Looking for new sub. Need advice.

[Blackhawk95]

Hello Guys.

I'm about to finish up my new home and I have most of my stuff so far for my 7.1 setup. Just a bit left, and would like some sub reccomendations.

First. 85% of use will be for HT the rest split between gaming and music.
The room measures out at 1800cuft.

I already have the following.
Yamaha rx-a2020 receiver.
Def Tech cs-8060 center channel.
DT studio monitor 350 left and right.
DT pro monitor 1000 surround and back surround.

So, what I'm looking for is a capable $1000 or less sub that will last a good while to where I can use for years and grow the other components when I can.

So far, I have three different models in mind, they are.


1 svs sb or pb 1200. Read really good reviews on both models. And if I understand correctly. The vented subs will go lower and play louder?

2 power sound audio. Sv or xs 15. Again, read great reviews on these also.

Finally. Jl e110. I found a new one for $1050.00. A bit more than I really want to spend. It's sealed from what I've read but has a 1200 watt amp.

So, of the three listed. What do you guys say? I'd also like some input on the sealed vs. ported and if I would really be able to tell much difference? And, if you guys have any reccomendations on some or models or brands I should check out. I'm all ears. I'm looking to place an order in the next 10-14 days.

Much thanks,
Jerid

 

[Pyrrho]

I would go with SVS. They are always good, always a good value, and they have a good warranty and good customer service.

Now, if you want to search for professional reviews in which the subwoofers are actually measured, go ahead. It is possible that you will find one is a better performer than the comparably priced SVS. But it would have to be much better to be worth giving up the good warranty and good customer service. And I don't think you will find one much better at comparable prices.

As for ported versus sealed, I would go with ported in most cases. If you had an infinite budget and room for a couple dozen subwoofers, then it might be better to go sealed, because below the tuning point, a sealed subwoofer will generally drop off slower than a comparable ported subwoofer. Generally, above the tuning point, the ported subwoofer will be capable of higher volumes than a comparable sealed subwoofer. You can see this by comparing graphs of frequency response at SVS. You can even look at one graph for their models that have variable tuning and allow for a sealed option.

So, I would go for the best ported subwoofer I could get from SVS. If you want to save a bit of money, go for the cylinder version instead of the box version. The cylinder version will be lighter due to the fact that a curved surface is inherently stronger than a flat surface, so for the same strength it can be thinner and lighter. The shape is also easier to grab onto, so they are much easier to move. The cylinder versions also take up less floor space, though they are taller than the box versions.

 

[Basshead81]

I would look at the PSA XV15 or SVS PB2000...both companies make excellent products and offer industry leading warranties. If you are looking for absolute max output the XV15 would be a better choice. However The PB2000 will offer a more linear response and have less thd when pushed to its limits. How much of that is actually audible is to be questioned.

 

[Blackhawk95]

Thanks you guys.

I did mess up the SVS model munbers, Its SB 2000. My brain was about fried from reading reviews. Do you guys think the build quality may be better on thy SVS vs. the Power Sound? But the Power sound Is the same price as the SVS but, has a 15" woofer vs. 12", both have 500 watt amps but, two different brands.

Im also curious for some input on the JL. I read some really good reviews about it late last night.

Thanks.

Jerid

 

[Blackhawk95]

Please, include some thoughts about is subwoofer vs. the others ULS-15 Subwoofer?

 

[Basshead81]

The build quality on PSA subs is nothing short of amazing...very inert cabinets and everything is built/assembled in the USA minus the amplifier and driver motor(magnet). The ULS-15 is a great sub but I would not run in the 15hz setting or else it runs out of headroom rather quickly from the eq boost down low. If you want alot of sub 30hz bass from sealed subs you need to purchase multiples, if that is not a option then ported is the best option.

 

[lsiberian]

Ported if you have the space and won't be doing much moving.

 

[Pyrrho]

Thanks you guys.

I did mess up the SVS model munbers, Its SB 2000. My brain was about fried from reading reviews. Do you guys think the build quality may be better on thy SVS vs. the Power Sound? But the Power sound Is the same price as the SVS but, has a 15" woofer vs. 12", both have 500 watt amps but, two different brands.

Im also curious for some input on the JL. I read some really good reviews about it late last night.

Thanks.

