Looking for a 5.1 setup!! $4k

S

sharmaravi

Enthusiast
Hello Everyone!!

After saving for more than a year I think now I am ready to buy my first set up. I am looking for a 5.1 setup for my media room. My room is 19.5' x 20.5' x 9'. I know the dimensions are not ideal but i plan to add treatments to the room. It will used 50/50 for music and movies.

My comfortable budget is 4000 for 5.1 speakers. Now if another 1-2k buys me something significantly better sounding I can increase the budget. So I am auditioning speakers which are out of my comfort zone as well.

This is going to be my first ever speaker setup and I do not have ears of an audiophile therefore I will need your help to get the wow factor for my room. WAF is not an issue and definitely want floorstanding speakers for the fronts.

I am auditioning 2 channel setups and will get the 5.0 set for the ones I finalize (sub from either svs or av123).
Here is the list of speakers I plan to audition. (I have already listened to some of them)

1. B&W 683, cm7s, 703
2. Paradigm Studio 60, 100
3. Monitor Audio RS6/8, GS20
4. Dynaudio Focus 220
5. Dali Ikon 6
6. Revel Concerta F12
7. PSB Image T65
8. Def Tech 7002 bipolars.
9. Energy ???
10. Thiel ???
11. Vienna Acoustics ???

So far I have listened to Paradigms and PSBs and Studio 100 sound the best to me. I plan to audition Monitor Audios tomorrow and Dynaudios, B&Ws on saturday.

Any comments/recommendations will be greatly appreciated.
 
WmAx

WmAx

Audioholic Samurai
Hello Everyone!!

After saving for more than a year I think now I am ready to buy my first set up. I am looking for a 5.1 setup for my media room. My room is 19.5' x 20.5' x 9'. I know the dimensions are not ideal but i plan to add treatments to the room. It will used 50/50 for music and movies.

My comfortable budget is 4000 for 5.1 speakers. Now if another 1-2k buys me something significantly better sounding I can increase the budget. So I am auditioning speakers which are out of my comfort zone as well.

This is going to be my first ever speaker setup and I do not have ears of an audiophile therefore I will need your help to get the wow factor for my room. WAF is not an issue and definitely want floorstanding speakers for the fronts.

I am auditioning 2 channel setups and will get the 5.0 set for the ones I finalize (sub from either svs or av123).
Here is the list of speakers I plan to audition. (I have already listened to some of them)

1. B&W 683, cm7s, 703
2. Paradigm Studio 60, 100
3. Monitor Audio RS6/8, GS20
4. Dynaudio Focus 220
5. Dali Ikon 6
6. Revel Concerta F12
7. PSB Image T65
8. Def Tech 7002 bipolars.
9. Energy ???
10. Thiel ???
11. Vienna Acoustics ???

So far I have listened to Paradigms and PSBs and Studio 100 sound the best to me. I plan to audition Monitor Audios tomorrow and Dynaudios, B&Ws on saturday.

Any comments/recommendations will be greatly appreciated.
Will you buy used? Doing that gets you a lot more performance for the dollar.

For example, if you get used B&W 801 Matrix II or III from the late 1980's, a pair can be had for 2000-3000 USD. It is still measurably comparable to speakers in the $15000-$25000 range today that are new. Get a pair of these and then B&W's best center channel and two budget level B&Ws for the rear surrounds and you will be within your budget and have something of a quality that could not have been acquired if purchased new.

BTW, if you have the room, it's even better(ideal) to get a 2nd pair of the 801 Matrix and use one of the units as the center channel(and just don't use the extra one) so you have perfect matched front L to C to R transitions and timbre matching.

