Phase issue but no phase switch on Atheena AS-P400

[mech]

Hi Gentlemen,

I have been lurking on this forum for quite awhile, but now I actually need some advice.

First off I do want to say that I enjoy many of the members on here and I chuckle every now and then when I read a good post. Clint seems to always have sensible good advice and I look forward to some input on my setup issue.

So here goes. Basically I have an Athena AS-P400 sub (which has been pretty good for the money), but I recently realized it was out of phase when I hooked it up in my new condo. I just was not getting much bass at all. One of the main issues is that this sub does not have a phase switch. So being the tinkering fool that I am, I hooked it via L and R high-level inputs. That seems to have fixed the phase issue, but now I am curious of how I should set the crossover. I would normally hook this up via low-level and set all my speakers to small and let the receiver handle the crossover duties, but now the receiver shows the towers as (large) and it is making set the crossover. I have the rest of my speakers set to small. I have towers in front (39HZ- 70,000HZ), but my back speakers are bookshelf (50HZ- 70,000HZ). Should I match the towers and loose a bit of information or try to compromise and match everything all around?? Also am I just crazy that I solved the phasing issue by connecting the sub via the high level inputs??

Thank you for all your help and or advice in advance!!

 

[j_garcia]

You will not lose information by setting your mains to small, and with speakers that go to ~40Hz, I would set them to small with an 80Hz or 60Hz x-over.

What x-over did you use on the sub when connected via high level? More likely than not you just have a null or a big dip. Does your receiver have an adjustable x-over? Have you tried the sub in a different location?

 

[mech]

Re:

j_garcia- the mains are greyed out on the receiver and are set to large, I cannot change them to small, now the rest of the speakers I have set them to small. The crossover is not adjustable on the receiver and is set to 120. Hence the reason for my dilemma, I would have major overlap if I set my crossover to 120 for the rest of my speakers, or I would loose information from the small (back) speakers if I set my crossover to match the mains.

By the way, the first setup was (direct in low-level) and set to 120 with all speakers set to small. I did this just to see if I had dips, but I assume that is was out of phase, because now it's got way more bass. WWJG do? LoL..

 

[mulester7]

I have an Athena AS-P400 sub. I hooked it via L and R high-level inputs.

.....Mech, does the sub have high-level L&R "outputs"?.....

 

[mech]

Yes indeed it does.. Why what are you thinking?

 

[mulester7]

Yes indeed it does.. Why what are you thinking?

.....Mech, I've never had a powered sub, only unpowered....but it has been said at this site more than once, that if you take the signals Left and Right from the receiver's "fronts" terminal speaker-wire posts, to the high-level inputs of the powered sub, only the pre-amped signal is taken to the sub's amp, and using the high-level output posts of the sub to go on to the front speakers by speaker-wire, will allow you to use the internal crossover of the sub to glean out the top-cut for the sub you want, and the amplified signals sent on to the front mains will be bottom-cut at the point you choose to top-cut the sub at....clear as mud?....hey, now that we have the info that you have high-level outputs, I'll fade into the background and let some of the powered sub persons at this site take it further....jump in here, you Audioholics powered sub hounds.....

 

[mech]

I just took the B feed off of the receiver and went to the high level inputs, but that is where I am running into the crossover issue.

 

[j_garcia]

What receiver? Do you have your system set to sub=yes, since your mains are not selectable?

Using high level out from the sub does NOT adjust the x-over to the mains on nearly all subs (passive or active). Only the low pass is affected and the high pass is fixed at some point. Using this method assumes the user will adjust the sub to properly blend with whatever mains are used.

 

[mech]

Sony STRDE695 Yes I know shhhh the big S word!! I have been waiting to get a new receiver for HD or Blu ray. Here is the weird part since my mains are stuck to the large setting, if I select yes for the SW the sub does not turn on, but if I select no for the SW the LFE kicks in and works well.

 

[markw]

Talk about bizarre.

if I select yes for the SW the sub does not turn on, but if I select no for the SW the LFE kicks in and works well.

This is exactly the opposite of how it's supposed to work.

 

[mech]

This is exactly the opposite of how it's supposed to work.

LoL I know and that is what completely puzzles me. The only reason I thought to try it with the SW off was just being used to playing with different setups and equipment! haha.

 

[j_garcia]

If you have it connected via high level, it will only work with sub=none because it sends a full range signal to the sub. With sub=yes, it should work via the LFE setting and that should allow you to set your mains to small as well. Fixed at 120Hz sounds high though, even for a Sony because Sony actually has decent bass management on some models.

 

[mulester7]

.....Mech, this may help the discussion and be an answer for you....I would call Athena and inquire if their subs are equipped the same to render front speakers to a "small" setting....this is from an email sent by Tom Vodhanel at SVS....

"The speaker level (binding post) outputs on our subwoofers apply a
highpass crossover to the main speakers. This is a 6dB/octave slope that
is usually centered around 100hz. The exact frequency depends on the
speaker because it is a passive network."

 

[mech]

Thanks for your input guys. I am been further messing around with my settings and now I am dumbfounded. So I went back and set the subwoofer to (yes) and changed my mains to (small). I have little or now bass when I do this, I even set the subs crossover to 120 just to make sure that I am getting the signals. Then when I switch it back to (no sub) and turn the mains to large, I am getting pounding bass from the LFE. Does this make any sense to anyone? LOL...... The difference is trully amazing, it's not one of those things like "I think there might be a little more bass" it's total night and day!! I will call Sony and Athena and see what they say.

 

[j_garcia]

What mode are you listening in? You need to drop in a DVD with good bass and see how it does. There is also a level adjust in the receiver for the sub preamp out volume - see what it is set to. If your receiver has any other pre-outs, you can try one of them to make sure the line level input on the sub is working correctly.

 

[mech]

Hi,

I took all of the compression off as I normally do, and put in "The Incredibles" do to the massive bass. When I hook it up the correct way with "low level" input I don't get much bass at all. Then if I hook it up via the high level inputs I get massive amounts of bass! Could it be that this cheap amp is severaly under powered and was not sending out enough power via the low level output? Oh and I also called Sony and they were not help at all, they basically told me what I already know. I also tried to hook in up to where my mains come into my sub instead of going to my receiver. It works just the same as if I had the mains to the A feed and the sub going to the B feed.

So I guess I am stuck with the setup, but would I be damaging my sub hooking it up this way and it getting all of those frequencies?