How To Shop For Speakers

[dadriver]

Before I being let me qualify a few things, my general understanding of audio and intents. I’m hell-bent on building nice vintage stereo system...even though I’m sure and have been informed that I can do better by buying newer hifi and sound equipment, certainly true if I were to invest in high-end. Also, I have a good understanding of components and how to build a system but I am by no means an ”expert.” When I do buy if focus on what I like, how it sounds and how it looks more so than on spec...on the latter point maybe a little too much on looks. I want to get as much out of my investments as I can. Also, it’s been only since Oct. last year that I’ve started back with analog systems, escaping the digital prison I was in for the last 12 - 13 years; CDs before that. I don’t necessarily concern my self with cost but it is also true that I look for value. I’ll pay for it buy I just want to be completely satisfied and not feel that I didn’t get what I wanted. I have this problem with buying TVs too.

All that said, I just started investigating and looking for new “vintage” speakers. Doesn’t necessarily have to be vintage but that’s where I’ve started in the investigation. My question here is what is the best way to find and evaluate speakers to purchase. Read reviews, of course. Go listen to them in stores, yes! Buy what I like and sounds good...absolutely!! But in all my years I’ve kind struggled with this for the mere fact is I really can’t figure out where to end it. I mean there’s always something better just around the corner, right? Plus, I go from one place to the other and things vary...the room set up, the equipment, music, even the manufactures to compare side by side. Ultimately I loose sound detail down the road somewhere. How do you guys go through the process of finding speakers?

 

[NINaudio]

There is always something better out there. I try not to hang onto that thought and only think of upgrading when I feel something is lacking or could be improved upon. Otherwise you end up on a carousel of speaker hunting, amp hunting, changing everything you can and often times wind up not much better off than you were sonically, but you've got significantly less money.

Not sure what you mean by "lose sound detail down the road somewhere."

 

[dadriver]

There is always something better out there. I try not to hang onto that thought and only think of upgrading when I feel something is lacking or could be improved upon. Otherwise you end up on a carousel of speaker hunting, amp hunting, changing everything you can and often times wind up not much better off than you were sonically, but you've got significantly less money.

Not sure what you mean by "lose sound detail down the road somewhere."

I mostly mean tone quality. Just picked up some vintage Klipsch that sound pretty good and have more range than what I had but they sound lighter than what I prefer. Didn’t feel that when I listened them before bringing them home.

 

[lovinthehd]

Audio gear isn't really an investment, at least one with other than audio returns I don't see a whole lot of value in old analog systems, been there done that and mostly don't use what I still have from that era but I don't use analog sources much (still have a tt and record collection, but it's not used much. and works fine with my more digital based gear, too). Old TVs other than plasma, I'd definitely look to modern sets. YMMV of course....

Old speakers can be okay, but vintage is more than simply being old, too. Some were iconic/vintage for a good reason, many are simply old. I liked some of the speakers from when I first got "into" audio in the early 70s, like my Original Advents (that I ended up buying) and some of the JBLs (L100 and some of the studio stuff I couldn't afford). Some of the original AR speakers I liked, too. I don't even remember them all now. I did most of my listening at a couple stereo shops and friends' houses to get an idea for what was out there, don't even remember them all. I was mostly budget limited then, too....

I don't live where speaker shopping is but a really long drive, so I've tended the last coupla times to take my chances with the internet after doing some research of what was widely liked and measured reasonably well. Speakers are largely a personal subjective choice....like tone quality or sounding lighter than what you prefer...what does that mean to you vs another?

 

[Auditor55]

Before I being let me qualify a few things, my general understanding of audio and intents. I’m hell-bent on building nice vintage stereo system...even though I’m sure and have been informed that I can do better by buying newer hifi and sound equipment, certainly true if I were to invest in high-end. Also, I have a good understanding of components and how to build a system but I am by no means an ”expert.” When I do buy if focus on what I like, how it sounds and how it looks more so than on spec...on the latter point maybe a little too much on looks. I want to get as much out of my investments as I can. Also, it’s been only since Oct. last year that I’ve started back with analog systems, escaping the digital prison I was in for the last 12 - 13 years; CDs before that. I don’t necessarily concern my self with cost but it is also true that I look for value. I’ll pay for it buy I just want to be completely satisfied and not feel that I didn’t get what I wanted. I have this problem with buying TVs too.

