Messed up ceiling wiring

B

Bucc08

Audiophyte
Hi all...a few years back I did a Reno in my home. I hardwired in ceiling speakers on my main floor. I’ve discovered that I kind of messed it up and need some help finding a work around.

I want to split my main floor into 3 zones. I ran ceiling rated speaker wire from where the amp would be to all 3 zones. I’ve placed in wall volume controls at the end of that speaker wire.

Each zone has 2 speakers. I purchased an amp a while back. The amp has 2 channels for A and 2 channels for B. How would I wire this thing using the volume controls (I want to have the ability to adjust the volume in each area or to kill the sound). I now have 1 wire coming out from 1 channel ultimately running 2 speakers. The speakers I have are all 8 ohm

Thanks
 
G

Grant.M

Audioholic
Hi all...a few years back I did a Reno in my home. I hardwired in ceiling speakers on my main floor. I’ve discovered that I kind of messed it up and need some help finding a work around.

I want to split my main floor into 3 zones. I ran ceiling rated speaker wire from where the amp would be to all 3 zones. I’ve placed in wall volume controls at the end of that speaker wire.

Each zone has 2 speakers. I purchased an amp a while back. The amp has 2 channels for A and 2 channels for B. How would I wire this thing using the volume controls (I want to have the ability to adjust the volume in each area or to kill the sound). I now have 1 wire coming out from 1 channel ultimately running 2 speakers. The speakers I have are all 8 ohm

Thanks
If I’m reading this correctly (I may not be) you’re trying to power 3 zones (6 channels) with a 2 zone amp (4 channels),right? From what it sounds like to me you’re best bet would be to get another two channel amp, otherwise you’re putting a 16ohm load on one of the zones in your amp, which isn’t good unless it’s rated to drive that load. Do you have a wiring diagram we can go off of? @shadyJ @mtrycrafts Do you know what he could do about this?
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
If I’m reading this correctly (I may not be) you’re trying to power 3 zones (6 channels) with a 2 zone amp (4 channels),right? From what it sounds like to me you’re best bet would be to get another two channel amp, otherwise you’re putting a 16ohm load on one of the zones in your amp, which isn’t good unless it’s rated to drive that load. Do you have a wiring diagram we can go off of? @shadyJ @mtrycrafts Do you know what he could do about this?
He should get another amp for the third zone. Assuming he wired the two zones in serial for their shared amp channel, that can raise the impedance so much that it can really drop the output of the whole channel. It can be done, but its not optimal, and he may be pushing his amp harder than he thinks for a moderate amount of output.
 
G

Grant.M

Audioholic
He should get another amp for the third zone. Assuming he wired the two zones in serial for their shared amp channel, that can raise the impedance so much that it can really drop the output of the whole channel. It can be done, but its not optimal, and he may be pushing his amp harder than he thinks for a moderate amount of output.
That’s what I thought, thanks ShadyJ!
 
B

Bucc08

Audiophyte
The amp I bought is a Russound P75. I checked the manual and all it mentions is the minimum impedance of 8 ohm in stereo.

I guess my concern is that even if I get another amp, I kind of messed up because I ran 1 wire to each area that has 2 speakers. I should have run 2 wires to each area (6) instead of 3. So even if I get another amp, how would I wire them properly?
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
The amp I bought is a Russound P75. I checked the manual and all it mentions is the minimum impedance of 8 ohm in stereo.

I guess my concern is that even if I get another amp, I kind of messed up because I ran 1 wire to each area that has 2 speakers. I should have run 2 wires to each area (6) instead of 3. So even if I get another amp, how would I wire them properly?
Are you saying that you ran a four conductor cable to each zone/volume control from the head end (where the equipment lives)?
 
B

Bucc08

Audiophyte
Are you saying that you ran a four conductor cable to each zone/volume control from the head end (where the equipment lives)?
That’s the thing....I didn’t. So no matter how many amps I get (which I agree I need another one), I still have 1 speaker wire (16g) running to each zone which will run 2 speakers.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
That’s the thing....I didn’t. So no matter how many amps I get (which I agree I need another one), I still have 1 speaker wire (16g) running to each zone which will run 2 speakers.
Well you will have to open up your ceilings and walls, or scrap what you did and go with a radio based system like Sonus. Your third option is to go for a mono, and not stereo set up.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
That’s the thing....I didn’t. So no matter how many amps I get (which I agree I need another one), I still have 1 speaker wire (16g) running to each zone which will run 2 speakers.
What kind of volume controls did you use? If they have impedance compensation, you can connect two or more speakers (depending on whether it can use that many). If your speakers aren't positioned so they would provide a good stereo image (honestly, if it's for distribution, don't worry about that, you may be able to set the receiver's Zone 2 and/or Zone 3 to mono and your problem is solved.

