New Remote: I think I got it down to 2...

[itschris]

I'm looling at the Pronto TSU-9200 and the Home Theater Master UNIVERSAL TX-1000.

The universal is a bit more... about $325, but is has a much bigger touch screen display. I don't know if I care about that, however.

I originally was going with the Harmony One because they had codes in their database for every piece of equipment I owned so I thought it would be easy, but then I hear all the stories about things not working, getting out of sync, etc.

So, looking at these two, I'd like your advice on which one to get. My needs are relatively straightforward. I just need it to run my one system and do it easily so the wife and kid can watch how and what they want without me there.

I don't see a list of compatible equipment anywhere for these two, do they work differently? Is that how they don't lose sync like the Harmony?

 

[bandphan]

Unviversal has a massive database and its computer programed thru software. There are more discrete codes for the two brands you have selected. I own and install universal brand, never doing the tx1000 but its part of my software suite, and i have NEVER lost programing on a personal or sold unit. I mostly due the mx3000 and upper "mx" slim lines. Due you plan on going with a rf base station also?

 

[itschris]

Thanks for the info. I have a clear shot from the couch to the equipment, so don't think I need a seperate base station.

I'm not sure about the getting out of sync problem with the Harmony remotes. I don't know if it's something user does that the remote cannot accomodate or just a flaw in the remote itself.

Either way, I only hear this about the Harmony's.

 

[bandphan]

Discrete codes or good work arounds will allow the sync to stay perfect without the use of rs232

 

[jcPanny]

URC Remote

I have a low end URC remote with RF. One nice thing about RF is you can complete long macros without holding the remote pointed at your gear for several seconds. The remote can be pointed in any direction and will function from another room. Once setup, the RF is also more rliable than IR.

URC offers RF for their entry level remotes like my RF30 but Harmony only offers it as an add on for the high end models.

 

[NapaDRB]

Chris,

I have no experience with the two remotes you mention, but I have the Harmony 880 and love it. I bought for the exact same reason you mention, to allow the wife and kids to simply operate my system, and my wife would probably kill me if I got rid of it.

As far as I know, the out of sync problem only happens two ways. One, if you turn one of your components on manually by the power switch on the front of the unit, such as hitting the power button on the front of your DVD player to put a disc in. Now the remote does not know the player is on, so when you hit the activity button "watch DVD" on the harmony it cycles the power on you DVD player turning it off. Two, if you hit one of the activity buttons on the remote and don't keep it pointed at the system for a second or two so it has time to send all the various commands.

I basically instructed the family to do everything from the remote and when powering the system up or down the keep the remote pointed at it for a second or two, this solves 99% of the problems. If it does get out of sync it is easy to get back, it has a help button on the remote that will walk you through getting it re-synced, or for me I just glance at the system, see the DVD player isn't on, hit device, DVD, power, and your good to go.

 

[bandphan]

not knocking harmony, but why worry about an issue? simple setups im sure are fine but you dont see pro installers using the line

 

[itschris]

I like the Harmony remotes, but am concerned with the out of sync issue. Why don't the Pronto or the Universal remotes I mentioned suffer from this same issue?

 

[MDS]

I like the Harmony remotes, but am concerned with the out of sync issue. Why don't the Pronto or the Universal remotes I mentioned suffer from this same issue?

ALL remotes can suffer from the issue. There is no two-way communication between the remote and the equipment thus there is no way for the remote to ask 'are you currently on or off?' If the device uses only toggle power commands then things can get out of sync if you manually turn the power on or off or a macro is interrupted (somebody walks in front of the remote, you don't point it at the equipment until the macro finishes, etc). If the device uses discrete power commands then there is no problem because 'on' means on and if it is already on it will just ignore the command; with toggle power commands it just toggles between states - if it is on and you send 'power' it turns off.

The Harmony help system will just ask you which devices are on or off but as NapaDRB said above you can just look at the equipment and see what the problem is so the 'help' system isn't very useful.