All that said, I just started investigating and looking for new “vintage” speakers. Doesn’t necessarily have to be vintage but that’s where I’ve started in the investigation. My question here is what is the best way to find and evaluate speakers to purchase. Read reviews, of course. Go listen to them in stores, yes! Buy what I like and sounds good...absolutely!! But in all my years I’ve kind struggled with this for the mere fact is I really can’t figure out where to end it. I mean there’s always something better just around the corner, right? Plus, I go from one place to the other and things vary...the room set up, the equipment, music, even the manufactures to compare side by side. Ultimately I loose sound detail down the road somewhere. How do you guys go through the process of finding speakers?

Speakers, if money is no object and you the time, start with reviews. The next thing you should do is order some of the speakers you're interested in and have them delivered to your home as then listen to them. If you don't like them return them. The speakers are going to sound different in your home than they do in the stores, so having a nice return policy is very important.

As for TV's, you have really a few choices, OLED and various brands of FALD LED TV's.

 

[vader540is]

A lot of ID guys have in home demos. Some have return shipping cost which is well worth it IMO.

 

[ski2xblack]

The old Klipsch are in keeping within the retro vibe (the forte Ii from the same era were the gems), but illustrates the limits of the approach.

Weren't the BMRs suggested in another thread? Are they within your budget? Aim there. You can always request a groovy finish, and they would seriously outperform speakers manufactured in the groovy era.

 

[dadriver]

Audio gear isn't really an investment, at least one with other than audio returns I don't see a whole lot of value in old analog systems, been there done that and mostly don't use what I still have from that era but I don't use analog sources much (still have a tt and record collection, but it's not used much. and works fine with my more digital based gear, too). Old TVs other than plasma, I'd definitely look to modern sets. YMMV of course....

Old speakers can be okay, but vintage is more than simply being old, too. Some were iconic/vintage for a good reason, many are simply old. I liked some of the speakers from when I first got "into" audio in the early 70s, like my Original Advents (that I ended up buying) and some of the JBLs (L100 and some of the studio stuff I couldn't afford). Some of the original AR speakers I liked, too. I don't even remember them all now. I did most of my listening at a couple stereo shops and friends' houses to get an idea for what was out there, don't even remember them all. I was mostly budget limited then, too....

I don't live where speaker shopping is but a really long drive, so I've tended the last coupla times to take my chances with the internet after doing some research of what was widely liked and measured reasonably well. Speakers are largely a personal subjective choice....like tone quality or sounding lighter than what you prefer...what does that mean to you vs another?

Investment...HaHaHa! I have to stop using that word in these discussions. Yeah...what I mean is money spent in order to receive some value (other than actually money return).

Tone, for me at least, is obviously a very subjective trait. I can tell you I’m chasing after that nostalgic feeling (sound) I remember from 60s and my dad’s old system, Thelonius Monk and Jimmy Smith while playing cards and liquor being served, cigarettes and all that. I’m just getting old, I guess. The memories are deep and more meaningful. I’ll go ahead and say it, though probably over used: “Warm.” The KG3s I’m trying now just don’t quite reach that feeling.

 

[lovinthehd]

Investment...HaHaHa! I have to stop using that word in these discussions. Yeah...what I mean is money spent in order to receive some value (other than actually money return).

Tone, for me at least, is obviously a very subjective trait. I can tell you I’m chasing after that nostalgic feeling (sound) I remember from 60s and my dad’s old system, Thelonius Monk and Jimmy Smith while playing cards and liquor being served, cigarettes and all that. I’m just getting old, I guess. The memories are deep and more meaningful. I’ll go ahead and say it, though probably over used: “Warm.” The KG3s I’m trying now just don’t quite reach that feeling.

LOL I do crack up a bit when people use the word investment....altho some gear can hold value, especially with the current "vintage" craze. Matching up to a memory can be hard....like walking into a kitchen expecting the smells like mom's was No idea what speakers dad had? Warm may simply be lacking highs....my dad had some old largish diy full rangers I thought sounded good....until I got my Advents which were much better. If you can name some speakers that come close to your tastes then maybe some better suggestions might come out....

