Let's Try This Again: How Can I Be Sure the 605 is Passing 1080p Straight Through?

[ClinicaTerra]

It's beginning to bug me now: could my Onkyo TX-SR605 be "degrading" or "robbing" the 1080p signal from my Blu-ray player before it gets to the display?

Let me sum up my setup once more: a Panasonic DMP-BD10A is going HDMI OUT (only; for audio AND video transfer) to the Onkyo 605's HDMI IN (1)...from there, a second HDMI cable is going from the 605's HDMI OUT to a Sony KDS-50A2020 rear projection display's HDMI IN (Video 6)...that's it -- no other connections for audio or video...

Now, the problem is, when I play Blu-rays, the quality is just not there -- making me suspect the receiver is somehow degrading the signal chain somehow...I know the answer would be to swap out the cable and run the player direct to the display but I can't get to the rear of the system in any easy manner and I would like to see if could sort it out like this first.

When I press the Sony's "Display" button on the remote, it indeed indicates "1080p" as the incoming resolution from the Panasonic player -- I keep the player on AUTO HDMI resolution, which "selects" 1080p for my set, so that "should" be right. The issue is, I am running an HDMI loop through my receiver and I don't know if TRUE 1080p is passing to the screen because most high definition films just don't look that "great"...

First of all, does this sound like it's all hooked up correctly? That is, HDMI OUT (for audio AND video over one HDMI cable) of the Blu-ray player to HDMI IN of the Onkyo receiver (for surround decoding of Dolby Digital, DTS, passing of PCM tracks, etc.)...and then a second HDMI cable from the receiver's HDMI OUT to the display's HDMI IN (for video transfer)...in this scenario, should all audio and video pass with no problems? Could this receiver be a weak link in the chain? Again, my TV is confirming that 1080p is the incoming resolution, but Blu-ray discs don't really "pop" off my screen like I am told they should. Should I be concerned that the video is running through the receiver before it reaches the display? Can I trust the HDMI 1.3 repeaters in the Onkyo?

When I get some kind of confirmation from one of you kind folks on here that at least the setup is correct, I can move on to other issues I have been experiencing...

Thank you in advance, anyone that can assist.

 

[mike c]

connect your player directly to the TV.*

call us in the morning.

*Note - only valid if not interested in running HD audio

 

[jamie2112]

connect your player directly to the TV.

call us in the morning.

That would be my thought as well. You can always run audio out of the tv to the receiver even though there might be a 3 to 6 milisecond delay on the audio . You might not even hear or be able to tell the delay so I think you should try Mikes suggestion first before you do anything else.

 

[MDS]

The setup is correct. Everyone seems to expect that HD is somehow awe inspiring, but many times it is not. I've heard people say that HD is so awesome that you'll watch the weather channel in HD all day just because the picture is so beautiful. I say baloney.

Just because you have a blu-ray doesn't mean that it was mastered to the utmost in quality standards or even that it will be a huge difference from SD. Sometimes it is and sometimes it is not, it depends on the source from which it was mastered and the skill of the mastering engineers. Just like music, it is sometimes hit and miss.

Despite all the hype, HD is an incremental improvement at best. With cable, sometimes a HD version and a SD version are available at the same time on different channels. Sometimes I fail to see any major difference at all.

 

[fmw]

I used own a 605. I can tell you from experience that the video processor in the unit is pretty poor. That's one of the reasons the unit is so inexpensive. I would suggest you go around its video processor whenever you can. I agree with Mike C. Just hook the video connection directly to the TV and send just the audio to the receiver.

 

[Audioholics]

The 605 is garbage in, garbage out. If you aren't satisfied and notice a video difference between connecting directly to the TV, then disable the monitor out (which kills all analogue upconversion to HDMI and reroutes it to component).

Setup > Input/Output Assign > Monitor Out > No

 

[MinusTheBear]

The 605 is garbage in, garbage out. If you aren't satisfied and notice a video difference between connecting directly to the TV, then disable the monitor out (which kills all analogue upconversion to HDMI and reroutes it to component).

Setup > Input/Output Assign > Monitor Out > No

At least your honest, you do sell this reciever at the AH store?

 

[mike c]

actually, i asked the OP to connect directly to his TV just to check if the receiver really is messing with his pic. so the next step would depend on those results

hence: "call us in the morning"

i'm thinking the OP's display really doesn't show HD's advantages.

 

[ClinicaTerra]

connect your player directly to the TV.*

call us in the morning.

*Note - only valid if not interested in running HD audio

Mike,

I AM interested in running HD audio with this player, so I have to have a device like a receiver as a "loop" so to speak...

 

[ClinicaTerra]

That would be my thought as well. You can always run audio out of the tv to the receiver even though there might be a 3 to 6 milisecond delay on the audio . You might not even hear or be able to tell the delay so I think you should try Mikes suggestion first before you do anything else.

