) due to the excellent price they get for HK products.

 

[Alex2507]

Take a look (search for) at our prices here in Canada you will know how lucky you guys are in the U.S.

I'm a Canadian citizen. It cost me $25 to become one. That's the only thing I got for cheap up there.

 

[mouettus]

The only thing I like about HK is their multiple crossover. I would LOVE to set 60hz for my mains and 80hz for my surrounds. I wonder why you don't see that anywhere else. My 1300$ RX-V1800 should have it.

Looks and sound is pretty good though but you can only enjoy it until it breaks Do you know of any other company that opened an online store only for their refurbs?