T

TP143

Audioholic Intern
Hi everyone,

Let me first start off by thanking all the individuals that present DIY speaker designs to the DIY community. This link in the chain is a bit daunting to individuals like me and projects like the one detailed below would be unachievable if it weren't for a select few. Moving on...I am in the middle of building my second set of speakers, the highly reviewed ER18MTM's. I will document to where I am currently at, and then have presented a question at the end.

All pieces cut...



Top view of cut pieces to see the 1" thickness of each face...



Gluing sides to interior supports, which were dado jointed...



Back installed. I also added a few 1/4 inch square "runners" to each brace to ensure the polyfill will not fall through.



First cut, the recessed depth, of each circle cutout on the removeable face pieces. Notice I am pointing at a hole I drilled that was used for the curved bottom cutoff. This would be used for the center hole pin of a circle cutting jig, then rest the inner edge of the router bit against the bottom edge of your board; that is your radius. The closer the center hole is drilled to the bottom of the removeable face piece, the more drastic of a curve you will achieve. I played with various radius' here and decided on this, which I think is slightly less curved than the original design. If you decide to cut a curve this way, make sure to cut the curve prior to cutting through the speaker cutouts, otherwise you will be stuck to using a point much higher on your board where you didn't cut through.



Removeable front piece with the curve cut...



Making a mess...this is probably what the inside of my lungs looks like now.



Continued on next post...
 
T

TP143

Audioholic Intern
All holes cut and pieces ready for glue...



Bottom support pieces. Notice I cutout the bottoms, which were previously glued. I decided (after gluing of course) that I wanted removeable bottoms for easy access to the crossover. I originally intended to place the crossover behind one of the woofers but after cutting out the holes I realized this would be too tight of a squeeze to I routed out the bottom piece using a flush trim bit, then glued in these support pieces for the removeable bottom to secure against.



Chamfered backside to each speaker cutout hole. I marked where the speaker screws would secure and left these areas untouched. In between each screw hole I first routered a deep cove cut, then ran a 3/8" chamfer bit around the entire cutout. This combo really opened up the backside to airflow.



Final glueup of fronts. Notice I used more clamps here. Originally with the sides/back I placed a heavy vase on one end but was unhappy with the joint. I did this glueup in the living room since we ran into an unusually cold week and I couldn't wait.



Another glueup pic...



Onto the paint discussion. My goal is the "piano black" mirror look. After hours of research I was set on first sealing the wood somehow, then applying a few coats of primer, followed by a few coats of black paint, followed by approximately 6-8 coats of poly, followed by hours and hours of sanding. But, after visiting the local premium paint store they convinced me that I would notice better results with only applying lacquer, and of course hours and hours of sanding. So, taking their word I only bought one gallon of high gloss lacquer ($50/gallon), it was their best stuff. No priming, no polyurethane. I also picked up primer and poly just so I could test their theory. Let me first say I am no expert in paint and that I have seen the piano gloss look done right using poly and other materials that I did not use (skyline_123 comes to mind), so this is only based on my testing and my results. I cut about fifteen 10 inch squares for testing all the different combination I could think of. For sealing the wood I used zinsser sealcoat, 60/40 wood glue/water, primer, and did some pieces without sealing. For paint, I did 6 coats for every scenario. For poly I applied 6 coats to some pieces. Basically, I did every combination of seal/paint/poly that I could think of. Based on my testing, the best combination was sealing with wood glue/water, then applying paint; no poly (just as the paint shop guys said). I really wanted the poly to work, just based on everything I had read. But, in each case the poly either dried a touch cloudy or it cracked, which could have been due to a incompatibility issue I have read about with poly/lacquer. So, just sealing with wood glue/water, then applying 6 coats of lacquer, then sanding, then buffing gave me the exact mirror finish I was looking for (at least on a small square; hopefully this will be the same on the larger scale). I did seal all the edges 3 times with wood glue/water, but only sealed each face 1 time; followed by a quick sand with 220 grit before painting. I applied the lacquer via foam roller. My buddy brought over his airless gun but we couldn't get the spray right; the lacquer was just too viscous and it spat/streamed the lacquer rather than misting. This was even using the "fine finish tip" specifically for lacquer that I purchased. Oh well, the foam roller is what I had used during testing so I knew it would work.



Another view after the 6 coats were applied. I didn't paint where the removeable pieces will sit. I do plan on applying a curly maple veneer to the removeable fronts.



