wire

wire

Senior Audioholic
That is going to go for a large amount......:D
They will go for alot more when its over im sure . Those amps will push any speaker out there . I read on Carver forum that 180 tubes watts = 369 SS watts . :eek:
 
engtaz

engtaz

Full Audioholic
Bob Carver's own amps. What tube dreams are made of.

engtaz
 
yettitheman

yettitheman

Audioholic General
I would kill to have that piece of work. :eek:
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
They will go for alot more when its over im sure . Those amps will push any speaker out there . I read on Carver forum that 180 tubes watts = 369 SS watts . :eek:
A watt is a watt, tube solid state or otherwise.
 
WmAx

WmAx

Audioholic Samurai
I'll tell you a really interesting series of amps that I noticed recently: Yamaha P series PA amps. Appear to use a type of digital/switching power supply and an AB class output stage, so that they are low in weight yet with the standard virtual guaranteed transparent performance one has come to expect from well designed class AB analogue amplifiers. They appear to also use some sort of dynamic/tracking rail voltage feature(kind of like a highly evolved class H, if I understand the Yamaha EEEngine tech explanation) to substantially increase efficiency/reduce heat dissipation, but with none of the potential performance problems of standard PWM/digital amp output stages. According to the manual, the fans remain off until the heat sinks exceed 50 degrees C, and they vary in speed from there. So, I would imagine, one would have a difficult time getting the fans to even turn on in regular home use unless they were really being cranked. With what I would expect to be superb construction/engineering, as is usually the case with Yamaha products, the prices are superb, compared to 'regular' home hi-fi amps. The lowest power one, the P2500S, is specified as 250 watts/channel at 4 ohms, both channels driven, 20Hz-20,000Hz. Street price: $400. http://www.zzounds.com/item--YAMP2500S

BTW, I think it is a very nice looking amplifier. :)

-Chris
 
F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
A watt is a watt, tube solid state or otherwise.

This type of statistic came from the fact that tube amplifiers go into clipping steadily and gradually, while SS amps do it more digitally (on and off.) While it is true that a watt is a watt, you can push a tube amp further with fewer sonic and electrical problems than you can a SS amp. Most guitar amps are low powered tube amps for this reason. They can be overdriven more "elegantly" than solid state. Electric guitarists appreciate controlled distortion. My own opinion is that audiophiles with low powered SET amps have the same appreciation.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
This type of statistic came from the fact that tube amplifiers go into clipping steadily and gradually, while SS amps do it more digitally (on and off.) While it is true that a watt is a watt, you can push a tube amp further with fewer sonic and electrical problems than you can a SS amp. Most guitar amps are low powered tube amps for this reason. They can be overdriven more "elegantly" than solid state. Electric guitarists appreciate controlled distortion. My own opinion is that audiophiles with low powered SET amps have the same appreciation.
If you put it this way, then it is true to a point, and even then it is not on continuous basis otherwise the tube amp manufacturer would have said so. Like TLS, I have problem with unqualified statement like XW tube=YW SS is that it confuses people who do not know the original underlying message.
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
This type of statistic came from the fact that tube amplifiers go into clipping steadily and gradually, while SS amps do it more digitally (on and off.) While it is true that a watt is a watt, you can push a tube amp further with fewer sonic and electrical problems than you can a SS amp. Most guitar amps are low powered tube amps for this reason. They can be overdriven more "elegantly" than solid state. Electric guitarists appreciate controlled distortion. My own opinion is that audiophiles with low powered SET amps have the same appreciation.[emphasis added]
In other words, tube lovers really love adding distortion to the sound, rather than having it as it was recorded.

This is a very different thing from having a guitar amplifier that distorts, as very often the distortion is part of the music (as, for example, with Jimi Hendrix in many cases). But to play it back with the amount of distortion Jimi Hendrix intended, one must have equipment that does not add any more audible distortion to it.

In reality, adding distortion is exactly like adjusting tone controls or turning up the subwoofer higher than what would give a flat response—it is altering the original to suit one's tastes. There is nothing wrong with doing that, of course, provided one is not deluded into believing that one is reproducing what was originally intended. The delusion that the sound is more "pure" is a problem, not the actual alteration, if one likes the alteration.
 
F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
SET owners don't experience anywhere near the distortion that a guitar amplifier generates. I seem to remember that most SET's produce distortion in the 1 to 5% range. Jimi Hendrix used about 40%. It is the same thing, just amplifier clipping. It is just a matter of degree.
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
SET owners don't experience anywhere near the distortion that a guitar amplifier generates. I seem to remember that most SET's produce distortion in the 1 to 5% range. Jimi Hendrix used about 40%. It is the same thing, just amplifier clipping. It is just a matter of degree.

That would mean that they would be adding 1 to 5% more distortion than Jimi Hendrix intended in the sound. If Jimi Hendrix had wanted 1 to 5% more distortion, I am sure he would have added it himself. Plus, it would be adding the distortion to EVERYTHING, not just the guitar.

Again, whatever distortion has been willfully put in as music is music, but anything added at home is just distortion. If one likes added distortion, that is fine, but it is not accurately reproducing what was recorded, and one should not be confused about this fact.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
SET owners don't experience anywhere near the distortion that a guitar amplifier generates. I seem to remember that most SET's produce distortion in the 1 to 5% range. Jimi Hendrix used about 40%. It is the same thing, just amplifier clipping. It is just a matter of degree.
I can tell you one thing, if you even could push that 180 watt tube amp to 360 watts, which you couldn't, you would have a lot more than 40% THD. All amps increase their distortion product very quickly when overloaded, even if over driven 5 to 10% and you get to 100% THD pretty fast. Now a tube amp I admit generates second harmonic distortion products, that are less objectionable at early overload. This is the soft clip. However I still don't find it pleasant.

The best plan is to design the system to very rarely, if ever clip. Then soft clip becomes a non issue.

Those two monoblock amps each have 6 KT 88 output tubes. In the old days I used to run four KT 66 output tubes and that was already a furnace. Now running 12 KT 88s, the big brother of the KT 88 will be a blast furnace. So who ever plans on using those amps had better add a separate zone of air conditioning, and heat extraction to deal with that heat load, unless he lives in the arctic circle!
 
3db

3db

Audioholic Slumlord
In other words, tube lovers really love adding distortion to the sound, rather than having it as it was recorded.
Where's the distortion when the amp is not being clipped be it tube or silicon?
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
Where's the distortion when the amp is not being clipped be it tube or silicon?
A 1%-5% SET distortion is it, audible in many cases, especially the 5% range.
And, these levels on a SET comes rather quickly when you talk of single digit power or the low double digits as they do have such high THD at rated power, like a Lamm ML2, 3% at 18 watts rated and .7% at 1 watt.
The above amp may have lower distortion all the way up to its rated power, but then, it is already better designed.
On the other hand, if its output impedance is high, the FR will be matching the speaker's FR rather quickly.
 

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