Klipsch Reference Sub 10" or 12"

[FSUguy]

I'm putting together my first true home theater system and trying to make my final decisions before I purchase the speakers. As of now, I am planning on getting Klipsch RF-82's, RC-52, RS-42, and either the RW-10D or the RW-12D. All this will be matched up with a Yamaha RX-V1800. The problem is I can't decide between the two subs. What will I sacrifice going with one over the other?

My understanding is that the 10" will give me clean, tight bass, but lack some "Boom", and the 12" will basically be the opposite from what some have told me. Has anybody demoed both that can offer suggestions? I will mainly use the system for watching movies but some music.

I am an employee at Best Buy and get a steal on Klipsch, plus their price is in my budget, so I am sort of "brand committed".

Thanks

 

[Sheep]

First things first. Woofer size has nothing to do with it's sound characteristics. It is the design of the woofer that determines this. A 12inch cone can move more air (all else equal) thusly create more bass. With it's larger cone, it can produce the same amount of bass as a 10inch driver (again, all equal) with less stress. Thusly, all equal, a 12inch woofer will actually have more headroom, and operate under less extreme conditions (unless you have an undersized woofer for your room).

Second, have you heard all the aforementioned speakers and subwoofers? Going on someone else's word is a great thing to do for a friend you will see every day to be polite. But if they don't know what they're talking about, they could lead you into something very bad. Klipsch speakers are known for a brighter treble response, and to some with sensitive ears, they can be harsh. You may not see this right away if you think you're trusting an expert (which I have deduced that they aren't, given the subwoofer misconception). If you have heard them and enjoy they're sound (please listen for a long time, don't be hasty) be all means pick them up. Keep your mind open though, and never dismiss speakers on first impressions or poor advice. Audition/study, then buy. ALWAYS.

Little insert: I didn't see the part about the employee... still think more auditioning is in order.

Lastly, why Klipsch subwoofers? While they aren't bad, there is other subwoofer companies out there can offer more subwoofer for the money. If you are going after a certain look, fair enough, but for the same price you could easily have 2 to 4 times MORE subwoofer.

HTH, and good luck with your never ending addiction.

SheepStar

 

[FSUguy]

First things first. Woofer size has nothing to do with it's sound characteristics. It is the design of the woofer that determines this. A 12inch cone can move more air (all else equal) thusly create more bass. With it's larger cone, it can produce the same amount of bass as a 10inch driver (again, all equal) with less stress. Thusly, all equal, a 12inch woofer will actually have more headroom, and operate under less extreme conditions (unless you have an undersized woofer for your room).

Second, have you heard all the aforementioned speakers and subwoofers? Going on someone else's word is a great thing to do for a friend you will see every day to be polite. But if they don't know what they're talking about, they could lead you into something very bad. Klipsch speakers are known for a brighter treble response, and to some with sensitive ears, they can be harsh. You may not see this right away if you think you're trusting an expert (which I have deduced that they aren't, given the subwoofer misconception). If you have heard them and enjoy they're sound (please listen for a long time, don't be hasty) be all means pick them up. Keep your mind open though, and never dismiss speakers on first impressions or poor advice. Audition/study, then buy. ALWAYS.

Little insert: I didn't see the part about the employee... still think more auditioning is in order.

Lastly, why Klipsch subwoofers? While they aren't bad, there is other subwoofer companies out there can offer more subwoofer for the money. If you are going after a certain look, fair enough, but for the same price you could easily have 2 to 4 times MORE subwoofer.

HTH, and good luck with your never ending addiction.

SheepStar

First, thanks so much for all the advice. After hearing similar suggestions, I did just that. I spent yesterday at MHT for close to an hour listening to the 82's, 52, and 42's and honestly loved them (Plus I'm on a college budget! )
I have listened briefly to the Ref 10", but was not to impressed, but I think the demo was messed up because at my store (which doesn't have MHT), the Synergy Sub 10 "hit" harder. I ran this by a few people I trust with audio knowledge,and they agreed to something probably being wrong for the demo.

