I want to do ONE THING on my current system but don't know how!

[Beattieboy]

Ok, I'm older but not quite 4 times older than my 19 year old components that still work great! I have Surround Sound (SS)via a Denon AVR3300 and a 2011 Vizio M550SV half smart TV with 4 HDMI ports. I get SS with the TV, DVD and the VCR. The ONE THING additional that I would like to do if possible with the current system is to get surround sound while using the ROKU device (and/or the Fire Stick) in one of the HDMI ports! I've tried everything I know to do but assume I MUST have an AVR receiver with an HDMI port in order to get the surround sound for the new devices into 5 great speakers.

ANY way to do it without purchasing a new Denon or it's equivalent? If so, what is the least expensive unit to accomplish this ONE THING? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank You.

 

[slipperybidness]

Ok, I'm older but not quite 4 times older than my 19 year old components that still work great! I have Surround Sound (SS)via a Denon AVR3300 and a 2011 Vizio M550SV half smart TV with 4 HDMI ports. I get SS with the TV, DVD and the VCR. The ONE THING additional that I would like to do if possible with the current system is to get surround sound while using the ROKU device (and/or the Fire Stick) in one of the HDMI ports! I've tried everything I know to do but assume I MUST have an AVR receiver with an HDMI port in order to get the surround sound for the new devices into 5 great speakers.

ANY way to do it without purchasing a new Denon or it's equivalent? If so, what is the least expensive unit to accomplish this ONE THING? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank You.

Someone here will likely get you going. I don't quite understand the problem here, that AVR has HDMI, right? Perhaps there is a Roku setting you need to change?

On a side note:
I have never used one of these, but it may be worth looking into it
https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_1_16?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=hdmi+audio+extractor&sprefix=hdmi+audio+extra,aps,161&crid=2EYR226ICJOSN

 

[Beattieboy]

Thanks for your reply. No, this 19 year Denon does NOT have a HDMI inputs or outputs...don't think there was such a thing at time this was installed...1999-2000. Only Vizio TV has the HDMI inputs. I tried numerous settings on the sound part of the Roku as well as the Denon and nothing changes. The DVD player as well as the seldom used VCR plug into the Denon and it recognizes them. That's why I assume, but certainly don't know, that's the reason the ROKU device does not receive Surround....in effect it by-passes the receiver. Somebody will know for sure!

As to the amazon link you provided....that looks interesting IF the ROKU plugs directly into it...but then I would need to find a way to connect that to the existing Denon......

As you say, someone with a similar problem in the past will likely pick up on this. This is a great Forum and with really helpful and knowledgeable participants. Glad I stumbled on it.

 

[lovinthehd]

Your tv is connected to the receiver via optical? Even if it has an optical output the tv may only pass 2.0 audio, tho. Is that all you get now using the Roku/fire stick devices is 2.0?

 

[Beattieboy]

All I get now via Roku is sound from the TV speakers. Honestly, I don't know if it is 2.0 or something else....

 

[lovinthehd]

All I get now via Roku is sound from the TV speakers. Honestly, I don't know if it is 2.0 or something else....

Yes that tv would be 2.0 thru its speakers. So do you have any audio output connection on tv to avr?

Even if 2.0 only you could just upmix it to surround with the avr....

 

[Beattieboy]

Yes! I do have and have had audio output from the tv to the avr order least I think I do since I assume that is how I now get surround sound now from the tv. Maybe not....it does go through a cable box first and then the avr. So when I turn on SS for tv I DO have yo turn down the sound on just the tv. BUT you are suggesting I can do audio out from the tv into the avr and get SS. I'll have to check that out....it's all enclosed and will take some doing but if that will work it's worth taking it all out. Probably have to turn off internal tv speakers and direct all to external speakers.....treating the avr as external speakers? Don't forget my original disclaimer that I'm not only a neophyte but an old one at that. All help is appreciated....and needed.

 

[lovinthehd]

I'm just trying to determine what you have now and what you can do with what you've got for now, keeping that device slip advised off to the side for now. You're getting 5.1 audio from your cable box it sounds like, as you said your cable box is connected to your avr (as is your dvd player).