-Chris
 
C

chadnliz

Senior Audioholic
If you like Thiel check out Vandersteen, great value easy to do in your budget and a long term purchase you wont likely regret.
If you are willing to stretch a bit and buy used add Legacy to your list, the Focus 20/20 and cinema center along with Legacy surrounds are doable, my father owned this set up for 5 yrs and its great..and beautiful build too!
To be honest you have a good list there, Dali, BW and Dynaudo and Revel or even Def Tech would be my top picks of those listed..........after my first idea:)
 
mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Warlord
I am auditioning 2 channel setups and will get the 5.0 set for the ones I finalize (sub from either svs or av123).
Here is the list of speakers I plan to audition. (I have already listened to some of them)

1. B&W 683, cm7s, 703
2. Paradigm Studio 60, 100
3. Monitor Audio RS6/8, GS20
4. Dynaudio Focus 220
5. Dali Ikon 6
6. Revel Concerta F12
7. PSB Image T65
8. Def Tech 7002 bipolars.
9. Energy ???
10. Thiel ???
11. Vienna Acoustics ???
IMO you are doing yourself a dis-service if you don't put these speakers on your list.

SVS MTS-01 Full size 5.1 channel system with matching PB13-Ultra $4400
http://www.svsound.com/products-sys-mts01.cfm
 
D

deedubb

Full Audioholic
That's a great list and I'm sure you will be happy with any of them. IMO, I wouldn't waste your time auditioning 5.0. If 2 channel sounds good, it will sound good in 5.0 (5.1). I would audition as many on your list as you can and buy the ones you like best. Ask 10 people here and you will get 10 different answers. If this is primarily for movies, make sure you audition the Def Techs.
 
ParadigmDawg

ParadigmDawg

Audioholic Overlord
You have a great list there, stick to it and add anything you can.
 
S

sharmaravi

Enthusiast
I will consider buying used only if I can see (and maybe hear) them in person first. I do not want to risk it.

Mazer, I knew you were going to suggest SVS. I would love to add them to my list but I will only consider something that I can hear in person.

I know the ID companies offer 30 day money back but that wont work for me because I am just starting and do not have any equipment to run the speakers. I plan to buy something after I finalize the speakers. My only audio setup is in my car (acura rdx tech 2008) which I think sounds pretty decent.

I am only auditioning 2 channel setup. If the dealer has 5.1 already setup, I ask him to play a movie clip otherwise its just 2 channel.

I am adding Vandersteen to the list.
 
ParadigmDawg

ParadigmDawg

Audioholic Overlord
You could actually just listen to the Paradigm, B&W and Dynaudio and be done with it, get them home and start enjoying:D
I will consider buying used only if I can see (and maybe hear) them in person first. I do not want to risk it.

Mazer, I knew you were going to suggest SVS. I would love to add them to my list but I will only consider something that I can hear in person.

I know the ID companies offer 30 day money back but that wont work for me because I am just starting and do not have any equipment to run the speakers. I plan to buy something after I finalize the speakers. My only audio setup is in my car (acura rdx tech 2008) which I think sounds pretty decent.

I am only auditioning 2 channel setup. If the dealer has 5.1 already setup, I ask him to play a movie clip otherwise its just 2 channel.

I am adding Vandersteen to the list.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Please do us a huge favor and write down all your impressions and thoughts while they are fresh in your memory from the auditions. With so many speakers, it may be difficult to remember which is which.:D So please write down your thoughts on each speaker as you go.

And please bring the same EXACT CD to listen to on all the speakers!!!
This way you can compare better.

And make sure all the receivers are in Pure Direct or Direct modes.
 
S

sharmaravi

Enthusiast
I am using same set of songs for auditioning. Only problem is, as I mentioned before, I do not think my ears are trained to notice the differences and pin point the weakness. I can only say this speaker sound better to me than the other. I will still try my best and see how it goes.

So far I have listened to Klipsch RF-63, PSB Image 65 and Paradigm Studio 100 and I like 100s among them. It was very easy to eliminate Klipsch (just for my ears) and PSBs were very good but 100s were definitely better.
 
WmAx

WmAx

Audioholic Samurai
I will consider buying used only if I can see (and maybe hear) them in person first. I do not want to risk it.
So far, I have not noticed one speaker recommended or mentioned in this thread that is remotely in the same measurable performance (weighted to human perception) league as the B&W 801 Series II/III.

