how to tell a tweeter is damaged?

[curiouslynub]

alright. i posted this on another forum but everyone seemed so sure either my source sucked or the problem comes from my receiver.

i feel like it is the tweeters but im a complete noob so idk.

setup: harman kardon 3490 receiver and behringer b2031p bookshelves

1. with no signal, i can hear a bit of hiss from the tweeters that gets louder as i turn up the volume.

2. when i play music,i can always hear this hiss, and some sounds that come from the tweeters just seems like a hiss

3. when i use my earphones with my ipod and laptop everything is crystal clear in the highs. when i plug my ipod and laptop in the receiver - i get a hiss.

4. when i play music loudly the hiss greatly increases and is louder then before even at lower volumes.

it is starting to seem like my receiver and tweeters are ****ed.
how can i tell for SURE that my tweeters are bad? this is a new setup, ive been going nuts since i got them trying to figure out whats wrong. i have nothing to compare it to besides an old crappy sony stereo that has smoother sound...

if i open up the speakers will there be any visible signs of damage on the tweeters?

i have 2 weeks to fix this before i move to school.

im currently trying to figure out whats wrong by calling harman kardon except i keep getting people with heavy indian accents that think the sound is coming straight out of the receiver and asking if i can hear it with no speakers plugged in....then they tell me to unplug everything for 20 minutes and call back....i did this twice!!!!

 

[j_garcia]

Hiss has nothing at all to do with damaged tweeters. That is a function of amplification. An amplifier amplifies everything, including background noise that is in the system. This is normal, there is nothing wrong with your system except that you have enough noise in it that it is audible. No point in listening to your system with nothing playing...so play something and enjoy.

 

[curiouslynub]

well this noise is audible to the point where it may as well be part of the music.

i cant say i heard a lot of nice audio setups or listened critically but ive heard boat loads of crappy laptop/computer setups to know what bad sound quality is - and it does not have this hiss.....also, the car im curently driving has a stock speaker setup with no fancy system and is clearer than this..

something is wrong...

 

[j_garcia]

What is the source and does it happen on all sources or only one? Did you try the same source on different inputs? And how is it connected? I don't think it is the tweeters. Damaged tweeters will either play low, crackle or simply not play at all when damaged.

 

[curiouslynub]

ive used the tuner, and my ipod and laptop connected by analog. it all sounds the same. however, it sounds expecially bad when i play music with lots of high frequencies which dont get played on the radio.

i realize digital will be better but it can't be this picky. the selling point of this receiver was that its not picky of the source

ive tried multiple inputs....funny thing is when i put it in the video 3 input..i can hear music faintly when i switch to video 2.....

also it seems to me when the speakers are trying to play a lot of sounds - when theres a lot going on in the song - it seems to mush together on the high end and sound like more hiss. - the more i think about this.....is it possible that my speakers are just bad and have beyond horrible tweeters? cause the woofer takes everything i throw at it like a champ, i love it!, the tweeter - not so much.

 

[Pyrrho]

ive used the tuner, and my ipod and laptop connected by analog. it all sounds the same. however, it sounds expecially bad when i play music with lots of high frequencies which dont get played on the radio.

i realize digital will be better but it can't be this picky. the selling point of this receiver was that its not picky of the source

ive tried multiple inputs....funny thing is when i put it in the video 3 input..i can hear music faintly when i switch to video 2.....

also it seems to me when the speakers are trying to play a lot of sounds - when theres a lot going on in the song - it seems to mush together on the high end and sound like more hiss. - the more i think about this.....is it possible that my speakers are just bad and have beyond horrible tweeters? cause the woofer takes everything i throw at it like a champ, i love it!, the tweeter - not so much.

No, it is not your speakers. Unpowered speakers, by themselves, make no sound. If they are "hissing", it is because a signal is being sent to them. If it is all sources, then you may have a problem with your receiver. It is possible you are picking up some noise with something, so here is what I recommend that you do. With everything off, disconnect all of your sources. If, at a normal volume setting (not excessively high), while you are at your normal seating position, if you hear this hissing, then most likely your receiver has a problem. If you don't hear hissing, then (again, with it off) hook up one thing and try that, and continue until you encounter a problem (making sure that you connect and disconnect only with the power off).

 

[TLS Guy]

No, it is not your speakers. Unpowered speakers, by themselves, make no sound. If they are "hissing", it is because a signal is being sent to them. If it is all sources, then you may have a problem with your receiver. It is possible you are picking up some noise with something, so here is what I recommend that you do. With everything off, disconnect all of your sources. If, at a normal volume setting (not excessively high), while you are at your normal seating position, if you hear this hissing, then most likely your receiver has a problem. If you don't hear hissing, then (again, with it off) hook up one thing and try that, and continue until you encounter a problem (making sure that you connect and disconnect only with the power off).

You say headphone listening is fine, so I doubt it is the source.

So that leaves the receiver being a problem and having inadequate signal to noise ratio for your tastes.

Or, it is your speakers? It is true that the speakers can not generate noise by themselves. However they can certainly emphasize it if there is a problem in the 4 to 8 kHz region.