How are the cable box and dvd player connected to the avr, i.e. what specific types of cables/connections? Are they also separately connected to your tv? How is the tv audio connected to the avr? How is the avr currently connected to the avr for video as well as audio?

 

[highfigh]

Ok, I'm older but not quite 4 times older than my 19 year old components that still work great! I have Surround Sound (SS)via a Denon AVR3300 and a 2011 Vizio M550SV half smart TV with 4 HDMI ports. I get SS with the TV, DVD and the VCR. The ONE THING additional that I would like to do if possible with the current system is to get surround sound while using the ROKU device (and/or the Fire Stick) in one of the HDMI ports! I've tried everything I know to do but assume I MUST have an AVR receiver with an HDMI port in order to get the surround sound for the new devices into 5 great speakers.

ANY way to do it without purchasing a new Denon or it's equivalent? If so, what is the least expensive unit to accomplish this ONE THING? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank You.

The cheap way to do this is by using an HDMI switch, which would do the obvious for the video and send an optical output to the AVR. Vanco makes these and they're not terribly expensive, but the cost will depend on the number of HDMI ports. It's a small device and comes with a thin remote. It would require connecting to the TV with an HDMI cable, since the AVR won't convert from that to Component video.

 

[BMXTRIX]

Good recommendation above, and that's what I would go with. Something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/TOSLINK-Optical-Extractor-Splitter-Supports/dp/B01K7BZ1XC/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1511885204&sr=8-3&keywords=hdmi+switch+with+optical+out

This will give you 3 HDMI connections for the TV, and you can connect the single optical audio cable to your receiver for surround sound. If you need more than 3 connections, then there are larger versions.

If you just want your one device (Roku for example) then you can just get a basic HDMI audio extractor like this one...
https://www.amazon.com/ViewHD-Extractor-Optical-Toslink-Converter/dp/B00KBHX072/ref=sr_1_18?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1511885397&sr=1-18&keywords=hdmi+audio+extractor

Be aware that the links provided are for 1080p or HDMI 1.4 sources, not HDMI 2.0 w/HDCP2.2 sources. If you want 4K on your display from your sources using HDMI 2.0 enabled devices, then you may want to try something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/FiveHome-Extractor-Splitter-Optical-Supports/dp/B076XV1LVS/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1511885517&sr=1-2-spons&keywords=hdmi+arc+audio+extractor&psc=1

Which will pull audio off the TV directly and feed it out of the optical audio output to your receiver.

Yeah, what you want to do is possible, and fairly well supported in any number of ways.

 

[Beattieboy]

I'm just trying to determine what you have now and what you can do with what you've got for now, keeping that device slip advised off to the side for now. You're getting 5.1 audio from your cable box it sounds like, as you said your cable box is connected to your avr (as is your dvd player).

How are the cable box and dvd player connected to the avr, i.e. what specific types of cables/connections? Are they also separately connected to your tv? How is the tv audio connected to the avr? How is the avr currently connected to the avr for video as well as audio?

I'm just trying to determine what you have now and what you can do with what you've got for now, keeping that device slip advised off to the side for now. You're getting 5.1 audio from your cable box it sounds like, as you said your cable box is connected to your avr (as is your dvd player).

How are the cable box and dvd player connected to the avr, i.e. what specific types of cables/connections? Are they also separately connected to your tv? How is the tv audio connected to the avr? How is the avr currently connected to the avr for video as well as audio?

Sorry for the delay in responding to your questions....just takes me longer since my components are tightly enclosed (with cables much too short I'm finding out) and my tv is mounted. I have partial answers with photos for the tv cables and assumptions for the Denon/DVD Player/VCR connections.

The Vizio does indeed have an audio out available along with an "Optical Audio Out" whatever that is and does. You can see from the photos that the DVD (#4 HDMI) is connected with a Vizio supplied cable that I assume goes to the Denon. The components are connected with typical RCA connectors...again I assume directly to the Denon.

