NAD 773 Pricing?

[newfmp3]

well, I got the t773 this week. Didn't have much chance to play with it until last night. I'm still constructing the media room....almost done though.

After all the good things I heard about the sound of NAD I had high hopes for it.Probably too high.

First things first. I have no issues that others have posted about this amp. No hiss unless I turn it way up and stick my head to the speakers which is normal for most amps. It is version 2.0.

I am going to have to compare this to my older system. Carver tfm-15 poweramp, Carver ct-17 preamp with Kenwood 7030 eq. That setup has performed flawless for years, and I have yet to hear an equal to it. But, I'll admit, I live in a small town, and I don't get to hear all the latest greatest. Just some lower model denon, hk, pioneer, yammie, Kenwood etc.

Right off the bat, I was impressed with it's clarity, and detailed highs. But, I was sorely disappointed with it's pronounced mid range that almost sound tin'y, and complete lack of bass from my M80's compared to my carvers. Yes, I tried large/small settings, tried everything i can think of really, but there is a huge loss of bass in my m80's with this receiver.

So, I tried something I was hoping I could aviod. I put the kenwood 7030 eq between my source and receiver. Of course this is analog, and I can only do it for one source. There is a tape loop, but for some unkown crazy idea, the sub doesn't work when you use the tape loop, and the surround sound modes including EARS, Advanced stereo1/2 don't work at all so it renders the tape loop useless. Obviously, no digital connection will work, and so no dolby digital will work this way either. So, tape monitor or tape loop = CRAP.

So I left the eq between my player and the NAD. I just tweaked the sound just a little, dropped the mids a touch, raised the highs and bass a bit, and the thing came alive immediately. I was still missing a lot of bass from the m80's. Amazing what a different amp or preamp can do in that respect.. But, the sound is damn close to what I was looking for. I can just turn up the HSU sub to compensate for bass, but it's a shame the m80's aren't singing like I know they can with my carvers

Can't use Carver amp to power the m80's, need them in another room/setup. Besides, that is totally not the point. This is a new 2000.00 receiver so I was hoping for a little more.

I had this Nad shipped to me. 30 day money back deal. I have to decide if I want to keep it and maybe try to get a eq that will work with all sources, and 5.1 somehow. Or, try to get another amp. The nad is at the top of my price range, and the store i am dealing with is letting me finance it. They do sell Yamaha, and rotel. Of course, anything else i want to try is easily a week to ship again.

I do like the NAD for other reasons. very simple to use. Damn heavey amp, nice power although after using the carvers for 10 years the NAD isn't as impressive to me as maybe someone coming from a weaker setup. Funny, because my carver amp is not a big one at all. It handles the m80's with ease. Doesn't get warm at all even after many hours of use. the five, yes 5 fans on the bottom work great, and you can't hear them at all. Picture quality is great.....and more.

So, if someone can suggest any tips outside of room treatment, speaker positioning etc, go for it.

If anyone knows a good eq that will solve my problem ..... tell me.

 

[PENG]

Your experience is not unique. I listened to NAD receivers before, not the 773. They sounded great but did not seem better to me than the much lower priced Denon and Yamaha models. As I mentioned before, some British reviewers did not seem to think the T773 sound better than even a Yamaha RXV-1500, let alone the 2500 and Denon 3805. They gave the Arcam 300, also British designed, better review. As for eq, I think if you only feel like lacking mid and bass, it should do the trick. Personally, I prefer listening to music with the simplest signal path possible. How does it do in music compared to your Carver system?

Just thought of something, your big Axiom towers have many drivers and are rated 4 ohms. That means on average they may take twice as much currents as 8 ohms speakers with similar sensitivity in the same listening environment to give you the same sound level. The T773, like the HKAVR7300 has huge power supply transformers in them. Whether that is enough to top an average power amplifier is another story. I know the T773 are rated for 4 ohms speakers, but it does not necessarily mean it can do as well as your amplifier can. Anyway, hopeful with further tweaking you will like it better. After spending 2K, you have the right to expect more.

 

[newfmp3]

for music I need the eq to even compare to the carvers. My main complaint for this amp is the sound for music. My entire last post is really about music, not movies. Should have said that earlier.

For movies, the nad does pretty good. Seperation is amazing. Funny that for movies I do prefer a little more mid range for vocals and other sounds. But for music I can't stand that "listening to a stereo in a tin can effect" that mid range can do. And to think that some call this sound "natural".

We had some people over last night. The nad was going strong for hours running music through the eq of course. It held up quite fine even in a very humid room last night. Little warm to the touch but nothing major.

