In ceiling recommendation

[Bmw74]

Hello everyone,

I am new to posting in this forum, but I have been reading articles and forums entries for quite some time. I am nowhere close to be an audiophile, but I enjoy my music and movies.

I just moved to a new house, and in order to get TWA, I need to install in ceiling speakers in the living room. This is going to be a central location for family movies and listening to music, watching videos, etc. I would like to install a 5.1 system, and need help with some decent in ceiling speakers combo that doesn’t break the bank so to speak. I have been looking at B&Ws CCM663 and 664, and today I got curious about Martin Logan Helos 12. Any recommendation on either speakers, or any others that can provide a decent sound for movies and music? I have looked at Polk, but haven’t seen specific models or lines. Not sure about Klipish, I kinda like the warmer sound of the BWs, but I am open for suggestions. FYI, the ceiling is premiered, so I can install the speakers easily.

I would be using a Marantz NR1607. I have a subwoofer but that’s another issue, since my wife would like me to hide it and I would need to run a long SW cable to the back of the room which would be a Pain.

Thanks for the help.

 

[Danzilla31]

Hello everyone,

I am new to posting in this forum, but I have been reading articles and forums entries for quite some time. I am nowhere close to be an audiophile, but I enjoy my music and movies.

I just moved to a new house, and in order to get TWA, I need to install in ceiling speakers in the living room. This is going to be a central location for family movies and listening to music, watching videos, etc. I would like to install a 5.1 system, and need help with some decent in ceiling speakers combo that doesn’t break the bank so to speak. I have been looking at B&Ws CCM663 and 664, and today I got curious about Martin Logan Helos 12. Any recommendation on either speakers, or any others that can provide a decent sound for movies and music? I have looked at Polk, but haven’t seen specific models or lines. Not sure about Klipish, I kinda like the warmer sound of the BWs, but I am open for suggestions. FYI, the ceiling is premiered, so I can install the speakers easily.

I would be using a Marantz NR1607. I have a subwoofer but that’s another issue, since my wife would like me to hide it and I would need to run a long SW cable to the back of the room which would be a Pain.

Thanks for the help.

The RSL C34e's if your looking for awesome speakers that don't break the bank . I had them at the old house sound fantastic 4 of them will run you $500 flat 5 if your going all in ceiling will run you $625.

I'm assuming all speakers have to be in the ceiling to make the wife happy of course but let us know if the layout is different

 

[DigitalDawn]

I highly recommend Triad's InCeiling Bronze Satellites. Because the speaker baffle is on a 45 degree angle, the sound appears to come directly from the TV. I can get the price into the same range as the Martin Logan Helos 12 for you.

Triad is a Portland-based company that hand builds speakers in just about every configuration you can imagine. They will even color match the speakers and grills to match the paint on your walls or ceiling.

Triad has In-Wall and angled InCeiling speakers and subwoofers that work amazingly well for spaces in which you have no floor space, or when you wish to hide the speakers from view. The company has speakers in many different price ranges, starting at $300 per speaker - all the way up to $15k per speaker.

While not a household name, Triad is a favorite of custom installers and has won numerous industry awards.

 

[BMXTRIX]

The one compromise, I would REALLY shoot for, if at all possible, is to move the speakers from the ceiling to the TV wall if at all possible. Remember, any bedrooms above a speaker will receive just about as much audio as the TV room receives, so bedrooms above in-ceiling speakers are unusable while the TV is in use. This can present a long term problem in many situations. But, if you are absolutely stuck with in-ceiling speakers, get them as up-front as possible and use angled speakers which direct audio into the room.

I'm not a fan of ceiling speakers, and my primary rooms don't use them. But, secondary rooms in which I have used them, I've used the inexpensive Monoprice angled ceiling speakers.

