My Denon 4310ci took a crap

Patrukas777

Patrukas777

Senior Audioholic
I was watching a movie last night and heard a loud pop-like noise (coming from speakers and receiver) and then a smoke starting coming from the top of the receiver. The receiver shut off. I reset the unit and noticed the power button was flashing red. I turned it on again, same thing happened (including the smoke). Pretty sad...I really like the unit!
 
indulger

indulger

Audioholic
I have a new one in route because my network went out. What was going on when it bit the big one? Was it cranked to the max? Speakers you were driving...impedance? 5.1 or 7.1? Fronts, wides, rears? Plenty of ventilation? Using a wall plug, strip, or power conditioner?

Your making me nervous. Gotta keep this from my ol lady. She'll go bug-eyed if I mention this.:eek:
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I have a new one in route because my network went out. What was going on when it bit the big one? Was it cranked to the max? Speakers you were driving...impedance? 5.1 or 7.1? Fronts, wides, rears? Plenty of ventilation? Using a wall plug, strip, or power conditioner?

Your making me nervous. Gotta keep this from my ol lady. She'll go bug-eyed if I mention this.:eek:
I wouldn't panic yet. Something like that don't happen very often among mid range AVRs especially Denon. I doubt low speaker impedance has much to do with it as the new Denon 4XXX apparently has pretty tightly set protective circuit.
 
H

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I was watching a movie last night and heard a loud pop-like noise (coming from speakers and receiver) and then a smoke starting coming from the top of the receiver. The receiver shut off. I reset the unit and noticed the power button was flashing red. I turned it on again, same thing happened (including the smoke). Pretty sad...I really like the unit!
Where did you get it?
 
Patrukas777

Patrukas777

Senior Audioholic
Where did you get it?
I bought it from 6ave.com. I called them a little while ago, they emailed me a UPS return label and said they will be sending me a Brand new one upon the receiving my old one :) Good company so far...hope it goes smoothly from here on out.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
I was watching a movie last night and heard a loud pop-like noise (coming from speakers and receiver) and then a smoke starting coming from the top of the receiver. The receiver shut off. I reset the unit and noticed the power button was flashing red. I turned it on again, same thing happened (including the smoke). Pretty sad...I really like the unit!
Fry ups seem to be coming thick and fast lately.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
are you referring to the Marantz...aka Pop of Death via AVS forum? Or is Denon also having the same issue?
No, it is everything, TV's, receivers , subs. Especially units with a lot of processing power from micro processors. This is an issue that will be with us for a while I'm afraid.
 
H

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
No, it is everything, TV's, receivers , subs. Especially units with a lot of processing power from micro processors. This is an issue that will be with us for a while I'm afraid.
You don't suppose it's due to power surges, do you?

Personally, I'd like to be off the grid. We have had two price increases this year and we're looking at more later. This, because Wisconsin allows WE Energies to be a monopoly.
 
Patrukas777

Patrukas777

Senior Audioholic
You don't suppose it's due to power surges, do you?

Personally, I'd like to be off the grid. We have had two price increases this year and we're looking at more later. This, because Wisconsin allows WE Energies to be a monopoly.
No, it is everything, TV's, receivers , subs. Especially units with a lot of processing power from micro processors. This is an issue that will be with us for a while I'm afraid.
Whatever it is, it really sucks. We spend a lot of money, and things don't last that long. My family has a 50+ year old refrigerator that is still running strong. I've went through 2 refrigerators the last 5 years. They definitely dont make things like the used to!..It just sucks these days, it seems as if we consumers get screwed all the time.

Hope it doesn't last that long.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
You don't suppose it's due to power surges, do you?

Personally, I'd like to be off the grid. We have had two price increases this year and we're looking at more later. This, because Wisconsin allows WE Energies to be a monopoly.
Quite likely. I know this is not popular to keep preaching this, but everybody with a significant investment in their system needs: -

Whole house surge protection.

All units containing microprocessor circuits need to be run from a smart UPS that has a response time for high and low voltage fluctuation in the range of 1 to 5 msec.

That just has to be part of the AV budget now, there is no ducking the issue.

And this is the issue as I see it: -


Increasing complexity and power of microprocessors. This causes an increase in fragility as the semiconductor layers are thinner, and more susceptible to damage.

To combat this, all units with micro processors need protection. That means whole house surge protection, not surge strips. running these units from smart UPS type devices. I think this would reduce failure by a big margin.

Avoiding sources of heat around microprocessors. Make arrangements for superior ventilation. Use separates where possible instead of receivers.

The new lead free solder is a definite issue, as it has a tendency to sprout shorting whiskers and an increased rate of dry joints.

Declining standards of chip manufacture in the worlds two largest fabricator groups, one out of China, the other out of Taiwan. This is of concern to the industry, and plans are advancing for another fabrication consortium, with factories in the Dresden area of Germany and New York.

Pushing price points too low. There really is far too much junk out there, that are a waste of resources and a contamination recycling nightmare.

All of these issues are combining to cause reliability rates to be on the decline.
 
