Old Speaker Conundrum...

[MindEraser]

Hello I am new on here and have a few questions for those with more experience than me.
About a year ago I sorta got into Hifi. I always loved music and was listening to a cheap 5.1 Sony Box Speaker set which sounded okay for back then and various headphones. My Dad handed down to me 2 sets of floor standing speakers and a receiver few years ago and I decided to give them a try about a year ago. It was a pair of Realistic Mach Ones and a Pair of Realistic Optimus t-100's. I believe they are both from the 80's. Unfortunately one of each pair of speaker had a damaged woofer. So oddly enough I now have a T-100 on the left and a Mach One on the right. These are connected to an Optimus STA-3500 Professional Series Stereo Receiver(100 watts per channel). These things blew my mind with with sound quality. And how could they sound this good being so old? I have been enjoying these for about a year with audio through my PC(CD's, 24bit files, HdTracks, Tidal Hifi. The sound is really big and clear and a bit bright. They actually have very similar tonal qualities to my Sennheiser 558 headphones but they actually are more pleasing. Fast Forward to now and they are beginning to have some problems. Bad voice coil in one of the T-100's woofers, and a slight bit of distortion in the highs out of the horn on the Mach One. Plus my wife has always loathed the way they look. Too vintage i guess. So here is my conundrum. I have a budget of 850 dollars to get a new stereo system. Does anyone know of a new floor standing speaker set in this price range that would have a similar sound signature to what i have now. What i have now sounds pretty good with rock and pop music and pretty good in classical. But when it comes to jazz/ big band Quincy Jones kind of stuff they sound like massaging amazing buttery nectar to my ears. And i really like that kind of music. I want my new speakers to have a similar sound. I have been considering Fluance Xl7F, Klipsch RF-62, Polk Tsi-500, Magnepan MMG, ect... I really want to make a decision in a few weeks and I just have no idea. I like good highs and mids, and bass is nice but not the most important. I have no speaker dealers where i live to go listen to different models. I really just need advice especially from those of you that have experience with the sound of old loudspeakers. I am also unsure if my receiver would be better or worse that a new one as well. Thanks for your help in advance.

 

[MindEraser]

I would also like to add that my listening room is 12' x 22' and is hardwood with hard plaster walls. It is a very warm room.

 

[ski2xblack]

Realistic Mach 1 and Optimus t-100? There's a blast from the past (with a poof of powderized foam surround material for good measure).

It would be impossible to really make recommendations for something with similar sound to those old beasts, only having heard one of them, at age 12.

We can help advise you on what would work for your room, but most suggestions will have much, much better performance than what you're used to. They will sound different, and if you get what is suggested, you will become as used to them as you are the old speakers.

Also, given the difficulty of few brick and mortar stores and the shift to ecommerce, don't be impatient. Take your time, take advantage of home auditions, as your local acoustics are an unavoidable part of the equation that store auditions simply cannot address.

I would spend the budget entirely on speakers since you have the rest in order. I assume you're sticking with two channel.

I think Hsu offers some outstanding value 2.1 combos. The Hybrid 2 combo features a very capable sub (VTF 2 MK4) to go with their updated, and very easy on the ears, HB-1 sats. Those would have you quickly forgetting all about the Mack 1/t-100 Frankenstereo.

 

[zieglj01]

I would look along the lines of the Wharfedale Diamond speakers
http://www.musicdirect.com/p-15485-wharfedale-diamond-104-tower-speakers-pr.aspx

RBH is another one for you to look at
http://emptek.com/r55ti.php

Now for the music you listen to and the sound realm that you desire - then I for sure,
would look at the Philharmonic Audio AA [Pioneer modded] tower speakers.
They are not forward or laid back - they are smooth and refined, with good detail
and definition - and would be an ear opener for you.
http://philharmonicaudio.com/aa.html

 

[MindEraser]

Realistic Mach 1 and Optimus t-100? There's a blast from the past (with a poof of powderized foam surround material for good measure).

It would be impossible to really make recommendations for something with similar sound to those old beasts, only having heard one of them, at age 12.

We can help advise you on what would work for your room, but most suggestions will have much, much better performance than what you're used to. They will sound different, and if you get what is suggested, you will become as used to them as you are the old speakers.

Also, given the difficulty of few brick and mortar stores and the shift to ecommerce, don't be impatient. Take your time, take advantage of home auditions, as your local acoustics are an unavoidable part of the equation that store auditions simply cannot address.