I'll say one thing for sure, it is very easy to use. Everyone was able to use the remote almost right away, and I had it programmed for my other devices as well.

the rest of my Axiom's will be here on Monday, or Tuesday. I got some more qs8'd coming and a vp-150. That'll be the real test. the carpet installers will be doing their thing in the media room on Thursday. So that will be the final test in the room all this is i intended for, and I'm betting it will sound different again down there.

Question. The NAD had a digital optical out/in connection. Could I hook up a behringer eq there and have the 5.1 eq'd somehow?


I really wish I could have tried a 3805 as well. With the eq in that thing it might do the job. But the power of the nad is nice, and I was hoping it would be enough to kick my m80's into high gear. You'd think that with 330+W per channel in 2 channel mode at 4 ohms that'd be enough

 

[newfmp3]

took some time today to try a few things. Keep in mind my main concern right now is two channel music. only because my other speakers aren't here and I'm using older paradigm surrounds and stuff now that don't match with the axiom's that well. And i am fairly happy with the NADs movie performance anyways. If I can get the music thing solved, everything else would fall into place I'm sure.

First thing I did was hook my old Carver tfm-15 poweramp, and CT17 pre-amp back up and start comparing back and forth. Absolutely no contest. I could care less if the sub was on at all with the Carvers powering the M80's. There's more bass with just the 80's on, then the nad with the 80's/sub together without turning the sub to insane levels of course. even at low volumes I can watch the 80's woofers bounce around easily with the bass cranked. not to mention every picture on my wall hanging on for dear life. With the NAD, I can turn it to insane volumes and there will be min movement on the woofers and my pictures are very safe. Honestly, anyone running the t773 on the m80's, you have no idea what your 80's are capable of.

That being said, I presisted to find out if it was indeed the Carver amp, or the preamp making the difference. I expected that the ct-17 preamp was just better. So, I used the NAD as the preamp, and used the Carver tfm-15 to power the m80's. Low and behold, very similar sound to using just the NAD for everything, but the mids were a little less pronounced, and highs a little different, but the bass was similar. Very hard to describe, bottom line was, very little difference and not enough for me to warrent using the Carver power amp all the time. So the NAD power amps are quite fine.

So, it's the NAD's preamp that's the pos. Little harsh I know, but for 2 grand, I expected a lot more and feel let down. Honestly, I don't think I'd even would have bought the 80's if I already had the NAD before hand. You just aren't getting the sound they are capable of. You end up relying on sub to do all of the work.

I tried playing with crossover settings. Little to no difference. Turning the speakers to large/small....same thing, no difference. There's just no bass to be found in the 80's using the nad.

So, i get to pay to send this thing back I guess. But where do i go from here? This is a pita. The room will be done in a weeks time, ready to mount screen and everything after it all sitting packed away for months. And now, I still have no amp.

My qs8's will be here Monday, as will the vp-150. I get to try everything again with those.

I have no idea what to do now...none.

 

[newfmp3]

well, thankfully that eq I got is still pretty good. I basically dropped the highs, mids, and raised the bass and tweaked the tin'y sound of the mid range, and voila. Just gotta turn it up a tad more. Gorgeous sound yet again. Granted, with the Carvers I had room for too much bass, now I have "enough". Now I'm finally happy....well, sorta

I didn't want to equalize the crap out of it, but here we are, and i think i finally have the music sound sound I'm looking for. But I'm back to the problem of I can only eq one source, and no digital.

Almost there..... And my pictures are now scared again...with no sub on. Let the 80's sing!

hmmm, wonder if the 4600 yammie is available at this store... I'd hate to give up this power though because the NAD can scream.

 

[Ohmage]

Just thought of something, your big Axiom towers have many drivers and are rated 4 ohms. That means on average they may take twice as much currents as 8 ohms speakers with similar sensitivity in the same listening environment to give you the same sound level. The T773, like the HKAVR7300 has huge power supply transformers in them. Whether that is enough to top an average power amplifier is another story. I know the T773 are rated for 4 ohms speakers, but it does not necessarily mean it can do as well as your amplifier can. Anyway, hopeful with further tweaking you will like it better. After spending 2K, you have the right to expect more.

The NAD's amplifier section is very tightly regulated, similar to the JL Audio car amplifiers; the continuous power does not double (or even change) when driving a 4 ohm load speaker, but remains the same. The receiver initially senses the speaker impedance, then adjusts it's output accordingly; you get the same "2 x 145W" continuous stereo output (or "7 x 110W" in surround mode) whether the speakers are rated 4, 6, or 8 ohms. This could be a benefit or a flaw, it depends whether you see the glass as half-full or half-empty.

