OPPO BDP-95 Blu-ray Player First Look

zildjian

zildjian

Audioholic Chief
Here's the first article I've seen with audio output measurements from the new Oppo players.

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/blu-ray-players/1048-oppo-bdp-93-and-bdp-95-universal-3d-blu-ray-players-part-1-audio-performance.html?start=1

I'll post this in both the BDP-93 & 95 threads since it applies to both.

I've been very pleased with the performance of the BDP-95. I've watched a several blu-ray discs on it, but mostly I've been listening to SACD & DVD-A discs via the analog outputs mostly. When I get a new pre-pro, I'll start using the balanced outputs.
 
A

Ausgeflippt

Audiophyte
outdated

Re Davee70
("I've been listening to multichannel audio discs in quad using two stereo units. Works reasonably well, though dated to be sure.")
I do the same thing. Never knew anyone else did this. All Sansui vintage here.Two-channel throughout the house, using G-9000, AU-919, AU-11000, BA/CA F-1interconnected to run multiple pairs of speakers in every room of the house, wired through the walls, across the attic and back down again to banana plug outlets. For surround in the bedroom, the rear RCAs of my Sony SCD-CE595, modified by Tube Research Labs, are plugged into the AU-11000, while the G-9000 runs the fronts. (I do have another amp and speaker set for center, but mostly useless. Most multi-channel "surround sound" SACDs are strictly 4-channel.) The rest of the house is 2-channel, although the sound comes at you from just about everywhere.
This may be dated, but I doubt if it can be beat.
I suspect I will pre-order the BDP-95. I've been following the OPPO stuff for a year now and have waited it out for the second generation "Special Edition."
 
P

PearlcorderS701

Banned
I'm still waiting for the model 90 to be reveiled. Two HDMI outputs would be ideal. One output would connect directly to the TV for watching movies w/o use of a receiver as well as a stellar upconverter (from the Blu-Ray player itself) and the other connected to a receiver with a stellar upconverter. Preferably that would mean HQV, Anchor Bay, and now Marvell. As far as I know, only Pioneer offers Marvell's chip for "big name' receivers. I have not checked Yamaha nad i know as of right now Denon only offers Anchor Bay except for the Realta (HQV) chip in its flagship receiver.

But, alas, all this wil be for "fun" as I already bought Oppo's 83 model last year. Great unit but if only I can see the future.

/sigh
You know, I was in the same camp in believing all the benefits about dual HDMI outs -- I had always thought that separating audio from video is the only way to go so that both signals come though in the most pristine fashion without degradation. So, something about one HDMI port always bugged me on HD gear -- in order to get 1080p and the lossless codecs bitstreamed, you need HDMI, so both these signals would go over one cable to an AVR or processor, where a second HDMI run would go from the AVR or processor to the display to pass the 1080p video. This is how I run my system, but something seems "wrong" about introducing a "passthrough" device like a receiver or processor between the video signal; I understand it's the only way to do it, up until now, but I always worried the video was being compromised before it went to the display doing it this way (even though manufacturers will tell you all about pristine video passthrough and HDMI 1.3-compliant repeaters and such).

Then, Denon and now Oppo introduced players with dual HDMI outs, and the promise of sending both video and audio separately to their respective terminals has been realized -- however, it was quickly explained to me by Oppo's support staff that the point of the HDMI spec was originally so that one cable could carry both audio and video, and they assured me no "loss" is occurring by using one HDMI output from my BDP-83, immediately citing the fact that the dual HDMI outs on their newer 93 and 95 players are in place really for the task of sending 3D video to a new 3D TV, while being able to send "older" HDMI 1.3 audio signals to an HDMI 1.3 receiver/processor...

At any rate, I was one of the late discoverers of the BDP-95, accidentally stumbling upon it when I glanced at their site recently. What intrigues me about the 93 and 95 -- as beyond this I don't really personally require any of these players' features because I am not using any analog connections in my HT, only HDMI for strictly DVD and BD playback -- is the Marvell processor and its advanced Noise Reduction abilities. I had a detailed discussion with Oppo's support team via email about this and they assured me the Marvell processor in these new players far surpasses the Anchor Bay's abilities in the BDP-83, and will destroy it in terms of noise suppression -- this concerned me greatly because Noise Reduction has been a very big selling point to me with players, as I have a large standard DVD collection that requires advanced, aggressive applications of NR for compression artifacts and other anamolies. Plus, there is the upconversion performance to take into consideration -- while good, the VRS Anchor Bay chipset in the BDP-83, I am told, can't hold a candle to what the Marvell processor could do for DVD upscaling, and that's yet another big seller for me.