I would spend the budget entirely on speakers since you have the rest in order. I assume you're sticking with two channel.

I think Hsu offers some outstanding value 2.1 combos. The Hybrid 2 combo features a very capable sub (VTF 2 MK4) to go with their updated, and very easy on the ears, HB-1 sats. Those would have you quickly forgetting all about the Mack 1/t-100 Frankenstereo.

Thanks for the info, i checked out the speakers and the specs look good on both the sub and the bookshelves. Do you really think that bookshelves + a sub would produce a big sound? And would it be worth it for me to bump my budget up to 450-500 per speaker? Is there something I'm missing out on that I am just shy of in my budget? I've got to get Frankenstereo(lol) out of here! Should I also be looking for very bright speakers because my room is so warm?

 

[MindEraser]

Now for the music you listen to and the sound realm that you desire - then I for sure,
would look at the Philharmonic Audio AA [Pioneer modded] tower speakers.
They are not forward or laid back - they are smooth and refined, with good detail
and definition - and would be an ear opener for you.
[/QUOTE]

Emptek's look really nice and tall like I would like to have and they are gorgeous. The wharfedales's seem really small but I'm sure the sound is quite good from what I've read about wharfedale. Only thing is that my stereo receiver is 8 ohm, could they drive 6 ohm speakers without a problem? And would raising my budget to a 1000 be worth it for any options my current budget is leaving out that will be quite a bit better?

 

[Rickster71]

The Mach One's may have value in the resale market. They seem to have a bit of a cult following.
They made two or three versions of those speakers (4024, 4024A, 4029).
The better version had ten mounting screws on the level control.

 

[MindEraser]

The Mach One's may have value in the resale market. They seem to have a bit of a cult following.
They made two or three versions of those speakers (4024, 4024A, 4029).
The better version had ten mounting screws on the level control.

Yes mine is the one with the 10 mounting screws which I believe is the 4024A.

 

[marksas]

+1 for the Magnepan MMG or any other of their speakers. I have a friend who has the MMG's and another larger model, both sound amazing. I was blown away the first time I heard those MMG's, I think they are truly one of the best bargain deals in audio.
They have a 60 day in home trial as well which I think you should do for any potential speakers, do not just blindly buy and think you will like the sound, you'd be taking a big risk.
Good luck

 

[ski2xblack]

Thanks for the info, i checked out the speakers and the specs look good on both the sub and the bookshelves. Do you really think that bookshelves + a sub would produce a big sound? And would it be worth it for me to bump my budget up to 450-500 per speaker? Is there something I'm missing out on that I am just shy of in my budget? I've got to get Frankenstereo(lol) out of here! Should I also be looking for very bright speakers because my room is so warm?

Do bookshelves and sub produce a big sound? Yes. The limiting factor would be the dynamic range of the sats, and you could squeeze a bit more of that out by employing bass management. The HB-1 are available in sharp real wood veneers, high WAF.

Up the budget? Sure, as long as it doesn't keep you from making your IRA contribution.

I think you should get neutral speakers, and consider how they'll interact with your room. You mention hardwood and drywall construction, which may seem warm, but is also reflective. Overly bright speakers may not sound that great in situ, or they may sound fantastic (this is why in-home auditions are a must).

The EMP towers got a great review from Gene a while back. Per his report, they seem geared for dynamics over extension, so you'll still want a sub with such speakers, if not now, at least eventually, but they can belt it out pretty well. Another option geared more to dynamics would be Klipsch, since they are revamping their Reference II series and the previous versions are getting big discounts right now.

 

[zieglj01]

Do you really think that bookshelves + a sub would produce a big sound? Is there something I'm missing out on that I am just shy of in my budget?

The wharfedales's seem really small but I'm sure the sound is quite good from what I've read about wharfedale.
Only thing is that my stereo receiver is 8 ohm, could they drive 6 ohm speakers without a problem?

And would raising my budget to a 1000 be worth it for any options my current budget is leaving out that will be quite a bit better?

Yes, raising your budget could/can give you some nice results. And, bookshelf
speakers with a sub can make a nice system > I have experience in the past
with RadioShack/Optimus/Realistic products.

Some speakers that may look small to you - will/can still sound big.

Some of them old receivers are sensitive to ohm ratings, and can/could faint,
when played Loud [high volumes]. However with only hooking 1 set of speakers
6 ohms and above, you may be fine.

