Need Help on an Interesting System Installing in Large Shop

[Shawn B Idaho]

Hi there.. I know just enough to be dangerous, but usually make (LUCK) can make it happen.. I'll try to summarize.. Installed a system in my big ass toy box/shop. 50'x100' 14' ceilings.. Keep adding, subtracting, and moving speakers..but I think I've finally figured out speakers and placement... Knowing what I'm doing might lessen you thinking I've lost my mind..
I have a Denon AV S750-H.
It Only has 2 - Pre Outs
But I'm running 2 Powered Subs and need to run an External Amp.
Any suggestions how I can still power an Amp with no Pre Out options open?

Thank you for any help in advance!!
Shawn

 

[highfigh]

Hi there.. I know just enough to be dangerous, but usually make (LUCK) can make it happen.. I'll try to summarize.. Installed a system in my big ass toy box/shop. 50'x100' 14' ceilings.. Keep adding, subtracting, and moving speakers..but I think I've finally figured out speakers and placement... Knowing what I'm doing might lessen you thinking I've lost my mind..
I have a Denon AV S750-H.
It Only has 2 - Pre Outs
But I'm running 2 Powered Subs and need to run an External Amp.
Any suggestions how I can still power an Amp with no Pre Out options open?

Thank you for any help in advance!!
Shawn

Some questions:

- What is/will be your main source of music? If possible, use HEOS, which the AVR has, built in.
- What speakers are you using? Get info about their dispersion-if you don't know that, you'll be adding, subtracting and moving them until the end of time. Download JBL's Speaker Configurator after learning about your speakers' dispersion and find a JBL speaker model (in-ceiling or pendant) that's similar, so you can see the coverage area for each one.
- How loud does it need to be?
- How much control over each pair would you need WRT Volume level?
- Are you trying to have a 5 or 7 channel surround system in a large room?

 

[lovinthehd]

You can use a converter from speaker to line level but quality will likely suffer somewhat, altho that may not matter much in your environment. Why did you choose that avr if you needed pre-outs?

Another consideration using just the receiver might be some high sensitivity pro type speakers, like maybe the Behringer B215XL, especially if you already have subs picked out (but what subs?)

Best to provide answers to all of highfigh's questions, tho.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

I have a Denon AV S750-H.
It Only has 2 - Pre Outs

Eh, S750 doesn't have pre-outs at all, except for dual subs pre-outs. Without knowing details, it would be nearly impossible to advise anything, but my gut says that the 75Wpc isn't going to be nearly enough to power all your speakers, and you absolutely need additional amps. Without pre-outs for main channels, it's going to be impossible. You should replace the AVR for one with pre-outs or replace it with a pre-pro (more expensive usually)

 

[TLS Guy]

Hi there.. I know just enough to be dangerous, but usually make (LUCK) can make it happen.. I'll try to summarize.. Installed a system in my big ass toy box/shop. 50'x100' 14' ceilings.. Keep adding, subtracting, and moving speakers..but I think I've finally figured out speakers and placement... Knowing what I'm doing might lessen you thinking I've lost my mind..
I have a Denon AV S750-H.
It Only has 2 - Pre Outs
But I'm running 2 Powered Subs and need to run an External Amp.
Any suggestions how I can still power an Amp with no Pre Out options open?

Thank you for any help in advance!!
Shawn

I think you went about this totally wrong. This sounds like a back ground music system, in a commercial environment. What you should have done is keep the system mono and used a pro 7 volt speaker system.
You can not use what you have with an external amp.

This is absolutely a situation where you should be using a commercial 70 volt system designed for situation like yours. They are sturdy, tried and true, highly adjustable as far as the load to each speaker, very reliable and long lived. They are also very easy to install, set up and adjust.

 

[Shawn B Idaho]

Eh, S750 doesn't have pre-outs at all, except for dual subs pre-outs. Without knowing details, it would be nearly impossible to advise anything, but my gut says that the 75Wpc isn't going to be nearly enough to power all your speakers, and you absolutely need additional amps. Without pre-outs for main channels, it's going to be impossible. You should replace the AVR for one with pre-outs or replace it with a pre-pro (more expensive usually)

Thanks for the response!! You are exactly spot on!! It has 2 Pre Outs, but labeled Sub 1 and Sub 2... Which I have loaded with 2 10' subs... I bought this AVR receiver at Costco and didnt have to spend much at all... It's a big open shop that I just work on my personal toys in... I only really work in about half the building (the rest is mostly indoor parking), so I stuck an 80 something inch LG TV on the wall, 2 - PV 215 3 way passive loud speakers on each side of the TV, and a Center Channel speaker under... OMG... Echo...
So after hours of reading, I decided to continue concentrating my energy on my "work area".
Under each PV speakers, I set 2 powered subs..
If I stopped here, I'm good..
But I needed something above and behind to primarily block the sound from bouncing around, waaaay back behind me...
added 2 bookshelf KEF speakers, and 4 - KEF ceiling speakers. I built custom boxes to angle the speakers toward my work bay...
I knew I'd definitely needed an amp... Looked at the panel behind the denon and thought, shiiiiit... I need some advice...

