Pioneer Elite SC-05 Pre Out Line Voltage

bandphan

bandphan

Banned
The preouts on my 82 using a 1khz sine signal started to clip just over 2v @0dbu using the Oscilloscope on TrueRTA, so the 1.5v stated is correct :)
 
P

photoeye

Audioholic
The preouts on my 82 using a 1khz sine signal started to clip just over 2v @0dbu using the Oscilloscope on TrueRTA, so the 1.5v stated is correct :)
thanks for taking the time to measure ;)

I assume your channel level is 0dB? With this measurement,
your Volume Indicator is displaying 0dB?

Have a great 4th! :D
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
thanks for taking the time to measure ;)

I assume your channel level is 0dB? With this measurement,
your Volume Indicator is displaying 0dB?

Have a great 4th! :D
Thanks you too. Yes there is no trim applied to the channel level.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
The preouts on my 82 using a 1khz sine signal started to clip just over 2v @0dbu using the Oscilloscope on TrueRTA, so the 1.5v stated is correct :)
That gives non existent headroom. It is those sort of issues that make me run like the plague from consumer receivers. Thanks for the measurements. That is the sort of issues that should be revealed by reviews. If we don't get away from this feature driven mentality, we will get that sort of sloppy practice layered on layer.

In my view all pre amp stages need 6 db of headroom and preferably 10 db.
 
P

photoeye

Audioholic
That is the sort of issues that should be revealed by reviews.
unfortunately, I have never seen an AVR professional review that talks
about the line pre-out. only the output power/SQ of it's internal amps.

emotiva support mentioned a good pre should be able to swing 10V.

I'll settle with bumping my channel levels from 0dB to +6dB and forget I ever did it. :eek:
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
unfortunately, I have never seen an AVR professional review that talks
about the line pre-out. only the output power/SQ of it's internal amps.

emotiva support mentioned a good pre should be able to swing 10V.

I'll settle with bumping my channel levels from 0dB to +6dB and forget I ever did it. :eek:
It is also possible that my soundcard clipped before the preouts, i was using my laptop not my desktop. My desktop is currently measuring other gear in my HO. The other thing that i didnt mention on my amp, is that it has selectable input voltages or .75 and 2.5 for gain compensation:eek:
 
T

tcarcio

Audioholic General
The preouts on my 82 using a 1khz sine signal started to clip just over 2v @0dbu using the Oscilloscope on TrueRTA, so the 1.5v stated is correct :)
Did you happen to measure the lfe out?
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
Did you happen to measure the lfe out?
no, but i can later.

Edit: form an unmeasured stand point the pioneer is higher than my yama (based on dual subs and signal split)
 
Last edited:
Lordoftherings

Lordoftherings

Banned
That is the sort of issues that should be revealed by reviews. If we don't get away from this feature driven mentality, we will get that sort of sloppy practice layered on layer.

In my view all pre amp stages need 6 db of headroom and preferably 10 db.
+1 :) Absolutely correct. Large headroom is quite important, even more today than yesterday.
 
G

Gov

Senior Audioholic
10v??? Forget just about any A/V receiver. You need a good stand alone pre-amp processor then.
 
Lordoftherings

Lordoftherings

Banned
10v??? Forget just about any A/V receiver. You need a good stand alone pre-amp processor then.
And even then... ;)

But some of the best receivers (usually flagship models) have about 5 to 6 Volts unclipped output voltage from their pre-outs. Not too bad, I'll say. :)
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
10v??? Forget just about any A/V receiver. You need a good stand alone pre-amp processor then.
10v isnt what TLS was saying, he was refering to the point of clipping and that wouldnt be equal 10v anyway.
 
Warpdrv

Warpdrv

Audioholic Ninja
That seems to be exactly what one would expect from a line out
Have you measured the XLR pre-out voltage from the Marantz 8003, or do you know what it is?
I didn't seem to see that info documented.
 
WaynePflughaupt

WaynePflughaupt

Audioholic Samurai
Since figures seems to be hard to come by, I recently came up with what I think/hope is a reasonably viable method to measure the peak voltage output of a receiver or pre-amp. Maybe the more electronically inclined here can comment.

It’s based on the premise that a 0 dBFS signal is the hottest that we’ll ever get from our digital programming media and playbackcomponents.

The first thing needed is a 60 Hz sine wave signal. It shouldn’t be hard to find sine waves on line somewhere; the BFD Guide at the Home Theater Shack Forum has a link to some.

That’s where I got the sine waves I downloaded, but the level was lower than 0 dBFS. So, I used an audio editing program to increase the level to 0 dBFS (I actually boosted mine to not quite that much: ¼ dB below 0 dBFS). I also used the audio editor to lengthen the sine wave signal to one minute, instead of the 10-15 seconds it originally was.

Next, burn your 60 Hz, 0 dBFS test signal to a CD, so you can play it back through your system. Set your receiver or preamp for basic stereo sound, and bass management for full-range speakers. With my receiver, the only level adjustment in the menu is for the center and surround speakers – i.e., their levels are adjusted around the fixed level of the L/R speakers. Don’t know if this is the case with all receivers and pre-pros, but if your menu has level adjustments for the main left and right speakers, they should be trimmed to the maximum level for this.

Disconnect your speakers, turn the volume all the way up, and start the test signal. At this point you can measure the voltage output of the preamp with a standard VOM set for AC voltage. I suggested the 60 Hz signal because this should get the most accurate measurement; I’m told that VOM’s are typically calibrated @ 60 Hz.

Using this method, I measured 4.4 volts from my Yamaha RX-V1’s preamp outputs, and 8.8 volts from the mono subwoofer output.

I’m no electronics techie so I don’t know how this measurement method compares to vRMS, but it should give you a good idea as to whether or not your receiver can drive a pro-grade amp. Basically compare your voltage reading to a prospective amp’s sensitive spec, which is typically given as volts or volts RMS. My measurements showing a fairly high voltage output for my receiver appears to correspond to the sensitivity rating of the Carvin amp I’m using. It’s rated for 1 volt sensitivity, and I’m running it with the gain controls set below the half-way point.

As noted, I’d appreciate feedback from our electronics-savvy members.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt
 
Last edited by a moderator:
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
Have you measured the XLR pre-out voltage from the Marantz 8003, or do you know what it is?
I didn't seem to see that info documented.
No I measured the unbalanced output, but I can measure the balanced output, but not today as we have guests. If I forget remind me.
 
newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top