SO, the configuration you are suggesting is that I run an RCA cable from the Vizio Audio out to the Denon Audio IN inputs...is that correct? I assume this results in whatever sound generated by the TV (in this case the HDMI connected Roku) will pass through the Denon as Surround Sound. Except for accessing the Denon, that sounds easy though I'm not yet clear on what actions or configuring I must do on the Denon Remote. Right now, that is easy as well since I just choose TV, DVD, VCR etc and whatever type sound (ProLogic, 5-1, etc) is best. Surely I'm missing something but I'll await your response.

In the meantime, I'm trying to translate the two excellent responses below that suggest an HDMI switch. While that seems to accomplish the same thing in a different way, after the first couple of readings of the posts and reviewing the products at Amazon and Vanco, I may have to get someone to help me with those connections.

I'll await your and other responses. I really envy the knowledge you folk have on these issues. Time has passed my ability to catch up now, so I'm having to 'make do' as we say in the south. This site is making 'make do' more doable and I'm grateful (along with being confused, of course).

 

[Beattieboy]

Good recommendation above, and that's what I would go with. Something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/TOSLINK-Optical-Extractor-Splitter-Supports/dp/B01K7BZ1XC/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1511885204&sr=8-3&keywords=hdmi+switch+with+optical+out

This will give you 3 HDMI connections for the TV, and you can connect the single optical audio cable to your receiver for surround sound. If you need more than 3 connections, then there are larger versions.

If you just want your one device (Roku for example) then you can just get a basic HDMI audio extractor like this one...
https://www.amazon.com/ViewHD-Extractor-Optical-Toslink-Converter/dp/B00KBHX072/ref=sr_1_18?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1511885397&sr=1-18&keywords=hdmi+audio+extractor

Be aware that the links provided are for 1080p or HDMI 1.4 sources, not HDMI 2.0 w/HDCP2.2 sources. If you want 4K on your display from your sources using HDMI 2.0 enabled devices, then you may want to try something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/FiveHome-Extractor-Splitter-Optical-Supports/dp/B076XV1LVS/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1511885517&sr=1-2-spons&keywords=hdmi+arc+audio+extractor&psc=1

Which will pull audio off the TV directly and feed it out of the optical audio output to your receiver.

Yeah, what you want to do is possible, and fairly well supported in any number of ways.

Thanks BMX and highfigh for this option. As noted above, I've reviewed your suggestions as well as the products that support them. In essence, I would be VERY content with just ONE HDMI connection as I assume I could just interchange the ROKU and Firestick devices as needed. The actual connections remain a little puzzling to me but am quite willing to give it a try or find someone who could do it for me. My 7 grand-kids are great with electronics as long as the device rings (or even more annoying sounds), lights up, and connects to the internet automatically. As to what to do in connecting various components like this, well if there were a category below Audiophyte they would barely achieve that one.

I'll await lovinthehd's comments on the above (and any comments you may have on that configuration) and go from there. I just want to get it done in the quickest, easiest and most economical way possible...but don't we all.

Frankly, I wondered from the beginning in the original post if just purchasing this Pioneer product (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01EN005W0/ref=pe_210290_262947430_em_1p_0_ti) would solve my problems quicker, better and cleaner but was dissuaded simply because what I have works great .....until the new-fangled devices called Roku and Firestick came along. I assume (I've use that word a lot in these posts) that if my TV were smart enough to allow for the downloading of additional apps I could just download Netflix and Amazon Prime Video and then all would work the way I am trying to get it to work now. The Vizio I have came with a few apps but it will NOT let me add any others!

Thanks, again, Audioholics.

 

[lovinthehd]

While I think your best solution is likely to get an hdmi splitter as suggested, I'm still unclear on how your other devices are connected to your receiver, tho.

FYI right now that input to the tv is component and composite, component for the video (3 rca cables on the left of the picture) and two composite cables (2.0, left & right channel inputs, the two rca cables on the right) for the audio.

The one end of the hdmi cord doesn't tell me a lot. If the other end is the dvd player then perhaps your dvd player is then connected to your avr for audio with an optical or coax digital cable to enable your avr to be supplied with 5.1 audio.