I just can't afford to upgrade to either of these players right now...
 
goodman

goodman

Full Audioholic
It looks like the 95 is now shipping from Oppo. When will the Audioholics store have the 95 available?
 
goodman

goodman

Full Audioholic
Well, the BDP 95 is apparently now available through the Audioholics store, so I just ordered one. After it arrives, set-up, and compared with the PS3, the PS3 will be relegated to permanent bedroom duty.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Well, the BDP 95 is apparently now available through the Audioholics store, so I just ordered one. After it arrives, set-up, and compared with the PS3, the PS3 will be relegated to permanent bedroom duty.
Haha, I have done a little bit of that myself, and they are both staying on the rack.:D
 
A

Audio Bug

Audiophyte
Oppo BDP-95 or Marantz UD7006?

I was thinking of buying a Marantz UD7006 when I came across this thread. Now I am thinking the Oppo BDP-95 might be a better deal. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
 
L

lobanw

Enthusiast
Although I like the thought of trying new Oppo 95, I have to stick with my trusty model 83, 'cause I am bit short on cash. But nice unit anyway.
 
M

Miketuason

Audioholic Intern
I just ordered the BDP-95 yesterday, can't wait to hook it up.:)
 
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PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I was thinking of buying a Marantz UD7006 when I came across this thread. Now I am thinking the Oppo BDP-95 might be a better deal. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
I have only got about 15 hours on mine and I cannot say its analog sounds better than HDMI to the cheap DACs in the AV7005. However, I can tell you that it DVD upscaling is good, not any sharper than my PS3 but may be a touch more natural looking. Overall I feel good about having some of the best DACs onboard, the good look, quietness, wifi, and the fact that it weighs 16 lbs.
 
M

Miketuason

Audioholic Intern
I have only got about 15 hours on mine and I cannot say its analog sounds better than HDMI to the cheap DACs in the AV7005. However, I can tell you that it DVD upscaling is good, not any sharper than my PS3 but may be a touch more natural looking. Overall I feel good about having some of the best DACs onboard, the good look, quietness, wifi, and the fact that it weighs 16 lbs.
PENG, Audio wise, have you compared between the HDMI and the analog on the BDP-95, are you saying that there's no audible difference? Thanks.

Mike
 
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PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
PENG, Audio wise, have you compared between the HDMI and the analog on the BDP-95, are you saying that there's no audible difference? Thanks.

Mike
Sorry Mike, I can only compare them in 2 channel because I have no desire to invest time and money on multi channel analogs. HDMI via the AV7005 sounds great but subjectively analog sounds better. Objectively speaking the 93 is really a better deal.

I am really not sure if the better DACs makes an audibly better sound but at least I know they theoretically should.
 
M

Miketuason

Audioholic Intern
Sorry Mike, I can only compare them in 2 channel because I have no desire to invest time and money on multi channel analogs. HDMI via the AV7005 sounds great but subjectively analog sounds better. Objectively speaking the 93 is really a better deal.

I am really not sure if the better DACs makes an audibly better sound but at least I know they theoretically should.
Thanks PENG, since I do have the multi chanel analog I'm hoping I made the right decision by going with the BDP-95. Keeping my finger cross hoping that it will sound better than my current PS3 with just the HDMI, I will report back as soon as I have everything hooked up listen to it for a few hours.
 
S

sterling shoote

Audioholic Field Marshall
I like that the 95 has multi channel analog out. I could hook it up to my multi channel analog Sony TA-P9000ES preamp for multi channel playback of virtually any multi channel digital media, and, in particular, multi channel SACD. But, here's what I'm wonderin', I now have a Panasonic BD-80 which has multi channel analog outputs. It does not support multi channel SACD, but, since, it appears, BD may make multi channel SACD obsolete, with multi channel Dolby 5.1 audio only releases, unless I was to already have a collection of multi channel SACD's, buying the 95 to essentially replace my Panasonic BD-80 might be a dumb investment. After all, my Panasonic BD-80 provides a very satisfying audio/video experience. So, overall, could I distinguish the OPPO 95's performance enough from the Panasonic to justify the expense?
 
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PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Thanks PENG, since I do have the multi chanel analog I'm hoping I made the right decision by going with the BDP-95. Keeping my finger cross hoping that it will sound better than my current PS3 with just the HDMI, I will report back as soon as I have everything hooked up listen to it for a few hours.
I look forward to hearing back from you. I do feel it sounds better than the PS3 and it also sounds better in analog than in HDMI with my AV7005. On the other hand I am not sure if the difference is significant enough to justify the $500 premium over the 93. That being said, I have no regret so far.
 
zildjian

zildjian

Audioholic Chief
I've had my BDP-95 since the beginning of February and have been very pleased with it's performance. Is it worth $1000...? depends on the user of course. I think it is, but I have a lot of SACD's and a couple handfuls of DVD-Audio discs, and I plan on using it eventually via balanced outputs to a stereo only rig, but right now am using HDMI to the home theater and analog outs to zone's 2 & 3 for the rest of the house. The BDP-93 would satisfy most users needs just using HDMI, but since the long term goal is to put this in a stereo only rig in a separate room, I wanted the higher quality analog outs.
 