While I like the idea of all the speakers being Ref Series, I am open to other suggestions. Let me give you the price I have for the subs and if you can think of anything better for the price, PLEASE let me know...

Ref 10" $200
Ref 12" $280

Thanks

 

[Sheep]

What is the size of the listening room and will it be changing (Are you going to move/use it in other rooms?).

For $280, you're limited with what you can do. Are these the RW-10D and RW-12D subwoofers you are referring to? Honestly, you can't do any better for that money. Klipsch wins in my book.

As for auditions, what is it that you like? Not what you like about the Klipsch speakers, but like in general? What characteristics?

SheepStar

 

[rnatalli]

Stretch your budget a little if you can. For another $70 you can get an HSU STF-2.

 

[mudrummer99]

FSUguy,
first off, i think I used to work in your store (if the FSU stands for florida state). But i digress, check out the DefTech subs as well, we get pretty decent discounts on those and you may like the punch and "cleanliness" of them a little better, atleast in my hearings I have. I am looking at the same speakers you are for the same reasons you are but I'm most definitely not going with the Klipsch subs. The only ones I've heard that I like are RT-10d and RT-12d, both awesome but well out of the price range since BB doesn't these models. I would also consider the Hsu that rnatalli suggested for the price, but give all the subs that Magnolia carries a listen. (i do understand that it's a long drive to the closest mht, but it makes for a fun road trip ) Hope this helps a little, and if you are at the Tallahassee store, PM me

Mike

 

[gus6464]

See how much you can get a Martin Logan Abyss for. Normally retail for $1000.

 

[Kolia]

See how much you can get a Martin Logan Abyss for. Normally retail for $1000.

I was about to suggest the same. But it seems he's looking for a sub-300$ unit.

 

[FSUguy]

I was about to suggest the same. But it seems he's looking for a sub-300$ unit.

Yea, I looked into the ML abyss and the dynamo, and the Def Tech Supercubes but we're starting to get out of my budget. I actually started looking at the Quintets, a Yamaha V661, and the Synergy Sub-10 originally, and now look where I'm at! lol

Oh, how this addiction gets expensive fast! ESPECIALLY for a college kid! Thanks Florida Pre-Paid!

Will the HSU really show a big performance boost? And where can I get it for not tooo much over $325 shipped?

 

[FSUguy]

What is the size of the listening room and will it be changing (Are you going to move/use it in other rooms?).

For $280, you're limited with what you can do. Are these the RW-10D and RW-12D subwoofers you are referring to? Honestly, you can't do any better for that money. Klipsch wins in my book.

As for auditions, what is it that you like? Not what you like about the Klipsch speakers, but like in general? What characteristics?

SheepStar

The size of the room I'm going to have these in until I move is about at 12'x10' give or take (yea, I know its crazy small). I'm looking ahead now to buy something for a bigger room later, which I might not work at Best Buy at that time.

I am looking at the RW-10D and the RW-12D. Maybe I should go with the 10" right now for the small room, then when I move to a bigger room look at adding another RW-10D...or....sell the RW-10D when I move it and get something better!

Thoughts?

 

[Kolia]

One things to remember (and it won't help you fight the addiction) is that a sub cannot be too big. You can always play it lower...

Also, on a practical topic, your buying power today is only a fraction of what it will be once you graduate and get a "real job". Ask yourself if you really want to stretch your budget on a piece of equipement that will be traded off for a much better one in a few years? You can be certain you'll trade (unless you get maried right away...)

Watching movies is nice, having a life is better imo.

 

[FSUguy]

One things to remember (and it won't help you fight the addiction) is that a sub cannot be too big. You can always play it lower...

Also, on a practical topic, your buying power today is only a fraction of what it will be once you graduate and get a "real job". Ask yourself if you really want to stretch your budget on a piece of equipement that will be traded off for a much better one in a few years? You can be certain you'll trade (unless you get maried right away...)

Watching movies is nice, having a life is better imo.

THAT is probably one of the most valid points I have read on this forum! haha...For $80, I'll probably get the twelve.

