Is Direct or Pure Direct Mode with Sub Possible for Denon 1911?

[ReUpRo]

The goal should be to keep the Digital to Analog to Digital conversions to a minimum. If you send analog from the Oppo and then supply bass management or room correction, you've just introduced an extra A to D to A step.

IMO, this makes sense, Oppo send analog, AVR in Pure Direct. Or, Oppo sends digital, AVR applies bass management and room correction (which is done in digital domain), AVR performs D to A.

The room+speakers make such a huge impact on sound when compared to different DACs, that unless someone has a superlatively sorted out room with an exceptionally accurate speaker setup, it is a waste of money to chase after high end "transports" and external DACs, etc.

 

[j_garcia]

The goal should be to keep the Digital to Analog to Digital conversions to a minimum. If you send analog from the Oppo and then supply bass management or room correction, you've just introduced an extra A to D to A step.

IMO, this makes sense, Oppo send analog, AVR in Pure Direct. Or, Oppo sends digital, AVR applies bass management and room correction (which is done in digital domain), AVR performs D to A.

The room+speakers make such a huge impact on sound when compared to different DACs, that unless someone has a superlatively sorted out room with an exceptionally accurate speaker setup, it is a waste of money to chase after high end "transports" and external DACs, etc.

While it is certainly true that speakers make the single largest difference, there's no question in my mind that different, quality devices have different sounds and the benefits of a good source unit are easily audible. I have a far from treated room as well.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

With my 1911, in Direct or Pure Direct, there is no sub playing with these settings, as I just re-tried it. Am I missing a crucial step here for some reason?

Might have to try a hard reset on your Denon.

 

[Ears to you]

You can just turn off Audyssey processing and it will still let you use your subwoofer.

Menu > Audio Adjust > AudysseySettings and set MultEQ to off.

Thank you for the suggestion, but unfortunately, the problem with this is that like ADTG has rightfully said in many previous posts, Dynamic EQ is quite helpful, and with Multi EQ set to off, Dynamic EQ is then also disabled.

 

[Ears to you]

Might have to try a hard reset on your Denon.

Thank you for this suggestion, ADTG. Is this possibly needed as some weird combination of settings that I have gone through in the past has disabled a previously possible combination? I ask this because I thought that in the past I had Pure Direct with my sub working, since I was able to adjust the gain on my Hsu VTF1 in this mode. I was actually questioning my memory because I could not re-do this effect, but maybe it was working then, but I messed with some settings, and disabled this combination. I guess if I copy down any current settings that I want to recreate after a hard reset, then there is no real down side to doing this. I needed to re-run Audyssey for HT anyway, since I upgraded my center from the B&W CMC to the CMC2, so that is no big deal.

 

[Ears to you]

Yeah, I meant LFE + Main, instead of LFE + THX.

ADTG - I apologize for another simplistic question that has come up a lot in the past, but if I use the LFE + Main setting, then aren't I running my monitor speakers (B&W CM5's) as full range, and not crossing them over at 80Hz so that the sub can do that LF work?

 

[Ears to you]

I have a 1912, but I would think the 1911 would be similar. I read the 1911's owner's manual just to be sure and can confirm that you can have the subwoofer on in Stereo, Direct and even Pure Direct, just like their higher end models. You just have to get into "Bass Setting" and select "LFE+Main". "Bass Setting" is a submenu in the Speaker Setpu section.

Thank you, Peng, but may I ask you like I asked ADTG - if I use the LFE + Main setting, then aren't my B&W CM5's operating at full range, not crossing over at 80Hz, and doubling the bass that the sub is putting out?

 

[MosesMalone]

Thank you for the suggestion, but unfortunately, the problem with this is that like ADTG has rightfully said in many previous posts, Dynamic EQ is quite helpful, and with Multi EQ set to off, Dynamic EQ is then also disabled.

Isn't Dynamic EQ disabled either way when you use direct/pure direct mode? Unless i'm missing something.

 

[PENG]

Thank you, Peng, but may I ask you like I asked ADTG - if I use the LFE + Main setting, then aren't my B&W CM5's operating at full range, not crossing over at 80Hz, and doubling the bass that the sub is putting out?

That is correct, but then you have the choice of setting the speakers to small, leave the crossover at 80 Hz and use Stereo instead of Pure Direct. To me, if you have run Audyssey correctly (exactly according to the instruction from the Audyssey website), that will likely be a better way to listen to music as you can then choose Audyssey flat, Audyssey, with or without DEQ, or turn it off, and the sub will always be there to take care of anything below 80 Hz or whatever the crossover frequency you choose. Just try it to find out for yourself.

 

[PENG]

Isn't Dynamic EQ disabled either way when you use direct/pure direct mode? Unless i'm missing something.

You did not miss a thing.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

ADTG - I apologize for another simplistic question that has come up a lot in the past, but if I use the LFE + Main setting, then aren't I running my monitor speakers (B&W CM5's) as full range, and not crossing them over at 80Hz so that the sub can do that LF work?

Correct.

IMO PD 2.1 should only be used if your fronts are full range 30Hz-20kHz, not used if your speakers can't go down to 30Hz flat.

Just use Stereo 2.1 + Audyssey Bypass LR + DEQ. This bypasses Audyssey, but keeps the important Sub EQ + DEQ, so it sounds as good as PD 2.1 with the benefits of Sub EQ + DEQ.

I don't use PD mode anymore even though the Salon2 are full range. The reason is because PD/D will bypass Sub EQ + DEQ, which I can't do without. Must have Sub EQ + DEQ.

To recap, before I serendipitously found Sub EQ + DEQ, I used PD 2.1. But now I use Stereo + Audyssey Bypass LR + DEQ.

 

[bradymartin]

going through this same thing. but with klipsch 280f towers.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Whatever sounds best.

I still use Audyssey Bypass L/R + Dynamic EQ for everything. I never use Pure Direct or Direct modes anymore.

 

[bradymartin]

Whatever sounds best.

I still use Audyssey Bypass L/R + Dynamic EQ for everything. I never use Pure Direct or Direct modes anymore.

i use audyssey flat because it doesnt roll off the highs. does audyssey do the same. not sure of the difference between flat and bypass

 

[bradymartin]

ok i think im going to try settings according to this link

http://denon.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/35

since i like bright speakers, i have the klipsch reference premiere 280f, 450center in a small 11x11 room.
i dont want audyssey to restrict the treble or anything when listening to music.

so for movies ill use audyssey flat

for just music 2.0 or 2.1 ill use audyssey bypass

in stereo mode i guess it doesnt make a difference which mode i use?

 

[MrBoat]

I use the Denon 3805, which allows me to use PD with the sub woofer. Before that, in CD Stereo, the sub setting was subwoofer yes, LFE+main, etc. If that matters or not, I am not sure. I just left it like that and chose Pure Direct mode after.

I've tried all of the suggested crossover settings, large/small etc. in CD stereo mode, but PD gives the best sound, at least with well recorded music.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

ok i think im going to try settings according to this link

http://denon.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/35

since i like bright speakers, i have the klipsch reference premiere 280f, 450center in a small 11x11 room.
i dont want audyssey to restrict the treble or anything when listening to music.

so for movies ill use audyssey flat

for just music 2.0 or 2.1 ill use audyssey bypass

in stereo mode i guess it doesnt make a difference which mode i use?

I use Stereo Mode or Standard Mode + Audyssey Bypass L/R + Dynamic EQ.

PD & Direct modes will not allow Audyssey at all.

So whether it is 2Ch music or 5.1 DTS-HD MA movies, I get Audyssey Bypass L/R + Dynamic EQ.