Are you suggesting that I run the HDMI cable from the player direct to the display and then one out from the display back into the receiver? I never even heard of this method...I don't think my TV even has any audio outs...

 

[mike c]

Mike,

I AM interested in running HD audio with this player, so I have to have a device like a receiver as a "loop" so to speak...

i suggested you connect the player directly to the display so we can eliminate (or not) the receiver as the cause of the "degradation" of picture quality.

if the picture improves, do the setting Clint suggested on the receiver.

if the picture doesn't improve, it might be the display or the player.

 

[ClinicaTerra]

The setup is correct. Everyone seems to expect that HD is somehow awe inspiring, but many times it is not. I've heard people say that HD is so awesome that you'll watch the weather channel in HD all day just because the picture is so beautiful. I say baloney.

Well, I don't really know what to say here -- I agree with some of what you say regarding HD being a bit hyped up more than reality, but many cable HD transmissions are beautiful compared to standard transmission...be that as it may, I have heard the same thing that HD is so awesome that it is better than anything standard DVDs, cable, etc, can deliver -- no matter what the source, and I'm beginning to think this is a bunch of black smoke...

But you are confirming that my HDMI setup is correct?

Just because you have a blu-ray doesn't mean that it was mastered to the utmost in quality standards or even that it will be a huge difference from SD. Sometimes it is and sometimes it is not, it depends on the source from which it was mastered and the skill of the mastering engineers. Just like music, it is sometimes hit and miss.

Okay...this is more in line of what I wanted to know...

Despite all the hype, HD is an incremental improvement at best. With cable, sometimes a HD version and a SD version are available at the same time on different channels. Sometimes I fail to see any major difference at all.

You know though, there are certain Blu-ray discs, HD cable transmissions (mainly sports) and TVs, settings, cables, etc. that just make the experience REALLY look good -- while I'm not impressed with my setup's performance, I can walk into Blockbuster or Sears and see a Sony BRAVIA LCD they're running and it looks like Johnny Depp is literally floating off the screen in 1080p delivery of Pirates of the Caribbean...the depth, the pop, the colors...absolutely jaw dropping...the same disc on my screen doesn't quite have that "high def pop"...

But you know what concerns me? I'm hearing everything from so many different people -- some say my receiver shouldn't be causing ANY loss of information video wise...some say my Onkyo's video quality sucks...some say my TV may not be delivering HD quality picture...I don't know what to believe, but I will work on getting back to some other people who voiced these opinions in here...

 

[ClinicaTerra]

I used own a 605. I can tell you from experience that the video processor in the unit is pretty poor. That's one of the reasons the unit is so inexpensive. I would suggest you go around its video processor whenever you can. I agree with Mike C. Just hook the video connection directly to the TV and send just the audio to the receiver.

This is very alarming news...but let me ask you this: does the video processing in the 605 REALLY make a difference if I'm not upscaling anything? I am not using ANY component cable -- JUST HDMI from the player to the receiver, and then receiver to the TV -- ALL HDMI...I was told by countless 605 owners that HDMI should pass DIRECT through this receiver with NO loss of any kind -- HDMI IN, HDMI OUT...you still say the video processor can be degrading the HDMI signal?

If I did do video direct from the player to display, how would I get the high res audio to pass digitally? Don't I still need HDMI?

 

[ClinicaTerra]

The 605 is garbage in, garbage out. If you aren't satisfied and notice a video difference between connecting directly to the TV, then disable the monitor out (which kills all analogue upconversion to HDMI and reroutes it to component).

Setup > Input/Output Assign > Monitor Out > No

Clint,

This may be getting closer to an answer for me...before I try to run the player direct to the display, I have some questions about a few of the 605's features...

I understand that the 605 is garbage in garbage out -- but I'm not FEEDING it garbage with clean 1080p Blu-ray discs...and what would the MONITOR NO setting have to do with the connections I'm running? I am only going HDMI OUT of the player to HDMI IN (1) of the receiver, then HDMI OUT of the receiver to HDMI IN of the display...NO other connections are being made...no component, etc...

I was told that the HDMI MONITOR was only for being able to see the onscreen display over HDMI and has nothing to do with video quality over the HDMI repeaters; in fact, the 605 came with a Quick Connections sheet that said if using the receiver like I am, with HDMI looping, this should be set to MONITOR: YES...

Am I missing something here?

If the 605 is garbage in garbage out like you say, then why don't 1080p reference Blu-ray discs like the Pirates films look that great? Shouldn't it feed the high quality of that BD over to the display?

 

[ClinicaTerra]

actually, i asked the OP to connect directly to his TV just to check if the receiver really is messing with his pic. so the next step would depend on those results

hence: "call us in the morning"

i'm thinking the OP's display really doesn't show HD's advantages.

Mike,

Are you seriously considering the fact that the Sony KDS-50A2020 SXRD 1080p HDTV could possibly not be showing TRUE high def? This display was rated as one of the best for this quality -- while I'm having trouble with it right now, are you suggesting that this model truly "doesn't show HD's advantages"? What would you think this would be?