A way to sort this out is to listen to the s sounds on speech and vocals. If the s sounds are sibilant and emphasized then you need better speakers. If the s sound is not sibilant, then you need a receiver of higher quality.

This is not an expensive rig, and people vary in their sensitivity to audio ills greatly, at least that is my experience. Some being very annoyed at minor imperfections, others being oblivious to gross imperfections.

Unfortunately I have always been of the group that hears problems fast, and they sound worse to me, over time. If you are in this group, then you will have to move much higher up the food chain so to speak.

 

[Nugu]

Is the receiver grounded? You aren't using a 3-to-2 prong converter are you? Have you tried moving to a different power circuit? Take it to a different section of your house that's on a different breaker and try it.

 

[TLS Guy]

Is the receiver grounded? You aren't using a 3-to-2 prong converter are you? Have you tried moving to a different power circuit? Take it to a different section of your house that's on a different breaker and try it.

This is not the issue. Ground loops cause hums and buzzes, not hiss, ever.

 

[Pyrrho]

You say headphone listening is fine, so I doubt it is the source.

So that leaves the receiver being a problem and having inadequate signal to noise ratio for your tastes.

Or, it is your speakers? It is true that the speakers can not generate noise by themselves. However they can certainly emphasize it if there is a problem in the 4 to 8 kHz region.

A way to sort this out is to listen to the s sounds on speech and vocals. If the s sounds are sibilant and emphasized then you need better speakers. If the s sound is not sibilant, then you need a receiver of higher quality.

This is not an expensive rig, and people vary in their sensitivity to audio ills greatly, at least that is my experience. Some being very annoyed at minor imperfections, others being oblivious to gross imperfections.

Unfortunately I have always been of the group that hears problems fast, and they sound worse to me, over time. If you are in this group, then you will have to move much higher up the food chain so to speak.

Sometimes interference of some type is picked up with connections. The initial post seems to indicate that the headphone listening was done with the gear not hooked to the receiver, and was done plugged into the sources.

With the hiss going up with the volume control, the source of the problem must be prior to the volume control in the circuitry. Otherwise, it would not affect the level of hiss.

 

[Pyrrho]

...

1. with no signal, i can hear a bit of hiss from the tweeters that gets louder as i turn up the volume.
...

Just to be clear, when the volume is set for a level that you would normally use for listening to music, when you have nothing playing (all sources are off), you hear this hiss from your listening position, right? It is normal to hear a low level hiss when placing your ear very near a tweeter with the volume control turned up half way, and that is irrelevant to what you hear when listening to music in your listening seat.

 

[TLS Guy]

Sometimes interference of some type is picked up with connections. The initial post seems to indicate that the headphone listening was done with the gear not hooked to the receiver, and was done plugged into the sources.

With the hiss going up with the volume control, the source of the problem must be prior to the volume control in the circuitry. Otherwise, it would not affect the level of hiss.

I was under the impression the OP could hear hiss with no input as he advances the volume.

So, the question for the OP is:- can you hear the hiss at your seated position at the volume setting you are using for music?

Hiss in my experience usually comes from high gain stages prior to the volume control.

There is one other possible explanation. The OP seems to be likely using compressed lossy digital sources. These sources can certainly produce the affect of a sort of hiss smear. I have heard it often, and generally I will not listen to lossy codecs if I can help it.

The only one I'm having success with is the 192 kbs stream from the BBC. They have designed and built in house servers, as they have not liked what is on offer. The BBC project is Coyopa.

The fidelity from the Proms this year, though not perfect, has been to me, at least, been nothing short of astonishing. The bass, always a great weakness of digital compression, has been amazing. The BBC promise a further improvements to come in short order. It is the nature and history of the BBC to work on, and solve significant problems, that others choose to ignore and gloss over.

I implore the OP to try an uncompressed CD and see if he still has the problem.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Try a different receiver and you will see.

 

[curiouslynub]

thanks for all the tips/advise....

i noticed that my desktop actually has an optical out - my 3 year old laptop does not - my 6 year old desktop does.....

so i went out and bought a toslink cable - downloaded some uncompressed, FLAC, music ~30mb a song.

from what i understand this takes out the source from being an issue.

now, the sound is much more refined, there is definitely an improvement, - the low end sounds absolutely amazing - but the highs still suck.

i dont know how to explain them anymore, they are just mush. the only time they sound good are the parts of some songs where you just hear vocals, so they sound good when they are not reproducing music lol.

they only thing keeping me from thinking 100% that they are not blown is that they produce some sounds very distinctly and loud - but most of the sound coming out of them is just noise.

this is making me think this now:

1. my tweeters are broken somehow and i just dont know.

or

2. is it possible that my receiver is broken in a way where it cannot process high frequencies correctly? - i did buy it refurbished after all....

i am having a hard time accepting the fact that these speakers may just not be very good, the only review i have seen that says anything about the highs being not so great is one consumer review stating the highs are a little harsh. i have read many posts with people praising the 2030's, i was under the impression the 2031's had the same tweeter. i highly doubt my $70 audio technica iems have spoiled me......

...i really wish i had another receiver to compare.....

 

[MatthewB.]

If your speakers sound like this guy, then your tweets are damaged.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxgpQc1Odf0&feature=search