Jerid

Never, ever buy a subwoofer based on the driver size or amplifier power. You should look at its actual performance. What matters is the SPL levels you can get without too much distortion, and the flatness and depth of the frequency response. It does not matter what size driver was used to get it.

This means, to compare, you need to find professional reviews in which they are actually measured. And the measurement technics used must be pretty much identical to be able to compare them.

 

[Basshead81]

Never, ever buy a subwoofer based on the driver size or amplifier power. You should look at its actual performance. What matters is the SPL levels you can get without too much distortion, and the flatness and depth of the frequency response. It does not matter what size driver was used to get it.

This means, to compare, you need to find professional reviews in which they are actually measured. And the measurement technics used must be pretty much identical to be able to compare them.

Quoted for truth!!

 

[Blackhawk95]

I'm getting the feeling Phyrro know what he's talking about. since in all my other posts He's quoted.

After sleeping on it last night. Right now I've 90% decided to with the Power Sound, keep the current receiver I have and concentrate on finding a pair of from towers.

Jerid

 

[jinjuku]

The unspoken sleeper sub:

Dayton Audio RS1202K 1000 Watt Dual 12" Subwoofer Kit | 300-766

 

[Blackhawk95]

That's a nice looking kit. However, I don't have the time right now to build or assemble speaker. And I've narrowed my search to the following two subs.

So let me ask this, I have a chance to get a Power Sound XS30 slightly used, for around $1000. or a new XV15 for $799.00 Should I get the XS30 for only a couple hindered bucks extra?





Jerid

 

[jinjuku]

It takes an hour and a screw driver. Shrugs...

 

[Pyrrho]

I'm getting the feeling Phyrro know what he's talking about. since in all my other posts He's quoted.

After sleeping on it last night. Right now I've 90% decided to with the Power Sound, keep the current receiver I have and concentrate on finding a pair of from towers.

Jerid

I do know what I'm talking about. But don't simply take my word for it; if you are up for some research, read as many articles from reputable sources as you can.

In the case of speaker size versus performance, if you are a car guy, think of engine size versus horsepower. They are not at all interchangeable. The size does not tell you the performance; it just tells you the size.

Keeping with the car analogy, the power of the amp is a little bit like telling you the gas tank size of a car. Without knowing the mileage, you are not going to have any idea how far you can go on a full tank. And with a speaker, without knowing the sensitivity of the speaker, you are not going to know how loud it will get with any given power input.

It is really strange the way that subwoofer manufacturers always tell you useless information, but do not tell you what really matters. Maximum SPL with a given amount of distortion is good to know, and very important for performance. But pretty much no one tells you that. You do, however, often get claims about frequency response, which is useful, but not enough on its own, as a great frequency response is not much use if it is all going to be at an SPL level that is too low to be useful.

 

[shadyJ]

It takes an hour and a screw driver. Shrugs...

I think that kit would be pretty good. The drivers are 8 ohm versions of the HF Dayton drivers, so very low distortion and high linearity and not too taxing on the amp. The cabinet is likely totally inert given its weight and dual opposed design. The only problem is the plate amp has a 18 Hz rumble filter, so no 12dB/octave roll-off below 20 Hz which would net some deep frequency room gain. Anyway the bass from that promises to be extremely clean and flat. But its not quite the sub for someone who just wants loud explosions, a Power Sound sub will probably do that better for the dollar.

 

[Basshead81]

That's a nice looking kit. However, I don't have the time right now to build or assemble speaker. And I've narrowed my search to the following two subs.

So let me ask this, I have a chance to get a Power Sound XS30 slightly used, for around $1000. or a new XV15 for $799.00 Should I get the XS30 for only a couple hindered bucks extra?





Jerid

Look in the For Sale section over at AVS...there are a couple XV subs for sale and the price is negotiable. I agree with shady that the dayton kit would probably offer the most bang for buck and probably offer less thd when pushed, but that does not mean the power sound subs are bad. Diy obviously offers the most for your money if you are willing to put in some effort. After hearing a budget dayton sub1200, I will say Dayton offers some incredible performance for little coin. The sub1500 for 199.00 has got to be insane for the money.