With a $1000 budget you could squeeze in a receiver that has a sub pre-out
and bass management.

As stated if you desire - You can sell your Mach speakers as some would like
to toy with them and fix and mod them. You could even sell the receiver.

As far as something sounding much better to you - well, no one can speak for
or guarantee anything for your ears and preference. Also, sometimes we can/do
get use to speakers with a certain sound, and then it becomes hard to adjust to
a somewhat different type sound signature. However, you could be amazed at
the sound signature of new speakers - just give it some time when you do hook
up a new system.

 

[MindEraser]

+1 for the Magnepan MMG or any other of their speakers. I have a friend who has the MMG's and another larger model, both sound amazing. I was blown away the first time I heard those MMG's, I think they are truly one of the best bargain deals in audio.
They have a 60 day in home trial as well which I think you should do for any potential speakers, do not just blindly buy and think you will like the sound, you'd be taking a big risk.
Good luck

I am really interested in the Magnepans because I've read about the big sound they have and amazing clarity. I'm a little worried about there 4 ohm witchcraft though.. I think I would need a hefty amplifier to give those speakers what they want. I've also read that they need to be at least 3 foot from the wall to sound the best and have an extremely narrow sweet spot. Those are the things that put me off a bit. Plus they aren't full range and will likely need an expensive sub to keep up with them. I could just opt for the Super MMG deal that has the upgrade and bass panel but, that's out of budget.

 

[MindEraser]

Yes, raising your budget could/can give you some nice results. And, bookshelf
speakers with a sub can make a nice system > I have experience in the past
with RadioShack/Optimus/Realistic products.

Some speakers that may look small to you - will/can still sound big.

Some of them old receivers are sensitive to ohm ratings, and can/could faint,
when played Loud [high volumes]. However with only hooking 1 set of speakers
6 ohms and above, you may be fine.

With a $1000 budget you could squeeze in a receiver that has a sub pre-out
and bass management.

As stated if you desire - You can sell your Mach speakers as some would like
to toy with them and fix and mod them. You could even sell the receiver.

As far as something sounding much better to you - well, no one can speak for
or guarantee anything for your ears and preference. Also, sometimes we can/do
get use to speakers with a certain sound, and then it becomes hard to adjust to
a somewhat different type sound signature. However, you could be amazed at
the sound signature of new speakers - just give it some time when you do hook
up a new system.

I am very excited to go back to the future in audio. I know it will take some getting used to the sound of new speakers compared to the horn hybrids i've been listening too. Your EMP Tek recommendation is quite high up my list along with others after some careful research on them. I think if I get those I will see if i can squeeze in a moderately priced sub to bring up the low end for some types of music and movies, worried that it might be tough on my receiver though. I've probably gotten a little to used to the Mach One's 15 in bass driver to be able to survive without a deep low end. And its not that I like heavy bass in music, its just those tuba blasts, bass strokes, and timpani rumbles that really blow my socks off sometimes that I've come to like. The Mach One's bass isn't really normally boomy its just a heavy but subtle fast hum that sounds really cool. Now there is a button on my Optimus receiver called "Super Bass". Its scary with the Mach One. It will literally send pressure waves across the room. Cool to have a speaker blowing wind in your face from across the room but not all that musical.

 

[MindEraser]

Do bookshelves and sub produce a big sound? Yes. The limiting factor would be the dynamic range of the sats, and you could squeeze a bit more of that out by employing bass management. The HB-1 are available in sharp real wood veneers, high WAF.

Up the budget? Sure, as long as it doesn't keep you from making your IRA contribution.

I think you should get neutral speakers, and consider how they'll interact with your room. You mention hardwood and drywall construction, which may seem warm, but is also reflective. Overly bright speakers may not sound that great in situ, or they may sound fantastic (this is why in-home auditions are a must).

The EMP towers got a great review from Gene a while back. Per his report, they seem geared for dynamics over extension, so you'll still want a sub with such speakers, if not now, at least eventually, but they can belt it out pretty well. Another option geared more to dynamics would be Klipsch, since they are revamping their Reference II series and the previous versions are getting big discounts right now.

Thats what draws me to the EMP's, nice dynamics over extension could produce life like woodwinds and drums. The Klipsch RF-82 ii is a serious consideration of mine due to the big bright sound they create with ample low end as well. I feel like buying those would be buying the "iphone" of speakers though. RBH with there EMP's is probably a more down to earth company where you get more for what you pay for. Seems like people are turning Klipsch into the boogie man like Bose was turned into years ago.