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks for the response!! You are exactly spot on!! It has 2 Pre Outs, but labeled Sub 1 and Sub 2... Which I have loaded with 2 10' subs... I bought this AVR receiver at Costco and didnt have to spend much at all... It's a big open shop that I just work on my personal toys in... I only really work in about half the building (the rest is mostly indoor parking), so I stuck an 80 something inch LG TV on the wall, 2 - PV 215 3 way passive loud speakers on each side of the TV, and a Center Channel speaker under... OMG... Echo...
So after hours of reading, I decided to continue concentrating my energy on my "work area".
Under each PV speakers, I set 2 powered subs..
If I stopped here, I'm good..
But I needed something above and behind to primarily block the sound from bouncing around, waaaay back behind me...
added 2 bookshelf KEF speakers, and 4 - KEF ceiling speakers. I built custom boxes to angle the speakers toward my work bay...
I knew I'd definitely needed an amp... Looked at the panel behind the denon and thought, shiiiiit... I need some advice...

They're particularly sub pre-outs, tho; I doubt they're full range, either. While once upon a time almost any receiver had pre-outs for main channels, that's only on mid/upper tier avrs these days. Most having two sub pre-outs are just an internal splitter anyways, rather than independent level/delay controls a few offer (and that tends to come along at the full set of pre-outs level)

 

[Shawn B Idaho]

Some questions:

- What is/will be your main source of music? If possible, use HEOS, which the AVR has, built in.
- What speakers are you using? Get info about their dispersion-if you don't know that, you'll be adding, subtracting and moving them until the end of time. Download JBL's Speaker Configurator after learning about your speakers' dispersion and find a JBL speaker model (in-ceiling or pendant) that's similar, so you can see the coverage area for each one.
- How loud does it need to be?
- How much control over each pair would you need WRT Volume level?
- Are you trying to have a 5 or 7 channel surround system in a large room?

Thank you!! I

Some questions:

- What is/will be your main source of music? If possible, use HEOS, which the AVR has, built in.
- What speakers are you using? Get info about their dispersion-if you don't know that, you'll be adding, subtracting and moving them until the end of time. Download JBL's Speaker Configurator after learning about your speakers' dispersion and find a JBL speaker model (in-ceiling or pendant) that's similar, so you can see the coverage area for each one.
- How loud does it need to be?
- How much control over each pair would you need WRT Volume level?
- Are you trying to have a 5 or 7 channel surround system in a large room?

Hi... Thank you for the attention and response...

I watch some TV and listen to music sometimes.. Not trying to accomplish anywhere close to "an Ultimate Surround Sound Theater", but I still love solid crisp sound..
I'm not looking for giant ear drum busting loud, but now and again, I love to crank it up..
Below, I tried to explain my idea, and the way I have set the speakers up, I could go 7 channel, but I wouldn't be heart broken with 5 if it works better..
Pair volume control isn't a huge concern unless that control would help me "block" sound travel beyond the rear channel explained below.

It's a big open shop that I just work on my personal toys in... I only really work in about half the building (the rest is mostly indoor parking), so I stuck an 80 something inch LG TV on the wall, 2 - PV 215 3 way passive loud speakers on each side of the TV, and a Center Channel speaker under... OMG... Echo...
So after hours of reading, I decided to continue concentrating my energy on my "work area".
Under each PV speakers, I set 2 powered subs..
If I stopped here, I'm good..
But I needed something above and behind to primarily block the sound from bouncing around, waaaay back behind me...
added 2 bookshelf KEF speakers, and 4 - KEF ceiling speakers. I built custom boxes to angle the speakers toward my work bay...
The ceiling speakers are a crazy blend/idea I dreamt up, but I really think will work.
I had 4 KEF wall/ceiling speakers. when I built the house I'm in now, I ended up with 4 extra.. I built 2 boxes to recess into the ceiling. Going after that somewhat ATMOS design, I built the boxes that angle the speaker at a 22.5 degree angle facing directly towards my primary listening/watching tv bay..
My idea was to practically surround myself with firing speakers and attempt to try to block the sound from echoing back into the remaining 75' of "storage" part of my shop...
I planned on running the ceiling speaker in parallel..
**The 2 Loud Speakers are Passive at 700w per 8ohm
**The Center Channel is Polk at 150w passive
**The 2 bookshelf speakers are KEF, 100w 8ohm per
**The 4 ceiling speakers are 10w - 100w 8 ohm per speaker... In parallel would load them to 4 ohm per box
**The Amp I had on hand is a 2 channel - 1400 w RMS per channel
**The 2 12" Klipsch subs are both powered...which are using the only Pre-Outs the denon has...
**And yes I'm down with HEOS for sure..
Sorry for the long winded reply, I just wanted to paint you a very clear picture..
And Thank you for trying to help me....

 

[Shawn B Idaho]

Eh, S750 doesn't have pre-outs at all, except for dual subs pre-outs. Without knowing details, it would be nearly impossible to advise anything, but my gut says that the 75Wpc isn't going to be nearly enough to power all your speakers, and you absolutely need additional amps. Without pre-outs for main channels, it's going to be impossible. You should replace the AVR for one with pre-outs or replace it with a pre-pro (more expensive usually)

Headed out on the innerweb to check it out now... Thank you!!!!!!

 

[lovinthehd]

The wattage ratings of your speakers don't have a lot to do with anything but particular melting limits. For brief bursts even a peak max wattage (if specified at all) isn't a great problem particularly. Too much power continuously is the bigger problem, but decent use of a volume control easily avoids issues too. Unless a lot of alcohol and no limits are employed (but many avrs allow a lockable max output).