There is nothing to risk, buying the used B&W speakers I recommended. These are incredibly neutral speakers with no audible resonance(very rare and very important for true high fidelity), extreme dynamic range ability and good off axis response. You can literally use a powerful DSP like the Behringer DCX2496 as an example, and adjust the response curve to sound like virtually anything you want, due to the inherent neutrality you are starting off with on this superb monopolar speaker system. You simply can not do that on the overwhelming majority of speakers due to their inherent coloration that is already in the speaker - you can't just use an electronic device to rid them of most of their problems. Can you imagine being able to get virtually the perfect ideal sound for your preferences(within the constraints of the dispersion characteristics and room acoustics, which is another subject)? It is possible with a speaker of the quality of this combined with the appropriate DSP hardware.

Measurement set of 801 Matrix II : http://www.stereophile.com/historical/506/index7.html

-Chris
 
Last edited:
S

sharmaravi

Enthusiast
Ok here is the update. Last saturday I started at 10:30 and was auditioning until 4pm. My wife was also with me. I made a CD with 6 songs for the audition, I did the best I could to make a lossless CD (using EAC to rip and then burn at slow speed). Here is the list of the songs.

1. Dil Se - Dil Se(Indian movie soundtrack)
2. E Ajnabi - Dil Se(Indian movie soundtrack)
3. Money for Nothing - Dire Straits
4. Don't Tread On Me - Metallica
5. No Complaints - Beck
6. Motocade - Beck
and
7. Hotel California - Eagle DTS CD

I wanted to add few more songs but could not stay up late on Friday night.

Anyhow, here is my take of the 4 brands that I auditioned on saturday plus on PSB T65.

1. B&W 703 : Beautiful looking speaker. Last year I auditioned them and liked them a lot. It was the first time I listed to real speakers (when compared to my $30 desktop speakers). Well, this time they sounded very bright. I could not turn up the volume much. My wife was covering her ears with her hands. We were really surprised as we thought this time as well we will be equally impressed.

2. Monitor Audio GS20: Again nice looking speakers, not as bright as B&Ws. Top end was very clean and crisp and lots of bass. Although there was more than enough bass but it did not sound clean to me. While playing Beck - motorcade, i could not hear the bass clearly (muddled, mixed, dont know how to describe it) in the beginning of the song.

3. Paradigm Studio 100: Nice big speakers. I loved their looks. They sounded great as well. To me, midrange was much better than the others and I liked them a lot. They would be great for rock music and HT as well, thats what I feel. I liked every song on my CD on these speakers.

4. Dynaudio Focus 220: Much smaller than Studios but they sound amazing. Very neutral, very crisp, clear and lush sound from top to bottom. Bass was great and tight. I enjoyed every song I played and was highly impressed. I could hear them all day long. This is the sound I was looking for.

5. PSB Image T65: I auditioned them 2 weeks back. Same songs. They had a very nice sound but got a little muddy somewhere in between. I did not enjoy the first song (Dil Se) that much on these.

Okay, I tried to explain the best way I could and as you already know this is the feedback from my ears. In conclusion, so far Dynaudios and Paradigms sound the best to me and between the two I would prefer Dynaudios. Surprisingly, my wife had the same conclusion. She also loved Dynaudios.

Now here is the situation, dealer had a pair of focus 220 demos and offered me abt 15% discount on them. I need to ask him how much for the whole 5.0 package (with 200c & 110 pair). (Any advice on negotiting skills is highly appreciated since I lack the skills there) Only problem with dyns, and that is a big problem for me, is that they need a very good amp to drive them which obviously costs a lot. As you can see I have to stretch my budget already for the 5.0 set, stretching again for rec/amp is impossible at the moment. My current budget for receiver is 1500 and no budget for amp. I might be able to add abt 1k more in a years time (total max 2-2.5k).

I read the complete Dynaudio thread on avsforum (87 pages) and everybody over there is using very expensive amps (simaudio, parasound, musical fidelity, bryston etc etc), way out of my league. If somebody can suggest me a cheaper option to drive these speakers without compromising the sound, I am all for Dynaudios.

If Dyns dont work out, I would continue auditioning and see if I like anything else or will buy Paradigms which were pretty close. I know even with Paradigms, having more power is preferred but as some of the forum members have done, I can opt for less expensive amps like emotive/outlaw etc.
 
