Just bought Denon AVR-2807

[AVRat]

A couple more things to consider with the Def Techs: Do you know which way the bass drivers are pointed, inward or outward? Positioning them so that they fire inward is preferred for tighter bass response. Another thing you need to do, if you haven’t done so already, is to balance the output of the woofer with the upper section using the gain control of the woofer amp. Since you’re using the sub out of the receiver, you might just set this control to the 12 o’clock position and use receiver’s channel trim to set the output level.

 

[Nick250]

thank you for all your help nick, I really appreciate the help. I will do this, and I think setting the sub at 120Hz, lowered the booming out of it, but now I don't hear it as much. thank you once again.

I know you have a lot to digest setting up your new system so I am being extra double sure, the 120Hz is for the single "LFE" setting only.

Nick

 

[skasol]

thank you all for your help, I have done everything said here, I have change the speakers to 80hz and set to small except for the LFE 120hz, I have set the def techs with the subs pointing inward. this has helped, I also raised the level for the speakers to +10db, but I am not sure if I should've done this, I am going to go back and turn it down. thank you all.

 

[Jack Hammer]

thank you all for your help,... I also raised the level for the speakers to +10db, but I am not sure if I should've done this, I am going to go back and turn it down. thank you all.

Generally you should level match your speakers using a sound level meter, the Radio Shack analog model is normally recommended. You'll find some variation between the level of each speaker due to its location and how far your are from it.

I remember something about only adjusting the levels down, as opposed to up, I'm not sure if this is a myth or a fact with modern equipment. Someone else can probably tell you more.

+10 sounds pretty high to me, if you're not sure where to set your speakers, I'd probably start with them all at zero and make minor adjustments with pink noise or your AVRs test tone until they sound at about the same volume. Either the Avia setup dvd or the Digital Video Essentials dvd are a good investment for explaining and helping you set up your system.

Jack

 

[Nick250]

Jack, we are working with the OP using AutoSetup. The level settings from Atuo Setup Denons works very well. I have it on my 3806 and have played around with it quite a bit so I have some experience to draw on. If the OP wants to tinker with a meter and levels down the road that's certainly reasonable. At this point it's a needless complication IMO and muddies the waters for the OP without much upside that I can see. Once he has AutoSetup done correctly and then wants to experiment with a meter, great. That's my thinking.

Nick

 

[skasol]

thank you very much, I actually have Avia setup dvd , I didn't know I could use it for Audio as well, I bought it to calibrate my pioneer Elite, what sound meter should I buy at radio shack, I think I should go back and set the speakers to default volume level. thank you again. one question though, when I did the auto set up, It placed my sub 28" away from me, but in reality it's only 8-9" it's build in the speakers, why 28" I don't get it. any feedback? and thank you all so far for being extra helpful with this noob.

 

[Jack Hammer]

thank you very much, I actually have Avia setup dvd , I didn't know I could use it for Audio as well, I bought it to calibrate my pioneer Elite, what sound meter should I buy at radio shack, I think I should go back and set the speakers to default volume level. thank you again. one question though, when I did the auto set up, It placed my sub 28" away from me, but in reality it's only 8-9" it's build in the speakers, why 28" I don't get it. any feedback? and thank you all so far for being extra helpful with this noob.

Nick250 is right, at this point you may want to stick with the auto setup feature to avoid confusion. My experience matches his that it is fairly good for setting speaker levels and distances. My auto setup has always given me odd distances for my sub and generally sets it at a slightly lower level than I like (personal preference), though it's still good. I've always been told not to worry too much about the distance it sets for the sub.

Like Nick mentioned, If after using the autosetup you are still not happy and want to fine/micro tune your system you can buy a sound level meter. While a sound level meter can be a good investment, most people only use it once for about five minutes then never touch it again. At around $45 this may not be a good investment for you, only you can decide.
Radio Shack Sound Level Meter

Jack

 

[Nick250]

one question though, when I did the auto set up, It placed my sub 28" away from me, but in reality it's only 8-9" it's build in the speakers, why 28" I don't get it. any feedback? and thank you all so far for being extra helpful with this noob.

Something is not computing here. When doing auto setup the mic should be on a tripod (if at all possible, I bought one at CC for $20) placed at the main listening position, ear height and pointed at the ceiling. It measures the distance from the speakers and sub to the mic. Where does the 28" come into play? Just for a point of reference, using a tape measure check the actual distance of the speakers & sub to the main listening position. Auto setup should be close to those distances. Note, the measurement could be meters or feet. You can choose either.