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=4929
$70 for the pair and it's a fine way to get started if you are really on a tight budget. Without spending a great deal more money, I'm not sure how much of a quality jump you are really going to get from competitors speakers at twice the price (or more), which don't have a proper back box or way to help control speaker audio. I think you need to spend a good deal more money for any significant jump in audio quality.

 

[DigitalDawn]

If the speakers are in a sealed enclosure like the Triads, this attenuates sound transference quite a bit.

 

[2channel lover]

I've heard inceiling surround systems, and ideally I would steer away from the front 3 being in ceiling (if you can do the LCR as inwall speakers on the TV wall it's a game changer).

If they must all be in ceiling, I like the Triad option mentioned with the angled drivers across your front 3.

 

[Bmw74]

Thanks everyone for the responses, please keep them coming. My house is a single story, so there is no concern if the speakers are not sealed.

I see everyone pretty much agrees to avoid mains to be in-ceiling. I understand the rationale why, but I don't think I will have a choice. I checked in-wall next to the TV, but I don't have much space without tearing down the fireplace and making some major adjustments to the studs and beams inside the walls. However, I am considering the option of having a single center speaker below the TV, like a soundbar or something that looks nice and does not stand out significantly. I think I can get my wife to compromise, and I could use the center cable in the ceiling to install an in-ceiling SubWoofer, which would solve my SW issue... What does everyone think of this option? If I go this route, I would mount front & rear L/R in ceiling, in the center front would be the in-ceiling SW, and below the TV would be the center main speaker. If this is done, what kind of center channel would you recommend? I don't think I can do it in-wall, since there is a wall joist right in the middle of the wall which I cannot remove since it supports the TV, so it has to be a center speaker with the depth of a soundbar, or a soundbar.

Regarding everyone's responses to my original question, here are some comments:

@Danzilla31 - I had seen the RSLs, and the reason why I was a bit shy, is that they advertise them heavily as being ideal for DolbyAtmos setup, which means they are great in-ceiling, but wasn't sure if they would be equally suitable as main front/back speakers. What kind of setup did you have when you used them?

@DigitalDawn , @2channel lover - I will check out the Triads as well, thank you for that recommendation.

@BMXTRIX - Thank you for the Monoprice reminder....I have purchased cheap speakers from them before and they sound fantastic for the price. I think they are probably the generic brand of electronics, contracting out with many of the high-end companies... Coincidentally, the are having a sale right now for in-ceiling speakers... here are the ones that called my attention (sorry, since I am a newbie, I cannot post links until I have 5 posts )

Sycamore by Monoprice Architectural Ceiling Speakers 8in 3-way Aluminum with Micro Ceramic Composite Mid and Tweeter (Pair) - $122.99
Monoprice Alpha In-Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-Way with 15° Angled Drivers (pair) - $116.99
Monoprice Amber Ceiling Speakers 6.5-inch 2-way Carbon Fiber with Ribbon Tweeter (pair) - $84.99
Monoprice Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair) - $82.99 a pair

Thanks again for the feedback... I love all the answers and support from this community, keep them coming.

 

[2channel lover]

I'm not sure if on wall speakers will get the WAF stamp, but if so they would be better than in ceiling.

The biggest issue with in ceiling mains is the sound doesn't appear that it's coming from the TV. (the angled drivers help with that somewhat.

I've heard my cousin's all in ceiling surround sound system and for sports it's not the worst, but for movies and anything that has dialog coming from the TV where you see the talking...it's just not good. I haven't heard the Monoprice in ceilings, but they are building a reputation for good quality at moderate prices.

I have heard a pair of Triads and they are comparable in sound quality to my in ceiling speakers that I have for whole house music. Noble Fidelity is off the beaten path, and relatively pricey, but worth it. All he does is inwall/inceiling speakers.

 

[Danzilla31]

Thanks everyone for the responses, please keep them coming. My house is a single story, so there is no concern if the speakers are not sealed.