That'll give me (2) RF-82's, 1 RC-52, (2) RS-42's, and the RW-12D shipped for just under $1000...not too bad I think, especially when they get hooked up to my Yammy RX-V1800

 

[adwilk]

Stretch your budget a little if you can. For another $70 you can get an HSU STF-2.

I have the RW12-D and it will stomp that HSU into the dirt... I tried both... I recently bought the Klipsch and then borrowed my buddies HSU to try in my room and no comparison. The Klipsch is capable of 116db output at 30hz, something very few others in this price point are capable of . Granted, it doesnt go as deep (24hz) but this thing will flat get it done... GREAT sub IMO. I've ordered a second one to really piss off the neighbors.

I'd get the 12, the digital control allows you to set it to depth, flat, and punch as i'm sure you know. the punch really tightens things up with music and depth is great for movies...

 

[FSUguy]

I have the RW12-D and it will stomp that HSU into the dirt... I tried both... I recently bought the Klipsch and then borrowed my buddies HSU to try in my room and no comparison. The Klipsch is capable of 116db output at 30hz, something very few others in this price point are capable of . Granted, it doesnt go as deep (24hz) but this thing will flat get it done... GREAT sub IMO. I've ordered a second one to really piss off the neighbors.

I'd get the 12, the digital control allows you to set it to depth, flat, and punch as i'm sure you know. the punch really tightens things up with music and depth is great for movies...

HAHAHA...prob the best review of a subwoofer comparison I have ever heard!!! I think I made my mind up to go with the RW-12D. I had to draw the budget somewhere, and I think I will def be satisfied...time to order from Klipsch (and I just got my Yammy 1800 in!!!! wooo-hooo...now I need to hurry up and order the speakers!!)

Thanks

 

[Matt34]

I can understand sticking to what you can get a deal on. I've heard the Sub-12 by JBL has gotten some pretty good reviews.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7706431&type=product&id=1138086034262


..and there is always the old standby with the Bic H-100 if your willing to try it unheard. You can find it on Ebay for around $245 shipped.

http://www.overstock.com/Electronics/Bic-Acoustech-H-100-Powered-Subwoofer/1513356/product.html

 

[adwilk]

HAHAHA...prob the best review of a subwoofer comparison I have ever heard!!! I think I made my mind up to go with the RW-12D. I had to draw the budget somewhere, and I think I will def be satisfied...time to order from Klipsch (and I just got my Yammy 1800 in!!!! wooo-hooo...now I need to hurry up and order the speakers!!)

Thanks

Yeah, i received some criticism when i got this sub with my RF-7's, RC-64 and rb61's for surrounds... I was told that i needed to beef up my sub. And i'll admit that there are occasions where i wish it played a little lower but as far as output goes... I cant imagine needing ANY more. This guy really will impress you. One of my other buddies has a JL sub and the klipsch is easily outclassed by it but as far as any other sub 1000 dollar sub i've heard the RW keeps up. Another buddy has the Dayton 15" Titanic and it wont output like this klipsch will. Perhaps in a larger room a bigger sub MIGHT be necessary, but even their flagship sub RT12D only outputs 3 more db. Granted its a little flatter but, if you're looking to shake walls, you wont be disappointed. I think you would have to spend A LOT more money to even come close. Klipsch subs are quite underrated AFAIC. The DCS subs they offer really are unbelievable.

 

[Casei]

In a room slightly larger, I'm running a Synergy sub 10 and for the price I couldn't be happier. Initially it was paired with Quintet III's, but the lack of midbass drove me to replace them with Paradigms Monitor 7's, cc290 and mini monitors. Chances are I'll add a sub at some point, but it's not high priority as the sub 10 performs very well.

 

[Lionaid]

Ref 10" $200
Ref 12" $280

Hello!! you said Ref 12" for $280. Please tell me where i can get that sub.
location of Bestbuy??? thanks

 

[bandphan]

employee and bump

 

[FSUguy]

All I have to say about my system is WOW!!! Everything sounds great. Ironically enough I thought my 12 was plugged in and the bass sounded amazing, but it was only from my RF-82s. Then I realized the mistake and plugged it in. Let me tell you that it opened up a who new world, especially for my neighbors. Go with the RW-12D!!