P

PearlcorderS701

Banned
Does anyone know how the BDP-95 fares against the 83 in terms of DVD upconversion?
 
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PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Does anyone know how the BDP-95 fares against the 83 in terms of DVD upconversion?
I don't have the 83 but I have read tons of user reviews/comments to know that they are probably almost the same. As I said before, this DVD upscaling thing has been hyped to the nth degree. Based on my own viewing experience, it is the quality of the transfer itself that has the most impact on the overall PQ. If the transfer is of high quality, most mid range BDP and TV will do well enough that one can hardly discern the difference. If the transfer is of low quality, even the Oppo cannot do anything about it.

I have no doubt, the 83/93 will score better than many other BDPs, but watching real video/movies, I will not bother using my 95 to play DVD as I want to save it for serious SACD/CD listening. Any perceived improvements due to its excellent upscaler is too insignificant for me to pick the Oppo over my other players including the PS3. I will continue to play DVD with my Toshiba XDE500 until it dies, then I will play DVDs with my other BDPs. The Oppo will be used strictly for BR concerts videos, SACD, DVDA, and CD. I know that's just me and I may be bias.
 
P

PearlcorderS701

Banned
Thank you for your viewpoint and feedback to my question here PENG; however, there are a couple of points I would like to discuss with you regarding the elements you bring to the table...:)

I don't have the 83 but I have read tons of user reviews/comments to know that they are probably almost the same. As I said before, this DVD upscaling thing has been hyped to the nth degree. Based on my own viewing experience, it is the quality of the transfer itself that has the most impact on the overall PQ. If the transfer is of high quality, most mid range BDP and TV will do well enough that one can hardly discern the difference. If the transfer is of low quality, even the Oppo cannot do anything about it.
I understand that it's been debated ad nauseum the "benefits" of DVD upscaling and what that entails or doesn't entail, etc. etc...but I must say, to many of us -- me definitely included here -- DVD upconversion is still a very important, judge-worthy aspect of a Blu-ray player's performance due to the large collections many of us still watch on a regular basis. I, for one, was looking for a Blu-ray player before I received the BDP-83 as a holiday present that offered superior DVD upconversion as one of the primary necessities (along with bitstreaming capability for TrueHD and Master Audio) and this was all due to the piss-poor (that's right -- I did type piss-poor because that's exactly what it was, and was confirmed by various sources) DVD performance of my first generation Panasonic DMP-BD10A BD player. So, I don't really agree with your assesment of "...one can hardly discern the difference..." with regard to DVD upconversion -- it is clear that many machines are NOT the same in this area of the game. My Panasonic would render DVD Video discs in 1080p with horrendous artifacting, macro-blocking, aliasing (horrible jagged edges) and an overall almost unwatchable image -- and this was confirmed by sites that reviewed the player and other owners of this model; something in the BD10A's UniPhier processor just didn't do deinterlacing and scaling that good -- to say the least (I may be wrong about the name of the processor -- I think the UniPhier was the one in the BD10A, but at any rate, it sucked).

Thus, I was left with suffering through watching DVDs -- even well mastered ones -- on this player that wasn't upscaling them well at all; sure, some reference video titles on DVD, such as select Superbits from Columbia (Sony) were rendered watchable, but for the most part, DVDs looked TERRIBLE on this player. When I got the Oppo, it took some time, but I began to notice a ridiculous improvement in upconversion performance to 1080p -- gone were the jagged edges on poorly mastered discs, most of the artifacting and block noise (which weren't in the original source, so the Panasonic must have been creating much of this garbage) and other anamolies...

However -- you are correct in stating a poor DVD transfer will be just that, a poor transfer, and no consumer-level DVD playback product is going to be able to miraculously make it look "better." I learned this the hard way when I was looking at notably flawed DVD transfers on the BDP-83, and noticed they didn't look all that much better, as a whole, on this player -- and so I was immediately alarmed and taken aback. It was then explained to me by people that had a lot of experience with Oppo's products and the Anchor Bay processor -- and Oppo themselves -- that the VRS chip wasn't designed to do any "magic acts" in terms of cleaning up bad looking DVDs; it excels at making well mastered titles look nearly like Blu-ray, and in that regard, it succeeds beyond well enough.

But, I just wanted to let you know that there are still some of us out there who value DVD upconversion very much -- and that there are differences between these players and how they handle this, based on their processor guts. :) As such, I wanted to know if anyone had seen any direct, certifiable differences in DVD playback at 1080p between the BDP-83 and the 95...