I see everyone pretty much agrees to avoid mains to be in-ceiling. I understand the rationale why, but I don't think I will have a choice. I checked in-wall next to the TV, but I don't have much space without tearing down the fireplace and making some major adjustments to the studs and beams inside the walls. However, I am considering the option of having a single center speaker below the TV, like a soundbar or something that looks nice and does not stand out significantly. I think I can get my wife to compromise, and I could use the center cable in the ceiling to install an in-ceiling SubWoofer, which would solve my SW issue... What does everyone think of this option? If I go this route, I would mount front & rear L/R in ceiling, in the center front would be the in-ceiling SW, and below the TV would be the center main speaker. If this is done, what kind of center channel would you recommend? I don't think I can do it in-wall, since there is a wall joist right in the middle of the wall which I cannot remove since it supports the TV, so it has to be a center speaker with the depth of a soundbar, or a soundbar.

Regarding everyone's responses to my original question, here are some comments:

@Danzilla31 - I had seen the RSLs, and the reason why I was a bit shy, is that they advertise them heavily as being ideal for DolbyAtmos setup, which means they are great in-ceiling, but wasn't sure if they would be equally suitable as main front/back speakers. What kind of setup did you have when you used them?

@DigitalDawn , @2channel lover - I will check out the Triads as well, thank you for that recommendation.

@BMXTRIX - Thank you for the Monoprice reminder....I have purchased cheap speakers from them before and they sound fantastic for the price. I think they are probably the generic brand of electronics, contracting out with many of the high-end companies... Coincidentally, the are having a sale right now for in-ceiling speakers... here are the ones that called my attention (sorry, since I am a newbie, I cannot post links until I have 5 posts )

Sycamore by Monoprice Architectural Ceiling Speakers 8in 3-way Aluminum with Micro Ceramic Composite Mid and Tweeter (Pair) - $122.99
Monoprice Alpha In-Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-Way with 15° Angled Drivers (pair) - $116.99
Monoprice Amber Ceiling Speakers 6.5-inch 2-way Carbon Fiber with Ribbon Tweeter (pair) - $84.99
Monoprice Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair) - $82.99 a pair

Thanks everyone for the responses, please keep them coming. My house is a single story, so there is no concern if the speakers are not sealed.

I see everyone pretty much agrees to avoid mains to be in-ceiling. I understand the rationale why, but I don't think I will have a choice. I checked in-wall next to the TV, but I don't have much space without tearing down the fireplace and making some major adjustments to the studs and beams inside the walls. However, I am considering the option of having a single center speaker below the TV, like a soundbar or something that looks nice and does not stand out significantly. I think I can get my wife to compromise, and I could use the center cable in the ceiling to install an in-ceiling SubWoofer, which would solve my SW issue... What does everyone think of this option? If I go this route, I would mount front & rear L/R in ceiling, in the center front would be the in-ceiling SW, and below the TV would be the center main speaker. If this is done, what kind of center channel would you recommend? I don't think I can do it in-wall, since there is a wall joist right in the middle of the wall which I cannot remove since it supports the TV, so it has to be a center speaker with the depth of a soundbar, or a soundbar.

Regarding everyone's responses to my original question, here are some comments:

@Danzilla31 - I had seen the RSLs, and the reason why I was a bit shy, is that they advertise them heavily as being ideal for DolbyAtmos setup, which means they are great in-ceiling, but wasn't sure if they would be equally suitable as main front/back speakers. What kind of setup did you have when you used them?

@DigitalDawn , @2channel lover - I will check out the Triads as well, thank you for that recommendation.