Is there a bi-amp option for the T773, if you are not using the 2 rear surround channels?

Ohmage.

 

[Takeereasy]

Why don't you try out the Yamaha 4600. Gene's review had it going to 210w a channel at 4 ohms. It is a close to $2k US receiver though. So it might be a bit more than what you've spent so far. What will it hurt? Just tell the shop you want to give this one a whirl before you make up your mind 100%. After all you are spending thousands of dollars, you should be happy with what you decide on in the end. For what it's worth I love Nad gear. It is supremely functional and I haven't heard the bass problems you mentioned. Of course I haven't had the privilage of listening to a Carver setup yet either. I'm sorry it didn't go as smoothly as you were hoping for, I feel kind of Bad for helping steer you in the Nad direction now.

 

[newfmp3]

takereasy.... take it easy

You never steered me in any direction. Don't feel bad at all. I read many many many things that lead me to NAD.

As for the 4 ohm comment, the manual clearly states 2 x 145 at 8 ohm within rated distortion. Dynamic power is 2 x 230watts @ 8ohms, and 2 x 320watts @4 ohms, and 7 channel is 110W. And i totally believe it because the things is loud. I also have these old meters that I can connect to speakers to test output, and beleive me......the ratings are conservative.

I can biamp, at least in this room. But the final room has the wires already ran inside the walls, and bi-wiring would be a @#$@#.

I honestly don't think it is the amps or lack of power anyways, it's the pre-amp section that doesn't have enough bass. I proved this by sticking the carver on the front channels and using the nad and the preamp. could also just be the match of Axiom M80's and nad. Now that I do have the eq set where i want it, I have the sound I am looking for. But like I said, I was trying to not have to do that this time around. Was looking for an all in one unit for space reasons.

I am going to try to get the shop to send me a 4600. I doubt it'll happen, but I am going to at least try.

thanks for the comments, any other idea's or if anyone knows of any good eq's let me know? THe one I am using now I need it elsewhere.

 

[JohnnyCasaba]

newfmp3,

Sorry to hear you are less than thrilled with your new AVR. Just a couple of questions, maybe something is setup wrong. Did you use the EQ in your old setup with the Carver's? What CD/DVD player are you using? How do you have it hooked up to the NAD, with a digital connection or analog? Did you calibrate the sub with the mains? Are the tone controls at zero, did you try them before adding the EQ?

If nothing is wrong in the setup or with the unit, and your not happy with the sound, I would not hesitate to send it back. That is a lot of money for something you are not happy with.

 

[Ohmage]

As for the 4 ohm comment, the manual clearly states 2 x 145 at 8 ohm within rated distortion. Dynamic power is 2 x 230watts @ 8ohms, and 2 x 320watts @4 ohms, and 7 channel is 110W. And i totally believe it because the things is loud. I also have these old meters that I can connect to speakers to test output, and beleive me......the ratings are conservative.

It is "2 x 145W" continuous power into 8 ohms, but it is also "2 x 145W" continuous power into 4 ohms; the NAD's are designed in such a manner. The "2 x 320W" into 4 ohms is the rating for dynamic power or "music power", where a sudden change in the dynamics of the music lowers the impedance of the speaker, therefore demanding a surge of power from the amp momentarily. When you hook up the T773 to your M80's, the amp automatically calibrates the load as 4 ohms, and will adjust it's output to "2 x 145W" continuously. Bottomline is, the T773 cannot do "2 x 320W" continuous into 4 ohms. I am not certain what your Carver amp is rated at, but I've looked at a number of Carver amps, and they can easily double their continuous power rating when the resistance is halved.

Ohmage.

 

[smokey007]

nad is a canadian company has been for like 25 years. Ever think nad has stores other then in canada. Just because they sell nad products in the uk doesn't mean its british owned.

 

[newfmp3]

I may have the option of getting rid of the nad for a yamaha 4600. Seriously considering it.

 

[newfmp3]

anyone heard both these amps? can u comment? I know the 4600 is brand new, but it's sound should be comparable to a 2500 yes? Just more power.

I'm wondering just how much difference there is really going to be in power between the NAD and 4600. The yammie doesn't seem to be any wimp either but the power supply of the NAD is impressive. Granted, while using it, I don't feel I have this endless amount of power that people seem to praise this amp for i must say.

If the NAD had a built in EQ, it would solve most my problems. How good is the EQ in the yamaha's? How much tweaking can I really do ? Which freq's? I guess there is no GEQ as well.

I need to make this decision fairly quick.