 

[mike c]

PLEASE connect your player directly to the display, and come back and tell us the result.

we can theorize what's wrong for a hundred years and get nowhere, or you can move this forward and physically try stuff.

you don't have to move your display 1 inch.

remove the HDMI from the receiver output, connect that to the player output.

also, pls take pics of your setup so we can help you troubleshoot - a pic of your audio rack and where your display is positioned.

how far are you sitting from the display?

 

[ClinicaTerra]

A couple more things before I connect the player direct to the display...

--Isn't the 605 supposed to pass HDMI video as is to a display connected to its HDMI out port? Is there any "converting" of any kind taking place if going HDMI IN, HDMI OUT?

--Is this an "ideal" way to configure the system? That is -- HDMI carrying video and audio over one cable from the source deck? I want to be able to transfer 1080p video from the Blu-rays AND take advantage of the high res codecs, so don't I need HDMI for both?

I know my Panasonic can decode Dolby TrueHD and send that as multichannel PCM either over HDMI or via the multichannel analog outs, plus it can send uncompressed PCM over the HDMI/analog outs -- but I am looking to utilize the 605's internal TrueHD/Master Audio decoders down the road with a BD player which bitstreams these signals, so wouldn't I need HDMI to do that? Should I be separating the audio and video instead of letting it run over one HDMI cable?

--What is the deal with the HDMI MONITOR setting on this receiver? I can't get a straight answer on it -- some have told me it's just for seeing the onscreen menu over HDMI, while some suggest that by leaving it OFF, HDMI passes the way it should -- but I don't know what the best setting is for me. Right now, I have it set to YES so I can see the onscreen display for setup menu, but am I somehow "losing" resolution from the Blu-ray player doing this? Is 1080p video actually passing over HDMI and through the receiver with the MONITOR set to YES? Again...the way I have everything set up, I AM seeing video from the player, going through the Onkyo, and my TV's onscreen display IS reading "1080p" when I press the incoming resolution button...

Is everything correct then?

 

[ClinicaTerra]

a pic of your audio rack and where your display is positioned.

My audio rack is an open-shelved Bell'O stand that sits in an alcove in the wall to the right of the Sony SXRD display; the Onkyo sits on the next to bottom shelf, the Panasonic on top of it, while the next shelf up houses a Marantz CC-67 CD changer and DR-700 CD recorder...the very top shelf has a Technics turntable, soon to be replaced...the display itself is on a Bell'O stand in the middle of the wall, centered for a good angle from the sweet spot.

how far are you sitting from the display?

It's a 50" and I'm about six or so feet...

 

[obscbyclouds]

I was told that the HDMI MONITOR was only for being able to see the onscreen display over HDMI and has nothing to do with video quality over the HDMI repeaters; in fact, the 605 came with a Quick Connections sheet that said if using the receiver like I am, with HDMI looping, this should be set to MONITOR: YES...

On my Onkyo 705 If I set HDMI Monitor: OFF there will be no picture. It completely turns off the reciever's HDMI output. It doesn't matter what the input is (HDMI, Component, Composite, etc.).

The only time I ever see need to use it is when I'm listening to a SACD or DVD-A and don't want the tracklists, etc. displayed on my TV. If I turn the TV off with HDMI monitor: ON I will loose the handshake and I won't get audio.

Anyway, that isn't the problem here. To be honest, I don't think the 605 should really be altering the signal, it's simply passing the information on to the display. The only way to know is to connect the BR player directly to the display as mike recommended. If your still not happy with the picture, we've eliminated the reciever as a cause. You really need to try this and report back your results.

 

[ClinicaTerra]

On my Onkyo 705 If I set HDMI Monitor: OFF there will be no picture. It completely turns off the reciever's HDMI output. It doesn't matter what the input is (HDMI, Component, Composite, etc.).

The only time I ever see need to use it is when I'm listening to a SACD or DVD-A and don't want the tracklists, etc. displayed on my TV. If I turn the TV off with HDMI monitor: ON I will loose the handshake and I won't get audio.

Anyway, that isn't the problem here. To be honest, I don't think the 605 should really be altering the signal, it's simply passing the information on to the display. The only way to know is to connect the BR player directly to the display as mike recommended. If your still not happy with the picture, we've eliminated the reciever as a cause. You really need to try this and report back your results.

Thank you, Clouds...

Can you give me some more insights as to what you are referring to with the 605's HDMI MONITOR settings? Are you saying that since I have something connected to the HDMI OUT of the receiver, this must be set to YES so the receiver knows to pass the video out? Do I have this right? I know you were talking about YOUR model Onkyo, but would this apply to my 605 as well?

You also mention "you don't THINK" the 605 is altering the signal in any way -- does that mean it is actually possible that I don't have this configured properly for HDMI IN/HDMI OUT?