Now, onto my first question. I have convinced myself that the supports I glued for the bottom pieces to sit against (pictured earlier) would not be strong enough to support the speakers. Considering I will put feet on the removeable bottom pieces, all the weight, once completed, will be pushing against the bottom piece, which is pushing against these 3/4" supports. So, to remedy this I screwed in four metal braces which will pull the side of the boxes into the support equation and will give me piece of mind. But, in doing so, I had to cut down the bottom piece' length/width to accomadate the thickness of these metal supports. This will create an airgap in two places, against the support braces since the bottom piece only contacts the metal, and also around each side (see second pic). I was thinking of filling both of these areas with some rubber window seal. Will this work? Am I crazy thinking the support braces will not hold the weight of the speaker and I should just cut new bottoms that securely fit in and against the supports?





That is where I am at now. Remaining steps are to figure out the bottom piece, sand forever/buff, veneer the face piece, cutout the tweeter through-holes (I don't have a tweeter yet and the back of the ribbon is unusually shaped so I am waiting), and assemble/install the crossover. I plan on giving the lacquer one week to cure prior to sanding.

Let me know if you see anything of concern or have any other comment.

Thanks!
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Warlord
Now, onto my first question. I have convinced myself that the supports I glued for the bottom pieces to sit against (pictured earlier) would not be strong enough to support the speakers. Considering I will put feet on the removeable bottom pieces, all the weight, once completed, will be pushing against the bottom piece, which is pushing against these 3/4" supports. So, to remedy this I screwed in four metal braces which will pull the side of the boxes into the support equation and will give me piece of mind. But, in doing so, I had to cut down the bottom piece' length/width to accomadate the thickness of these metal supports. This will create an airgap in two places, against the support braces since the bottom piece only contacts the metal, and also around each side (see second pic). I was thinking of filling both of these areas with some rubber window seal. Will this work? Am I crazy thinking the support braces will not hold the weight of the speaker and I should just cut new bottoms that securely fit in and against the supports?



Really nice work and nice photos of the box assembly. Thanks :D!

As your photos show, those metal brackets on the bottom do create air gaps that can generate audible air leaks that probably will affect the bass performance. You will have to seal those gaps. I think even without the brackets, you would have to seal air leaks on the removable bottom panel.

You could use 100% silicone caulk, such as GE or other similar brands. I like the 100% silicone caulk because it doesn't shrink once you apply it.


The downside to sealing that way is opening it again will be difficult, and resealing it will require cleaning off all the old caulk.

An alternative way to seal gaps is stick-on foam weather stripping. Most weather stripping I've seen in hardware stores is made with open cell foam which could still leak on your speakers. Parts Express sells closed foam sealing tape in ⅜" and ½" widths
Gasketing Tape / Caulk in the Speaker Components Department at Parts Express | 318. That might work better.

Consider trying this:
  1. Remove the metal brackets.
  2. Make bottom boards wide enough to extend beyond the bottom edges of the cabinet walls.
  3. Cut rabbets in the edges or glue on a smaller bottom board that fits into that cut out space.
  4. Use large wood screws through the bottom board into the vertical cabinet edges to hold it in place. It doesn't have to be a tight fit like in a wood joint for gluing, use the closed-cell foam gasket tape to seal it.

One last point, when you assemble the crossover board, test fit it that space before you solder anything. Make sure any components, especially large inductor coils that may be standing on edge, actually fit under the vent tube without interfering with the tube's inside opening.
 
T

TP143

Audioholic Intern
Thanks for the suggestions Swerd! I was planning on using the stuff below for sealing but I could order some of the PE foam if it would work better. I will probably need some for the speakers anyway.



As for cutting a larger bottom and overlapping it underneath the sides, I did think about this but I wanted to minimize the joint lines in this project since they will surely show in the end. Given you think sealing would be necessary if I even removed the metal brackets and tight-fitted a new bottom piece, I think I will continue with the current application and just seal it somehow.
 
skyline_123

skyline_123

Audioholic
Nice work so far. I look forward to seeing how your finish turns out. I also dig that adjustable circle jig! One can save a lot of money making their own tools like that.
 
T

TP143

Audioholic Intern
The adjustable circle jig is a must have for this hobby! For my last build I made one similar to the jesper jig out of a thin metal sheet but I got tired of drilling new holes every time so I built this one.

One quick update, due to using a roller I noticed the "orange peel" texture and it required a bunch of sanding to take the entire surface down to the lowest point. Last weekend I accidently sanded through the finish to the bare wood, this was using a light scuff with 600 grit then a more thorough sanding with 1500. I have spent the past few nights sanding the entire cabinets down and will be painting again afterwords. This next time I will be using an HVLP and hopefully will achieve a more consistently smooth finish which will cut back on the sanding and chance of sanding through.
 