Otherwise, get ready to make some holes.
 
B

Bucc08

Audiophyte
What kind of volume controls did you use? If they have impedance compensation, you can connect two or more speakers (depending on whether it can use that many). If your speakers aren't positioned so they would provide a good stereo image (honestly, if it's for distribution, don't worry about that, you may be able to set the receiver's Zone 2 and/or Zone 3 to mono and your problem is solved.

Otherwise, get ready to make some holes.
Thanks for the input everyone. Making holes isn’t an option. I don’t mind mono. We just want to listen to music. I took a pic of the volume control.
C4A85F2E-EC3F-49AA-9DFF-83C369B6702E.jpeg
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Thanks for the input everyone. Making holes isn’t an option. I don’t mind mono. We just want to listen to music. I took a pic of the volume control. View attachment 30606
That picture is no help. We need make and model number please. The only thing that picture tells me is that the output side is likely wired incorrectly.
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
What are your expectations or goals for those 3 areas on the lower floor?
Is this only for background music? Or, one zone for stereo operation but not important for the others?
Run all 3 areas/zones individually with same or different programs or a mix?

If you are satisfied with mono going to each area, there may be a solution.
 
C

Crazy8s846

Audioholic
If the wires are not going to catch on anything you could maybe tie more wires to the one you ran , and use it like a wire snake an pull the new wires with the one you already ran.Just make sure they are connected togeather really good so they dont come apart but depends on how you ran them if its a pretty straight run should work.
 
G

Grant.M

Audioholic
If the wires are not going to catch on anything you could maybe tie more wires to the one you ran , and use it like a wire snake an pull the new wires with the one you already ran.Just make sure they are connected togeather really good so they dont come apart but depends on how you ran them if its a pretty straight run should work.
That’s a solid idea there!
 
T

tonyE

Junior Audioholic
Honestly, it looks like you ran speaker wire into the volume pots... ideally you would have run a back haul infrared relay remote control to a line level preamp driving an amp that drives one speaker per channel.

A possibility is to forget the in wired and go wireless. Get some active wireless speakers and connect them to your source.

Now, let me ask you.. what is your source like? Do you have your music in a network? Do you want in walls or are you OK with speakers mounted on a shelf or a stand? If the latter, you could set it up so that you have something like this:

A cheap Android Tablet.
Run something like VLC media player.
Something like a NuForce DAC-2 that connects to your tablet via a power OTG USB cable.
Run USB power into the cable.
Take the output of the DAC to either active speakers or get a Parasound Z-Amp and drive your speakers.
If running an NAS with an MP server you can connect directly via VLC over WiFi. The latest VLC player supports MP players directly, it will find them when you search the network.
If running a simple network with a WiFi access point you can connect the tablet to the computer holding your media files over WiFi and play the music files directly via VLC. You can use ES File Explorer for this.

I do this in two of my rooms at home since my digital audio files are in an NAS. I also have three other systems that are connected via Ethernet ( my main HT works that way).

Admittedly this is a bit complicated but it gives you total flexibility. I take one of my tablets outdoors and use headphones.

I did hard wire my HT's side and rear speakers in ceiling speaker but again, that's a one amp channel to one speaker cable. No volume control at speaker level. A 7.1 controller runs the system, all in one room.

Eons ago, before our complete house rebuild, I put built in ADS L300s in my living room walls with a back haul remote control ( infrared pickup with its own wire to an infrared transmitter) that controlled a dedicated receiver in the den. That worked great. I think this is what you would have wanted to do, huh?

Honestly, I think you miss wired the system for multi zone stereo. You are going to have to rethink how you want to take music around the house.

If you want to keep your inwalls, you need to control the volume before the amp not after. And assign one amplifier channel per speaker. That might mean ripping into the walls, again.

OTOH, if you don't care about keeping the in walls, you can go with active wireless speakers, but you will still have to drive a wire between them and a power cable to the main speaker in each zone.

Sorry.
 
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