H

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
As I have posted, I bought a Denon AVR-990, so I can demo systems and equipment. A few nights after I installed it, we had a storm roll through with some lightning and when I saw my living room lights flicker very little and for a short duration, the receiver shut off and came on again. I though nothing of it until the next AM, when I saw that my tuner presets were gone. I went into the rest of the setup and saw that it had been reset. Well, this past Monday, I left after using it for a few hours and shut it off, only to come back to no red light around the Standby button. It was stone dead. Bupkis. I removed it and installed my integrated amp, so I'd have something until I could replace the receiver. I called Denon today and asked about this kind of thing and he said that he hasn't seen more than an odd one, over a pretty long time period. Since I am a dealer and had told him this, I grilled him on the chance that he was telling me what I wanted to hear and he said he understood my comment, but he hasn't seen many go bad, especially so quickly. I asked about the level of power conditioning that Denon recommends and he said it's best to have something other than a cheap power strip.

I later called my power company and they're sending someone out to check the service from the pole to the meters (I explained that my house and garage service is up to code). Unfortunately, they no longer have/offer whole house protection- that ended in '95. I will be installing a whole house unit, though.

As far as junk- I would hope that my receiver, with a list price of $1499, isn't in that pile. Even as a dealer, I don't like needing expensive power conditioning for an AV system. I understand that we need processing power if we want what these receivers, TVs and BD players do but I think they should build more protection into them.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
As I have posted, I bought a Denon AVR-990, so I can demo systems and equipment. A few nights after I installed it, we had a storm roll through with some lightning and when I saw my living room lights flicker very little and for a short duration, the receiver shut off and came on again. I though nothing of it until the next AM, when I saw that my tuner presets were gone. I went into the rest of the setup and saw that it had been reset. Well, this past Monday, I left after using it for a few hours and shut it off, only to come back to no red light around the Standby button. It was stone dead. Bupkis. I removed it and installed my integrated amp, so I'd have something until I could replace the receiver. I called Denon today and asked about this kind of thing and he said that he hasn't seen more than an odd one, over a pretty long time period. Since I am a dealer and had told him this, I grilled him on the chance that he was telling me what I wanted to hear and he said he understood my comment, but he hasn't seen many go bad, especially so quickly. I asked about the level of power conditioning that Denon recommends and he said it's best to have something other than a cheap power strip.

I later called my power company and they're sending someone out to check the service from the pole to the meters (I explained that my house and garage service is up to code). Unfortunately, they no longer have/offer whole house protection- that ended in '95. I will be installing a whole house unit, though.

As far as junk- I would hope that my receiver, with a list price of $1499, isn't in that pile. Even as a dealer, I don't like needing expensive power conditioning for an AV system. I understand that we need processing power if we want what these receivers, TVs and BD players do but I think they should build more protection into them.
It certainly should not be junk at that price!

However I think you are asking the impossible. The receiver is not the place to deal with a surge, your entry panel is.

As far as voltage fluctuation protection and rapid disconnects from the grid, that would mean building a UPS in the receiver. In my view that is the wrong place to do it.

When I see my UPS systems act in winter during voltage drops and do rapid disconnects from the grid in the violent weather of summer, then I am very pleased I invested a lot of money in protection.

I have even gone further, in very unstable conditions, my generator will start automatically and disconnect the house from the grid at the automatic transfer switch. It does not reconnect to the grid until the power has been stable for 35 minutes.

That last part is over the top for most, but that is not the only reason I have back up power.

The last time I had a microprocessor unit fail was before I added the UPS to the system on our first level. Before that Direct TV were about to dump me. So I'm certain protection pays dividends.

I can't stress enough that when planning AV job one is power rigorous protection before ordering anything else.
 
Patrukas777

Patrukas777

Senior Audioholic
3 days ago I received my brand new 4310ci. I have to admit, I'm really impressed with 6ave.com. Aside from getting a great deal on this receiver ($1200 no tax and shipped), they have really good customer service.

The new receiver is working great. No problems at all..I updated the firmware and it works perfectly. I knew there was something wrong with the first one after I set it up. It made a few popping noises that went away. I also noticed the all menu screens (denon and cable menu's) would shake. Before it encountered the pop of death, I was watching cable tv at low volume.

I have no idea what the latest firmware did, but it does seem to give a more clear picture with whatever source is being played through the receiver.

I will let it be known should I encounter any other issues.

The receiver is driving SVS M-series speakers (2 towers, one center, and two rears) and my PB-13 ultra. I running my PS3, Xbox 360 and HD DVR (Scientific Atlanta - Charter Cable) through the receiver as well.
 
Patrukas777

Patrukas777

Senior Audioholic
Quick, send it back and hold out for the 4311CI!:eek:
I heard its coming out September...pretty far away. Maybe I'll sell this receiver and get it when it comes out. I hate when they come out with something new right after you purchase something lol....I always want more. I think the best feature is that Denon service techs can diagnose the problem with the receiver over the net and provide some maintenance. Pretty freaking cool.
 
Last edited:
indulger

indulger

Audioholic
I really don't see why they couldn't do that now with any of the networked receivers. Sounds more like a marketing tool to me.
 
T

tonedeaf

Audioholic
I heard its coming out September...pretty far away. Maybe I'll sell this receiver and get it when it comes out. I hate when they come out with something new right after you purchase something lol....I always want more. I think the best feature is that Denon service techs can diagnose the problem with the receiver over the net and provide some maintenance. Pretty freaking cool.
The only problem with that is many,many users have problems with the network,
Seems like the networking card is junk.Many,many posts on the AVS forum on this problem.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings:(
 

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