T

TP143

Audioholic Intern
Well,

I almost forgot to come back and give final impressions after finishing. I completed this build in January and have been enjoying them almost daily since. I was very happy with how the piano finish turned out, but be warned that if you are attempting this finish a great deal of patience is required. I estimate I spent 30 hours sanding these via block sander, but probably 5 hours of that was lost to a "redo" when I sanded through and was required to sand them completely down to the wood. To build off of the first paint discussion below, at first I painted 6 coats via foam roller. As can be seen by the earlier posted picture, this left a fairly large ripple texture that had to be completely removed and when I later began sanding, I sanded through to the bare wood on many areas. So, to revisit my comment that a foam roller would work, I still think it would if 8-10 or so coats were made, but I wouldn't recommend this route. I ended up purchasing a Graco HVLP, along with their finest 1.0mm tip, that laid the paint on much smoother, requiring less sanding and resulting in a lesser chance of sanding through. For anyone wanting a nice, fairly reflective finish but who isn't interested in all the sanding, I think the speakers looked great with just the 6 coats of HVLP spray using the fine tip. But, I decided to test my sanity and I got out the block sander. After about one month of sanding during the few minutes I had here and there using 600-1000-2000-3000 grits, the speakers were smooth and a quick touch of compound and polish using my random orbit polisher made these mirrors pop.

Venerring the removeable baffles proved a challenge as well. I knew wrapping around the right/left sides wouldn't be an issue using veneer softener, but the top/bottoms proved impossible due to veneer not bending against the grain. For the top/bottom, I ended up cutting the overhung veneer edge back to point at which the roundover began on the baffle face, then sanding flat to the face. For the top edge, I glued just the edge of a new veneer piece against the face veneer piece but situated so the grain was running vertically, right at the roundover, then once dried I glued the remainder and bent it over the top edge. The contrasting grain directions actually don't look odd and I don't even notice them when I try to look for them. As for the bottom edge, due to the curved baffle edge, I just couldn't figure out a way to veneer this so I left it bare, but the MDF is close enough in color and only the roundover edge shows so you can't tell the edge is bare unless you're looking for it.

Wiring the crossover and completing assembly was quick so nothing to discuss here.

Moving on to the important part - how do these sound? Honestly, when I first powered them up I was very happy. The vocals sounded as clear and open as just about any high end system I have heard, and all cost much more than my system. During more critical listening though, I began noticing a harshness to vocals and a somewhat blended sound to instruments. These just didn't have the instrument seperation that I was hoping for. I added some curtains behind the speakers and moved them closer together which helped slightly but I still wasn't completely happy. Then, I thought I would play with the stuffing. First go I removed half the stuffing from one speaker and did an A/B test. This honestly made the speaker sound like a different speaker. The harshness disappeared and the instruments opened up and seperated. The sound became a bit more bright however. I much preferred this sound to before but I decided I would let the wife decide. At the time she listened she had no idea which speaker had what stuffing, she was only told one had more that the other. Immediately, she preferred the speaker with less stuffing as well, which confirmed my test. I played with adding a little more stuffing but I found as I added more, the harsh vocals became more apparent so I settled on half the recommended amount. This was the last adjustment I made and I can say that I now I am very happy with the sound. I would say these met my expectations on the clarity, dynamics, volume w/o distortion and bass levels. They fall a bit short in the soundstage department; they just don't sound as big as some speakers I have heard in the $3-5k range. One thing that is very apparent is how directional sounding the ribbon tweeters are, and the soundstage could very well open up with the dome tweeters but without comparing them I can't say.

Overall, I am very pleased with the sound of these speakers and the challenge of building them was rewarding. These will be in the living room for a very long time and I don't think the upgrade-itis will kick in nearly as soon as it did when I built my first entry level bookshelfs.

Thanks for following my build!
 
Last edited:
darien87

darien87

Audioholic Spartan
What? No pics of the finished product?!?!? I call Shennanigans!
 
G

Grador

Audioholic Field Marshall
Absolutely beautiful. It's hard to believe they're DIY
 
GO-NAD!

GO-NAD!

Audioholic Spartan
Wow! Those look gorgeous! Are those "High Definition Speaker Cables" 720p or 1080p?:D
 
afterlife2

afterlife2

Audioholic Warlord
Those might be the most beautiful speakers I've seen. congrats and thank you for sharing. Would you mind sharing what the whole cost was? We need closeup shots. :D
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
Personally, I would have went with darker baffles.

But, if you like it then it doesn't matter what I think.

Nice work, looks very professional.
 
T

TP143

Audioholic Intern
I would put the total cost of the project at $1000. Parts, since I went with the costlier ribbon tweeter, came in at $680 and I probably had $300 into wood/glue/paint/veneer/sandpaper.

Slippery, I did consider making dark mahogany baffles but with my furniture lighter baffles blended better. I still might make a dark pair and use them interchangeably, that would be cool!
 
ARES24

ARES24

Full Audioholic
They look hideous, I think you should start from scratch. I will have to take those ones off your hands.....


VERY nice work!
 
newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top