@BMXTRIX - Thank you for the Monoprice reminder....I have purchased cheap speakers from them before and they sound fantastic for the price. I think they are probably the generic brand of electronics, contracting out with many of the high-end companies... Coincidentally, the are having a sale right now for in-ceiling speakers... here are the ones that called my attention (sorry, since I am a newbie, I cannot post links until I have 5 posts )

Sycamore by Monoprice Architectural Ceiling Speakers 8in 3-way Aluminum with Micro Ceramic Composite Mid and Tweeter (Pair) - $122.99
Monoprice Alpha In-Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-Way with 15° Angled Drivers (pair) - $116.99
Monoprice Amber Ceiling Speakers 6.5-inch 2-way Carbon Fiber with Ribbon Tweeter (pair) - $84.99
Monoprice Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair) - $82.99 a pair

Thanks again for the feedback... I love all the answers and support from this community, keep them coming.

When I spoke to RSL about them they said they were designed more for music and movies and are actually able to handle atmos super easy. They are actually overbuilt for that purpose. They are great guys and have always treated me well and they have a reputation for amazing products

I saw no reason for them to mislead me

They were installed as my height speakers in a 7.2.4 layout I had.

But they sounded fantastic not only for this use but also in multichannel stereo music listening as well

I have no doubt that they would do well for what you have in mind

 

[Danzilla31]

Thanks everyone for the responses, please keep them coming. My house is a single story, so there is no concern if the speakers are not sealed.

I see everyone pretty much agrees to avoid mains to be in-ceiling. I understand the rationale why, but I don't think I will have a choice. I checked in-wall next to the TV, but I don't have much space without tearing down the fireplace and making some major adjustments to the studs and beams inside the walls. However, I am considering the option of having a single center speaker below the TV, like a soundbar or something that looks nice and does not stand out significantly. I think I can get my wife to compromise, and I could use the center cable in the ceiling to install an in-ceiling SubWoofer, which would solve my SW issue... What does everyone think of this option? If I go this route, I would mount front & rear L/R in ceiling, in the center front would be the in-ceiling SW, and below the TV would be the center main speaker. If this is done, what kind of center channel would you recommend? I don't think I can do it in-wall, since there is a wall joist right in the middle of the wall which I cannot remove since it supports the TV, so it has to be a center speaker with the depth of a soundbar, or a soundbar.

Regarding everyone's responses to my original question, here are some comments:

@Danzilla31 - I had seen the RSLs, and the reason why I was a bit shy, is that they advertise them heavily as being ideal for DolbyAtmos setup, which means they are great in-ceiling, but wasn't sure if they would be equally suitable as main front/back speakers. What kind of setup did you have when you used them?

@DigitalDawn , @2channel lover - I will check out the Triads as well, thank you for that recommendation.

@BMXTRIX - Thank you for the Monoprice reminder....I have purchased cheap speakers from them before and they sound fantastic for the price. I think they are probably the generic brand of electronics, contracting out with many of the high-end companies... Coincidentally, the are having a sale right now for in-ceiling speakers... here are the ones that called my attention (sorry, since I am a newbie, I cannot post links until I have 5 posts )

Sycamore by Monoprice Architectural Ceiling Speakers 8in 3-way Aluminum with Micro Ceramic Composite Mid and Tweeter (Pair) - $122.99
Monoprice Alpha In-Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-Way with 15° Angled Drivers (pair) - $116.99
Monoprice Amber Ceiling Speakers 6.5-inch 2-way Carbon Fiber with Ribbon Tweeter (pair) - $84.99
Monoprice Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair) - $82.99 a pair

Thanks again for the feedback... I love all the answers and support from this community, keep them coming.

Man I'm sorry my answer got mixed up in the quote basically what I said was RSL told me these speakers were built for more then atmos.

They would have in my opinion no issues for what you need them for.

They were used for atmos in my system but I loved how they sounded in multichannel stereo for music

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I have been looking at B&Ws CCM663 and 664

Well, if you must have in-ceiling speakers and always wanted B&W, I would go for the CCM683 (1" tweeter, 8" woofer, 89dB/2.83v/m sensitivity).

The bigger 8" driver would probably give you a little more dynamics and play a little louder.

These ceiling speakers are pretty small and meant for "surround sound duty". So I think the bigger 8" will help a little with the dynamics.