I have no doubt, the 83/93 will score better than many other BDPs, but watching real video/movies, I will not bother using my 95 to play DVD as I want to save it for serious SACD/CD listening. Any perceived improvements due to its excellent upscaler is too insignificant for me to pick the Oppo over my other players including the PS3. I will continue to play DVD with my Toshiba XDE500 until it dies, then I will play DVDs with my other BDPs. The Oppo will be used strictly for BR concerts videos, SACD, DVDA, and CD. I know that's just me and I may be bias.
I understand; but as I said -- many of us definitely do still use our BD players as DVD players ane require the best performance out of them for this purpose. For what it's worth, I personally don't use the BDP-83 for SACD or CD playback, only DVD and BD video playback, so you and I have different priorities in terms of purpose for these decks. ;)
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
So, I don't really agree with your assesment of "...one can hardly discern the difference..." with regard to DVD upconversion -- it is clear that many machines are NOT the same in this area of the game. My Panasonic would render DVD Video discs in 1080p with horrendous artifacting, macro-blocking, aliasing (horrible jagged edges) and an overall almost unwatchable image -- and this was confirmed by sites that reviewed the player and other owners of this model; something in the BD10A's UniPhier processor just didn't do deinterlacing and scaling that good -- to say the least (I may be wrong about the name of the processor -- I think the UniPhier was the one in the BD10A, but at any rate, it sucked).
Don't disagree with me yet until I have a chance to clarify something. My previous statement of mid range BDP and TV referred to the more current models, such as the latest Samsung edge lit 8000 series TV, C6900 BDP, or even the Pioneer BDP-320, PS3 slim with the latest FW, or even my Samsung P2550 that has the Reon VP in it. I am not saying that my BDP-95 does not do better with DVDs in general, but I am saying that there is not significant difference in PQ that compels me to use it to watch DVDs. In fact 90% of the time I am very happy to use my $89 Toshiba XDE-500 to watch DVD. Regardless of the transfer quality, the Toshiba produces PQ almost as good as the 95, sure that's not based on A/B as I only have one Kuro screen in my HT room. If I compared the 95 to my older players such as my $1500 Denon universal, then yes the Denon's upscaler is not that great, I wouldn't call it piss poor, but I probably should.





When I got the Oppo, it took some time, but I began to notice a ridiculous improvement in upconversion performance to 1080p -- gone were the jagged edges on poorly mastered discs, most of the artifacting and block noise (which weren't in the original source, so the Panasonic must have been creating much of this garbage) and other anamolies...
Try even a PS3 slim, you may be surprise how good it is, watching DVD movies. It won't be as good as your 83, but it will be close.


However -- you are correct in stating a poor DVD transfer will be just that, a poor transfer, and no consumer-level DVD playback product is going to be able to miraculously make it look "better." I learned this the hard way when I was looking at notably flawed DVD transfers on the BDP-83, and noticed they didn't look all that much better, as a whole, on this player -- and so I was immediately alarmed and taken aback. It was then explained to me by people that had a lot of experience with Oppo's products and the Anchor Bay processor -- and Oppo themselves -- that the VRS chip wasn't designed to do any "magic acts" in terms of cleaning up bad looking DVDs; it excels at making well mastered titles look nearly like Blu-ray, and in that regard, it succeeds beyond well enough.
Well at least we are in agreement on this one. I have a few DVD, including newer ones such as 'Finding Neverland' that even Oppo cannot do much about. And then I have a few that can truly compete with some piss poor BRs.

But, I just wanted to let you know that there are still some of us out there who value DVD upconversion very much -- and that there are differences between these players and how they handle this, based on their processor guts. :) As such, I wanted to know if anyone had seen any direct, certifiable differences in DVD playback at 1080p between the BDP-83 and the 95...
I do too, as I have quite a few DVDs in my collection. I also enjoy Netflix and fortunately my Kuro does a decent job upscaling. Again, it is not that I don't value upconversion/scaling. It is just that I find my other players can do the job almost as good as the Oppo. Back to the 83 vs 93, from reviews I read, the 93 scores as well as the 83 in synthetic tests. I doubt one performs better than the other and if you are looking for direct, certifiable differences I am not sure if you will find one. If you do, I hope you would share the information as I would be very curious to know the outcome.


I personally don't use the BDP-83 for SACD or CD playback, only DVD and BD video playback, so you and I have different priorities in terms of purpose for these decks. ;)
Okay I understand. You are right, for me, I actually wish if Oppo would offer a lower cost audio only player. I also would not have bothered with the Oppo had I not replaced my 4308 with the AV7005. The Marantz cannot do MCH SACD and DVDA so I had to do something.
 
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