Similarly you can use an optical cable from your tv to your avr....but you may or may not get 5.1 audio this way; I looked in your tv manual briefly and while the optical out has settings for Dolby Digital, PCM or off. This doesn't mean that audio from an hdmi input, such as your Roku/Fire Stick, will come out 5.1 (quite a few tvs will only output 2.0 from such inputs, but may allow 5.1 from over-the-air reception). This is an optical cable https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-Digital-Optical-Audio-Toslink/dp/B00L3KO5WK?psc=1&SubscriptionId=AKIAILSHYYTFIVPWUY6Q&tag=duckduckgo-d-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B00L3KO5WK.

A photo of the back of your avr would be nice as well as the other devices to get a complete picture. Be careful with too-short cords as you move things around, stress on the connections isn't a good thing. Might want to get one of your tech savvy kids/grandkids to help out even with an hdmi splitter install....it's probably right up their alley.

Good luck!

 

[Beattieboy]

While I think your best solution is likely to get an hdmi splitter as suggested, I'm still unclear on how your other devices are connected to your receiver, tho.

FYI right now that input to the tv is component and composite, component for the video (3 rca cables on the left of the picture) and two composite cables (2.0, left & right channel inputs, the two rca cables on the right) for the audio.

The one end of the hdmi cord doesn't tell me a lot. If the other end is the dvd player then perhaps your dvd player is then connected to your avr for audio with an optical or coax digital cable to enable your avr to be supplied with 5.1 audio.

Similarly you can use an optical cable from your tv to your avr....but you may or may not get 5.1 audio this way; I looked in your tv manual briefly and while the optical out has settings for Dolby Digital, PCM or off. This doesn't mean that audio from an hdmi input, such as your Roku/Fire Stick, will come out 5.1 (quite a few tvs will only output 2.0 from such inputs, but may allow 5.1 from over-the-air reception). This is an optical cable https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-Digital-Optical-Audio-Toslink/dp/B00L3KO5WK?psc=1&SubscriptionId=AKIAILSHYYTFIVPWUY6Q&tag=duckduckgo-d-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B00L3KO5WK.

A photo of the back of your avr would be nice as well as the other devices to get a complete picture. Be careful with too-short cords as you move things around, stress on the connections isn't a good thing. Might want to get one of your tech savvy kids/grandkids to help out even with an hdmi splitter install....it's probably right up their alley.

Good luck!

Your thoughtful and well reasoned replies are very much appreciated.

I, too, looked at the manual today because right now I have to 'feel' the connections...can't get the Denon to budge and don't want to force it for the reasons you mentioned and the sheer laborious nature of it. All this was put in years ago and while it looks great...well, it's not too helpful servicing....kinda like a car engine in that regard! I feel I am taking advantage of your generosity and time since you even took the added step of going to the Denon 3300 manual. Perhaps this will conclude this approach to resolving the problem.

I have taken snap shots of the parts of the manual that are applicable and will attach them...though I realize you would prefer to see the actual connections in order to see, for example, the other end of the DVD cable. I'll try to get it. In the meantime, while I see an Optical Audio OUT on the Vizio, I do NOT see anything like an Optical Audio IN on the Denon....can that be? If so, where would the other end of the OA OUT go?

I appreciate your confidence in my grandkids but unfortunately there is a very conspicuous similarity beyond the genetic predisposition.

Here are the shots from the manual. Is it safe to assume I can plug one end of a an L/R RCA component into the tv inputs and the other end in the Surround Sound B slots or even the unused VCR etc. slots? Surely the worst that can happen is a very loud HUM....so long as that's not the last noise it makes.

EDITED ADDITION: You were right. I checked the DVD player and the cord there is long enough to access the back and the other end of the HDMI is plugged in to that device. The Optical Outlet has a cable in the Optical Audio OUT and so I guess it goes to the Denon as well...though, again, I don't see an OA IN input...so I'm missing something there. Photo attached. It appears above for some reason.

 

[lovinthehd]

Actually I hadn't looked at the AVR3300 manual yet, just the tv's manual. I did just view the avr manual and it indicates you have optical inputs, 3 of them, and one digital coax input, in the lower left corner of your unit looking at the back.

 

[Beattieboy]

Actually I hadn't looked at the AVR3300 manual yet, just the tv's manual. I did just view the avr manual and it indicates you have optical inputs, 3 of them, and one digital coax input, in the lower left corner of your unit looking at the back.