J

jostenmeat

Audioholic Spartan
If you love the Dyns, get em. No second guessing. You took the time to go out and listen, and amazingly, a lot of people don't even go that far.

anyhoo, the fastest I've ever seen a price drop was mentioning to a dealer, "hey, I saw this on Audiogon for $x,xxx".... That's just my experience. I only said it once, maybe twice, out of double digit dealers I went to. Fastest price drop ever. I can't even tell you some of the prices I scored or else I'd probably get both myself and dealers into trouble.

btw, I've seen Contour towers sell for $2k before on the gon. Of course, that sold in a blink of an eye.

-jostenmeat
 
ParadigmDawg

ParadigmDawg

Audioholic Overlord
You should easily be able to negotiate 15% off everything brand new, not demo stuff. As far as skill is concerned, you have to learn that on your own.
 
Spkr_Bldr

Spkr_Bldr

Full Audioholic
Congrats on the Dynaudio setup! I'm sure you'll enjoy it for a long time.

The good thing when considering an amp is that those speakers are pretty forgiving. They're not one of those speakers that's voiced on the edge of being too forward, so you can get away with a lot of different electronics pairings.

Just wondering though, why are you thinking of a receiver and an amp? Are you planning on using any of the internal receiver amp channels? You rate 2-channel reproduction as a high priority, is a pre-amp with HT bypass something you're considering?
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Yeah, I say as a "rule of thumb" you should strive for 20-30% off anything you buy.

Here is what I suggest. Go online/internet and search far and wide for prices. Then take it to your dealer.

Ask him for a 30-Day Return policy without a Re-stocking fee.

Then take the speakers home for a TRUE audition. The store audition is the first step, but it does not guarantee a great sound in your own home.

If it sounds great in your home, tell your dealer that you are willing to keep these speakers if he could give you the 20-30% off retail. Otherwise you would have to return them.
 
S

sharmaravi

Enthusiast
Thanks a lot guys for yours suggestions and information. Lets see how does it go with my dealer. I looked a lot online for the prices, I have read people getting 15-25% on dynaudios. Used on audigon go for about 50% MSRP.

Spkr_Bldr, I have not bought the dyns yet but i am trying. About the preamp/rec, I was thinking of receiver so that I can get hdmi, video upscaling etc and maybe use the amp channels to drive the rears. Haven't put much thought into electronics yet.
 
G

gus6464

Audioholic Samurai
An Emotiva XPA-5 would probably power those speakers with ease while still having a lot of power on tap. I don't know what your budget is for receiver and amps but if you are strapped you could give pro amps a try.
 
S

sharmaravi

Enthusiast
Hello Everyone,

I ordered the dynaudios today at the local dealer (220, 200c, 110 in cherry finish). They should arrive in a couple of weeks.

Now, I need help in deciding the equipment to run them. Would like to decide soon (with your help) so that everything is here in 2 weeks.

I would like to have the capability of enjoying the newer HD codecs. I do not have any dvd collection and will be buying only blurays.

Based on the comments so far, here is the shortlist. Please add your recommendations in my budget (1.5-2k for all equipment).

Amp (multichannel preferred to avoid too many power cords)
1. Rotel 1075 or 1085 (used or new)
2. Parasound 2205A (used)
3. NAD (please recommend models, there are so many, new/used??)
4. Anthem (please recommend models, new/used??)
5. Emotiva XPS-5
6.

PrePro
1. Arcam AVP700 (used, does not have Audio over hdmi / HD Audio)
2. NAD T175 (used, still expensive, HD Audio??)
3. ??

Receiver
1. Arcam AVR350 (used, does not have Audio over hdmi / HD Audio)
2. Yamaha 663 (it has new audio codecs, used as a prepro with an amp)
3. ??


As of now, I am thinking getting Rotel 1075 or Parasound 2205 with Yamaha 663 (to enjoy the new audio codecs and easy on wallet). Another option (if SQ of the prevoius option is significantly lower) is to get Arcam/NAD prepro plus an amp or Arcam AVR350 and upgrade later for HD audio.

What do you guys suggest??
 
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