Onkyo and Pioneer receivers getting Dirac Live

[AcuDefTechGuy]

We both know it is something for something, if Dirac Live charges a higher licensing fees, and if Onkyo wants to maintain or increase profit margin, something else has to go.., just wonder what, may be smaller power supplies, heatsinks, more fans instead, hope not!!

Yeah, if they are keeping cost the same, then something has to go.

It's interesting how Onkyo got rid of Audyssey (I assume to save money), and now wants to add Dirac, which seems to be even more expensive than Audyssey XT32.

But it's popcorn time to see how this unfolds.

I would not mind at all if every single Onkyo and Pioneer AVR has Dirac.

Right now, I think some people think that Dirac must be so awesome since only the $4k-$6K-$10K components have Dirac. But if everyone has access to Dirac, they will know.

Same way with Trinnov. Right now some people think it must be so awesome because it is only available in $10K-$20K components.

If I were Trinnov, I would NOT allow Trinnov to be put in anything under $10K. Then people will continue to assume that it is so awesome.

I think Dirac is making a huge mistake by putting Dirac in anything less than $4K. But I am GLAD they are. Haha.

 

[PENG]

Yeah, if they are keeping cost the same, then something has to go.

It's interesting how Onkyo got rid of Audyssey (I assume to save money), and now wants to add Dirac, which seems to be even more expensive than Audyssey XT32.

But it's popcorn time to see how this unfolds.

I would not mind at all if every single Onkyo and Pioneer AVR has Dirac.

Right now, I think some people think that Dirac must be so awesome since only the $4k-$6K-$10K components have Dirac. But if everyone has access to Dirac, they will know.

Same way with Trinnov. Right now some people think it must be so awesome because it is only available in $10K-$20K components.

If I were Trinnov, I would NOT allow Trinnov to be put in anything under $10K. Then people will continue to assume that it is so awesome.

I think Dirac is making a huge mistake by putting Dirac in anything less than $4K. But I am GLAD they are. Haha.

Purists, audiophiles, people in the even "well designed" amps all sound audibly different, would have to make their choices. Would they accept subpar SINAD (by Amir's standard) because Dirac Live more than make up for the loss there, or not? Or they hate AVRs/AVPs so much it wouldn't matter to them anyway?

As side note, I thought even purist would agree the most audible thing with amps (if they were to have their unique sound signatures), is frequency response characteristics, yet they don't seem to understand the in room response of speakers vary so much, making the little difference on the amp side mean nothing to their ears, logically speaking. Just look at the Dirac plots on that video, and anyone should be able to see my logic, but no..., my logic must be so wrong!

Below is the speaker in-room FR as heard by Dirac/Mic for different positions:
So I won't worry about the FR of amps that typically resemble a near straight line, but others may worry enough to spend thousands of dollars, go figure.., again my logic is so wrong/fraud!!

Edit: forgot the FR plots

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Purists, audiophile, people in the even "well designed" amps all sound audibly different, would have to make their choice. Would they accept subpar SINAD (by Amir's standard) because Dirac Live more than make up for the loss there, or not?

As side note, I thought even purist would agree the most audible thing with amps (if they were to have their unique sound signatures), is frequency response characteristics, yet they don't seem to understand the in room response of speakers vary so much, making the little difference on the amp side mean nothing to their ears, logically speaking. Just look at the Dirac plots on that video, and anyone should be able to see my logic, but no..., my logic must be so wrong!

I don't think every audio enthusiast believes that any particular specs define the overall sound quality of the sound system.

For example, just because a graph looks flatter on paper does not guarantee that the sound quality is better subjectively.

If everyone believes that flatter graphs guarantee better sound, then it's BIAS. They see flatter graphs and they SEE better sound.

Just like how people see a graph that shows a 5-7dB peak around 10kHz, and they SEE that the speaker is BRIGHT before they even HEAR the speakers.

So if they spent $4K-$10K on a component for Dirac, then they will SEE the improvement in Sound regardless of what they HEAR.

 

[PENG]

I don't think every audio enthusiast believes that any particular specs define the overall sound quality of the sound system.

For example, just because a graph looks flatter on paper does not guarantee that the sound quality is better.

If everyone believes that flatter graphs guarantee better sound, then it's BIAS. They see flatter graphs and they SEE better sound.

Just like how people see a graph that shows a 5-7dB peak around 10kHz, and they SEE that the speaker is BRIGHT before they even HEAR the speakers.

You are so funny, but also so right. Logic is one thing, but seeing is believing is another, no one ever said hearing is believing anyway.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Below is the speaker in-room FR as heard by Dirac/Mic for different positions:
View attachment 39925

So what's the take-home message regarding this Dirac Plot?

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

You are so funny, but also so right. Logic is one thing, but seeing is believing is another, no one ever said hearing is believing anyway.

If I paid $20K on a Pre-pro, then dammit, it sounds better than everything put together and then some!

So, of course, Trinnov #1, Dirac #2, Audyssey and Anthem ARC #3.

Just wait and see how Dirac sounds when it's inside a $500 Onkyo.

 

[M Code]

Purists, audiophiles, people in the even "well designed" amps all sound audibly different, would have to make their choices. Would they accept subpar SINAD (by Amir's standard) because Dirac Live more than make up for the loss there, or not? Or they hate AVRs/AVPs so much it wouldn't matter to them anyway?

As side note, I thought even purist would agree the most audible thing with amps (if they were to have their unique sound signatures), is frequency response characteristics, yet they don't seem to understand the in room response of speakers vary so much, making the little difference on the amp side mean nothing to their ears, logically speaking. Just look at the Dirac plots on that video, and anyone should be able to see my logic, but no..., my logic must be so wrong!

Below is the speaker in-room FR as heard by Dirac/Mic for different positions:
So I won't worry about the FR of amps that typically resemble a near straight line, but others may worry enough to spend thousands of dollars, go figure.., again my logic is so wrong/fraud!!

View attachment 39925

Edit: forgot the FR plots

Excellent point...
Just think about How many? HT listeners run their EQ software be it YPAO, MAAC, Audyssey, then stores it and goes on thinking they have optimized their system/room acoustics....

Just my $0.02...

 

[PENG]

Excellent point...
Just think about How many? HT listeners run their EQ software be it YPAO, MAAC, Audyssey, then stores it and goes on thinking they have optimized their system/room acoustics....

Just my $0.02...

Haha, and I would also ask (but on the technical side..) how many Marantz warm sound believers bought their Slim line NR AVRs not realizing Marantz forgot to put in the HDAMs, making them exactly the same as the so called "more punchy" sounding Denon AVRs with analog inputs and digital inputs except the different choice of the AK4458 DAC reconstruction filters that has practically no effects to most people over 40 and theoretically no effects if higher sampling rates are used.