 

[itschris]

Got it. So the remotes like the Pronto TSU use descrete commands vs simple toggle commands. I guess that's a no brainer then. Granted, I would be able to figure out an issue relatively quickly and easily. However, think of the crap I'd have to listen to if my wife screwed it up somehow and couldn't get Lifetime up and running in surround sound while I'm at Home Depot buying things for the Honey-Do list. I can just hear it now... "You spend $250 on a remote control and it still doesn't work? Blah... blah... blah." No thanks!

Thanks for the all the help guys. I just need to make sure the remote I get uses descrete commands and then I'm all set.

 

[jostenmeat]

You don't get it. At all. MDS says ALL remotes suffer from this issue. When he speaks of a device, he is talking about any of your existing components, not the remote itself.

You might notice that some of your remote controls have a SEPARATE button for ON or for OFF. That means your "device" has discrete commands for on and off. If its the same button that turns it on AND off, then your device is not using discrete codes for on and off.

I believe with the proliferation of universal remotes that discrete codes have a chance to become the norm. Pricier stuff will have discrete codes. My older DLP that I gave to my parents did not have a discrete code for the second HDMI input, and that was REALLY ANNOYING!

 

[itschris]

Well hell, I got it now.

 

[MDS]

Discrete codes

Just to add to the 'discrete' code mess...

It's not that any particular remote uses discrete codes or not. The device must support discrete codes; it's just that some remotes that have a built-in database (or like the Harmony can retrieve said codes from a database on the web) come pre-loaded with the discrete version of the code rather than the toggle. You can of course teach a remote any code that uses an IR frequency and protocol it understands.

Sony is notorious for supporting discrete codes but NOT programming their own remotes controls to use them! My beloved Onkyo is hit and miss - some of the receivers I've had used discrete power commands and the remote supported them with separate on/off buttons and then the next model is back to the toggle code (even though you could program your universal using the old remote and it would work because Onkyo at least is consistent with the codes their equipment uses, from my experience at least).

The short story is that discrete codes are much better, if you can obtain them, to make macros work reliably. There are creative workarounds for devices known as TOADs (Toggle Only Activated Device), such as DVD players that will turn on when you press Play, but if you can get a discrete code and not have to deal with workarounds, all the better.

 

[jostenmeat]

Good point I failed to address, MDS. Interesting notes on the Onkyo brand as well.

For itschris, I was really hoping that I could find the "missing discrete code" for the TV here, but I never found it:

http://www.remotecentral.com/

 

[itschris]

I'm probably just gonna go ahead with the Pronto TSU9000 or the Harmony One. I was doing additional research and looked up some other reviews and both seemed to have fans and nay-sayers so I don't really think it matters all that much.

I just have to teach the fam to hold the remote in the correct direction until the command runs... shouldn't be too dificult. I'm gonna see if I locate one locally so that I can see them both in person before I make my choice.

Thanks for the education guys.

 

[Warpdrv]

If you have an RF device, you don't have to point it in any direction, or even be in the same room really...

Are you talking about the TSU-9600?
If thats the one, it operates over WiFi... I can use that remote in my backyard and control my system... Absolutely awesome..

I would take that over the buggy harmony unit any day...

 

[bandphan]

chris, if you would like to lok at the urc software to see if you like it pm me.

 

[itschris]

If you have an RF device, you don't have to point it in any direction, or even be in the same room really...

Are you talking about the TSU-9600?
If thats the one, it operates over WiFi... I can use that remote in my backyard and control my system... Absolutely awesome..

I would take that over the buggy harmony unit any day...

It's actually the 9200. The wife put her foot down and put a limit on the remote control spending. She asked me point blank last night if it would guarantee that she wouldn't have to mess around with anything. I told her not quite, so she said $250 was it. I'm definately leaning towards that Pronto since opinions seems to lean that way.

 

[cubbie5150]

Anyone know whether the Harmony remotes can control a Slim Devices Transporter? I tried Googling for harmony code DB, but didn't find what I was looking for...