Thanks, again lovinthehd! I had noticed the 3 optical inputs that you point out BUT in another schematic in the manual (pg 7 ) they are shown as "Optical Outputs" (photo attached). I had assumed that I could not go from an Optical OUT on the back of the Vizio TV to an Optical Out on the back of the Denon. Is that assumption wrong? I do not see an Optical IN anywhere on the Denon. In the meantime, I have ordered a 9 ft Optical cable from Amazon...arriving Friday.

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks, again lovinthehd! I had noticed the 3 optical inputs that you point out BUT in another schematic in the manual (pg 7 ) they are shown as "Optical Outputs" (photo attached). I had assumed that I could not go from an Optical OUT on the back of the Vizio TV to an Optical Out on the back of the Denon. Is that assumption wrong? I do not see an Optical IN anywhere on the Denon. In the meantime, I have ordered a 9 ft Optical cable from Amazon...arriving Friday.View attachment 22976

An easier way to view is downloading a pdf of the manual, you can do it free from here (maybe even still the Denon site, this came up first) https://www.manualslib.com/manual/38363/Denon-Avr-3300.html

The outlined box surrounded the 3 optical and one digital coax ports are labeled "in" on the diagram on page 7 and page 7 connection diagram refers to connecting the optical audio outs of other gear, in their examples MD and CD players, to the optical audio ins in that lower left corner of the avr.

Once you get your optical cable then connect the optical out on the tv to the optical in on the avr, it appears using optical 3 is the default for the tv/dbs input per page 25 of the manual (or you can use the instructions for assignment).

You're getting there....altho it still may not give you 5.1 audio via the optical from hdmi inputs to the tv.

 

[Beattieboy]

An easier way to view is downloading a pdf of the manual, you can do it free from here (maybe even still the Denon site, this came up first) https://www.manualslib.com/manual/38363/Denon-Avr-3300.html

The outlined box surrounded the 3 optical and one digital coax ports are labeled "in" on the diagram on page 7 and page 7 connection diagram refers to connecting the optical audio outs of other gear, in their examples MD and CD players, to the optical audio ins in that lower left corner of the avr.

Once you get your optical cable then connect the optical out on the tv to the optical in on the avr, it appears using optical 3 is the default for the tv/dbs input per page 25 of the manual (or you can use the instructions for assignment).

You're getting there....altho it still may not give you 5.1 audio via the optical from hdmi inputs to the tv.

Thanks, yet again. I am getting there indeed...with your help. Now I understand the outlined box...that makes far more sense.....ok...common sense even...than me trying to make it a Output. So, I'll have no problem with that...other than getting to it. Final question, do I still use the audio L/R component cable or does the Optical cable carry everything?

Thanks, my friend.

 

[Beattieboy]

The optical cable didn't work. No sound at all. Yes, Optical 3 was the default for TV/dvs but that made no difference/ Reassignment made no difference. No settings within the TV, Roku (although the TV did recognize Roku with or without the cable) or the Denon changed anything.

Guess I'll just give up on the idea and live with good surround sound on TV, DVD Player and VCR and decent monaural on Roku. I'm just out of my league or any league now when it comes to electronics.

However, I do VERY much appreciate the input from this site and especially lovinthehd, BMX TRIX and highfigh as well previous posts on issue.

Thank you all for your willingness to try.

 

[lovinthehd]

The optical cable didn't work. No sound at all. Yes, Optical 3 was the default for TV/dvs but that made no difference/ Reassignment made no difference. No settings within the TV, Roku (although the TV did recognize Roku with or without the cable) or the Denon changed anything.

Guess I'll just give up on the idea and live with good surround sound on TV, DVD Player and VCR and decent monaural on Roku. I'm just out of my league or any league now when it comes to electronics.

However, I do VERY much appreciate the input from this site and especially lovinthehd, BMX TRIX and highfigh as well previous posts on issue.

Thank you all for your willingness to try.

You got no audio from the tv, whether thru over the air, or any other source? In the audio menu, turning tv speakers off and setting the advanced setting for digital audio output to dolby surround or pcm still got you no audio?