 

[jinjuku]

I think that kit would be pretty good. The drivers are 8 ohm versions of the HF Dayton drivers, so very low distortion and high linearity and not too taxing on the amp. The cabinet is likely totally inert given its weight and dual opposed design. The only problem is the plate amp has a 18 Hz rumble filter, so no 12dB/octave roll-off below 20 Hz which would net some deep frequency room gain. Anyway the bass from that promises to be extremely clean and flat. But its not quite the sub for someone who just wants loud explosions, a Power Sound sub will probably do that better for the dollar.

I wouldn't go there quite so fast. I've designed and personally have several subs based on the Dayton and Infinity drivers. Both ported and sealed. You would be how surprised you would give up a bit of low end extension for the slam that the Dayton dual opposed has, that the PSA or SVS won't have, at the 40-60hz range.

My ported Kappa 120.w9 can't touch my dual opposed Reference 1260's in that chest slam area. My friend Eddy gave up one of his two ported Kappa's to put in a dual opposed + the ported. Integrated with a Crown XTi 4002.

The Parts Express amp has 6Db of boost available for bringing up the bottom end. Sorry I don't see the PSA, when all said and done, outperforming the Dayton through entire subwoofer range. It's not all about 16Hz.

I think you are selling the poster short IMO.

 

[Basshead81]

I wouldn't go there quite so fast. I've designed and personally have several subs based on the Dayton and Infinity drivers. Both ported and sealed. You would be how surprised you would give up a bit of low end extension for the slam that the Dayton dual opposed has, that the PSA or SVS won't have, at the 40-60hz range.

My ported Kappa 120.w9 can't touch my dual opposed Reference 1260's in that chest slam area. My friend Eddy gave up one of his two ported Kappa's to put in a dual opposed + the ported. Integrated with a Crown XTi 4002.

The Parts Express amp has 6Db of boost available for bringing up the bottom end. Sorry I don't see the PSA, when all said and done, outperforming the Dayton through entire subwoofer range. It's not all about 16Hz.

I think you are selling the poster short IMO.

So you are saying that dayton kit has more 40-60hz slam then a XS30? Tom V's cea2010 40-63 numbers show the XS30 putting out 122db 2m rms(131db 1m peak). If the Dayton bests that then that is nothing short of amazing.

 

[shadyJ]

I wouldn't go there quite so fast. I've designed and personally have several subs based on the Dayton and Infinity drivers. Both ported and sealed. You would be how surprised you would give up a bit of low end extension for the slam that the Dayton dual opposed has, that the PSA or SVS won't have, at the 40-60hz range.

My ported Kappa 120.w9 can't touch my dual opposed Reference 1260's in that chest slam area. My friend Eddy gave up one of his two ported Kappa's to put in a dual opposed + the ported. Integrated with a Crown XTi 4002.

The Parts Express amp has 6Db of boost available for bringing up the bottom end. Sorry I don't see the PSA, when all said and done, outperforming the Dayton through entire subwoofer range. It's not all about 16Hz.

I think you are selling the poster short IMO.

Between the two subs, I would go for the Dayton kit, but I wouldn't expect it to have as much overall output as the XS30, especially in the range you cited, 40 to 60 Hz. The greater woofer surface are and likely greater xmax means more displacement, plus the driver that the Dayton kit is using isn't extraordinarily sensitive at 84.5 dB, a likely consequence of the greater impedance. I do think the Dayton kit would be better behaved though, and may give you a more even a cleaner performance for a greater part of the dynamic range of the bass spectrum.

The 15" Dayton HF looks like it could be used to great effect for a system with good fundamental performance. It's not an output monster, but it's not terribly expensive, and it should give you nice clean flat bass down pretty deep. A nice Le and 18 Hz Fs is encouraging to build up on, a few dual opposed cabinets of those wouldn't cost a huge amount and would give you lots of very linear and clean bass down pretty low. It would be nice to have a 18" version of the HF driver, although I doubt that will ever happen, I think Dayton thinks that guys who go for 18"s are more concerned about sheer output than low distortion, so we will only have the HO and Ultimax of those.

 

[jinjuku]

So you are saying that dayton kit has more 40-60hz slam then a XS30? Tom V's cea2010 40-63 numbers show the XS30 putting out 122db 2m rms(131db 1m peak). If the Dayton bests that then that is nothing short of amazing.

I was referring to the XV15. New vs New.