Nick

 

[skasol]

sorry, I meant feet, not inches, also after running the auto set up, do I need to still set the speakers as small, because the auto set up sets them as large, and do I still need to set the LFE to 120Hz, because the auto set up sets it as something else, and I need to set the crossover to 80hz? just wondering, I will redo the auto set up with the tripod and all, and then make this adjustments? is that what I am supposed to do? thank you once more.

 

[Nick250]

Yes, every time you run auto eq it's like starting from scratch as far as the receiver is concerned, so you do need to go into speaker setup and change all the cross overs back to 80Hz and all speakers to small and LFE to 120Hz after each time you run auto eq. So therefor, after you run auto setup with the tripod you will need to go in and make the manual changes to speaker size and crossovers.

Nick

 

[skasol]

thank you very much for your assistance, I will be buying the tripod today from bestbuy, and I will redo the set up and all the other things recommended by you and the rest of the nice people here at the site, thank you all.

 

[xboxweasel]

Hold on a second there...

...they are currently set in the following order, Front small 40Hz, Center (small) 40Hz, surround (small) 80Hz, LFE 120Hz...

Are you saying that with the denon receiver you can set individual crossovers?
How would that work as per the quote? What is the significance of having an LFE xover if you are already setting individual xovers for all the speakers? For example: the surrounds are set to 80Hz. Would the rest of the info below 80Hz go to the sub? Then why set the sub to 120hz?

I just think this is an awesome idea. I thought that there was only 1 xover setting for all speakers. And that you set the xover point to match the "worst" speaker in the bunch.

 

[astrodon]

The number of the volume setting is completely arbitrary- it doesn't correspond to any actual acoustic value. I wouldn't worry at all about the setting provided you're not hearing distortions or running overly hot. Different brands have different interfaces, nothing to worry about. I'm on my 3rd Denon myself; FWIW I seldom run about -15, but that would vary from model to model and room to room.

I have noticed the same characteristic with my Denon AVR-3806 in my theater with respect to my Sony DA3ES in my living room, that is, the decibel level being a larger number on the Denon than the Sony ES. (By the way, there is some confusion with the way some people are describing negative numbers, -10 is larger than -40 not smaller.) After reading the responses in this original posting, I think people have ignored the response by Rob Babcock, which is the correct response to the original question. The decibel number on a receiver is arbitrary. In physics however, decibel does have a specific meaning. It is a logarithmic scale of sound intensity where 0 dB (decibel) = threshold of hearing = 10^{-12} W/m^2 intensity, and +120 dB = threshold of pain = 1.00 W/m^2 (W = watt, m = meter). The relationship between intensity of sound and decibel level is beta = 10 log (I/Io), where beta is the decibel level, I is the intensity of the sound in watts/meter^2, Io is the intensity at threshold of hearing = 10^{-12} W/m^2, and 'log' is the common (base 10) logarithm function. Finally note that intensity of sound falls off as one over r^2: I = P/(4 pi r^2), where pi = 3.14159..., P is the power of the sound being delivered by the speaker (measured in watts), and r is the distance the listener is from the speaker (measured in meter). I hope this helps some of you.

 

[Nick250]

I have noticed the same characteristic with my Denon AVR-3806 in my theater with respect to my Sony DA3ES in my living room, that is, the decibel level being a larger number on the Denon than the Sony ES. (By the way, there is some confusion with the way some people are describing negative numbers, -10 is larger than -40 not smaller.) After reading the responses in this original posting, I think people have ignored the response by Rob Babcock, which is the correct response to the original question. The decibel number on a receiver is arbitrary. In physics however, decibel does have a specific meaning. It is a logarithmic scale of sound intensity where 0 dB (decibel) = threshold of hearing = 10^{-12} W/m^2 intensity, and +120 dB = threshold of pain = 1.00 W/m^2 (W = watt, m = meter). The relationship between intensity of sound and decibel level is beta = 10 log (I/Io), where beta is the decibel level, I is the intensity of the sound in watts/meter^2, Io is the intensity at threshold of hearing = 10^{-12} W/m^2, and 'log' is the common (base 10) logarithm function. Finally note that intensity of sound falls off as one over r^2: I = P/(4 pi r^2), where pi = 3.14159..., P is the power of the sound being delivered by the speaker (measured in watts), and r is the distance the listener is from the speaker (measured in meter). I hope this helps some of you.

I don't think anyone missed Robs point, which was clear, concise and well written. I am sure it helped the OP understand db values better. The thread has moved way past that point and the need of the OP from the beginning was setup assistance with his new receiver.

Nick

 

[skasol]

which, I am happy to announce that I got the set up very nice thanks to everyone's suggestion. I thank you all for helping out and contributing your different levels of expertise.