 

[marksas]

Here's another option to think about, Tekton Design. They make some seriously nice speakers that receive much praise from professionals. The model here I'm suggesting is a smaller tower that fits within your budget...
http://www.tektondesign.com/lore-m.html

The specs and design seem to be what you want, they are not vey big and are front ported so they can be put right up against a wall, they can go way down to 38Hz, are 8ohm and 95db sensitivity making them super easy to drive!
Steve Guttenberg (the Audiophiliac) loves these and the others in the line up, here's his review...
http://www.cnet.com/news/big-speaker-sound-the-tekton-m-lore/

 

[ski2xblack]

Considering the OP is used to old school 15" woofs, those Tektons may be the closest sonic match mentioned so far. They certainly are the closest as far as sophistication of the engineering. And they may still be enjoyable as all get out, as whatever flaws they have they'll bring the dynamic range. I've not heard them, but I have seen Erik's (Tekton) cab work which is top notch.

 

[zieglj01]

I am very excited to go back to the future in audio. I know it will take some getting used to the sound of new speakers compared to the horn hybrids i've been listening too. Your EMP Tek recommendation is quite high up my list along with others after some careful research on them. I think if I get those I will see if i can squeeze in a moderately priced sub to bring up the low end for some types of music and movies, worried that it might be tough on my receiver though. I've probably gotten a little to used to the Mach One's 15 in bass driver to be able to survive without a deep low end. And its not that I like heavy bass in music, its just those tuba blasts, bass strokes, and timpani rumbles that really blow my socks off sometimes that I've come to like.

The EMP is a good option for you - and should be on a short list.

Here is one more for exploration and they do have strong bass - and no
need for a receiver bass boost. They make nice stuff.
http://www.htd.com/Products/level-three-speakers/Level-THREE-Tower-Speakers

Audioholics review

 

[KEW]

I used to live in rural western NC so feel your pain on auditions.

Have you looked at Craig's list or your local classified newspaper?

If you tell us what is available (cut and paste from CL), we can point you to the good deals.

This would accomplish two things:
1) You are getting a modern pair of speakers to listen to for at least a few weeks to see how you like the sound. Your feedback would help us help you.
2) By buying a good deal on a used speaker, you should be able to resell it without much loss, if you decide to.

About 6 years ago I was about where you are with beloved vintage speakers falling into disrepair. In Atlanta, there are plenty of options to audition (one dealer let me take display speakers home Saturday and return Monday since he was closed on Sunday). After a few days to get used to more accurate sound, I came to realize that new speakers are better (though a great old speaker can shame a poor new speaker).

My concern is that with vintage speakers as your only real reference, you limit your perspective.

Also betting that if you get a good deal on a great used speaker, you will never bother to look back!

 

[MindEraser]

Here's another option to think about, Tekton Design. They make some seriously nice speakers that receive much praise from professionals. The model here I'm suggesting is a smaller tower that fits within your budget...
http://www.tektondesign.com/lore-m.html

The specs and design seem to be what you want, they are not vey big and are front ported so they can be put right up against a wall, they can go way down to 38Hz, are 8ohm and 95db sensitivity making them super easy to drive!
Steve Guttenberg (the Audiophiliac) loves these and the others in the line up, here's his review...
http://www.cnet.com/news/big-speaker-sound-the-tekton-m-lore/

These look pretty nice. I think I would be more inclined to stretch my budget to the Lore or Lore 2.0 Model. Not sure what the difference is between the two though, can't find any reviews or opinions on the 2.0 for some reason or why they are cheaper.. . These have less drivers than any other of the speakers on my list, but that just leaves room for them to be higher quality.

 

[MindEraser]

The EMP is a good option for you - and should be on a short list.

Here is one more for exploration and they do have strong bass - and no
need for a receiver bass boost. They make nice stuff.
http://www.htd.com/Products/level-three-speakers/Level-THREE-Tower-Speakers

Audioholics review

The EMP Tek's plus a sub are at number one on my list right now. Just still slightly fearful of 6 ohms though.
HTD's look like an interesting idea. I need to do some more research on them though. Company hasn't been around to long, could be a good thing or a bad thing. Probably good in that you get more at a reasonable price.