 

[ski2xblack]

It's not a sin to use the tone controls. I never met an old Klipsch speaker that didn't benefit from rolling back the treble and slightly goosing the bass. That era Klipsch were generally relatively bass shy, with suggested placement near walls/corners for a boundary gain boost to compensate. Raising them on strands (or anywhere off the floor) compounds the issue.

 

[dadriver]

LOL I do crack up a bit when people use the word investment....altho some gear can hold value, especially with the current "vintage" craze. Matching up to a memory can be hard....like walking into a kitchen expecting the smells like mom's was No idea what speakers dad had? Warm may simply be lacking highs....my dad had some old largish diy full rangers I thought sounded good....until I got my Advents which were much better. If you can name some speakers that come close to your tastes then maybe some better suggestions might come out....

Saw some ARs yesterday and thought the looked familiar but I’m not sure they are what dad had.

I’m in Reno and there’s not a lot of good stores around. Sacramento and Bay Area is likely where I’ll have to search but there’s a couple guys around here that seem to come across good old stuff. Bought my Marantz 2230 from one guy that sells on Craig’s. I guess this hunt will have to be my Moby lord helmet.

 

[dadriver]

It's not a sin to use the tone controls. I never met an old Klipsch speaker that didn't benefit from rolling back the treble and slightly goosing the bass. That era Klipsch were generally relatively bass shy, with suggested placement near walls/corners for a boundary gain boost to compensate. Raising them on strands or anywhere off the floor compounds the issue.

yes...I’ve noticed that and started to get much better results from the Klipsch. Like how you described it as potentially a “sin” because that’s exactly how I felt....I mean what else is all that control I have in my pre and power (receiver) for anyway??? Thanks for the validation

 

[Beave]

Saw some ARs yesterday and thought the looked familiar but I’m not sure they are what dad had.

I’m in Reno and there’s not a lot of good stores around. Sacramento and Bay Area is likely where I’ll have to search but there’s a couple guys around here that seem to come across good old stuff. Bought my Marantz 2230 from one guy that sells on Craig’s. I guess this hunt will have to be my Moby lord helmet.

LOL, I love the forum software! (For any new posters, it automatically replaced D!ck with "lord helmet" for some bizarre reason).

As for shopping for speakers and trying them out, more reliable than reviews are *measurements.* But finding good measurements on older, vintage speakers is nearly impossible. Stereophile has a lot of pretty reliable measurements for lots of speakers, as does the NRC.

The 'vintage' speaker look has come back recently as a popular nostalgic look, with the new JBL L100 Classic speakers or the smaller L82 Classic. They're pretty pricey, however.

https://www.jblsynthesis.com/products/loudspeakers/type/bookshelf-loudspeakers/


Wharfedale has some of their own now, too, the Linton Heritage Model. There are probably others.

Here's a review of the Wharfedales, with measurements. A more reasonable price, IMO.

https://www.stereophile.com/content/wharfedale-linton-heritage-loudspeaker

They appear to be a bit bass heavy (which may give you the sound you want?), but otherwise measure pretty well.

 

[dadriver]

LOL, I love the forum software! (For any new posters, it automatically replaced D!ck with "lord helmet" for some bizarre reason).

As for shopping for speakers and trying them out, more reliable than reviews are *measurements.* But finding good measurements on older, vintage speakers is nearly impossible. Stereophile has a lot of pretty reliable measurements for lots of speakers, as does the NRC.

The 'vintage' speaker look has come back recently as a popular nostalgic look, with the new JBL L100 Classic speakers or the smaller L82 Classic. They're pretty pricey, however.

https://www.jblsynthesis.com/products/loudspeakers/type/bookshelf-loudspeakers/


Wharfedale has some of their own now, too, the Linton Heritage Model. There are probably others.

Here's a review of the Wharfedales, with measurements. A more reasonable price, IMO.

https://www.stereophile.com/content/wharfedale-linton-heritage-loudspeaker

They appear to be a bit bass heavy (which may give you the sound you want?), but otherwise measure pretty well.

Lord Helmet. LOL!!!

 

[ski2xblack]

FYI, here is the kg3 spec sheet with one on axis measurement presumably taken in Klipsch's anechoic chamber.

 

[dadriver]

FYI, here is the kg3 spec sheet with one on axis measurement presumably taken in Klipsch's anechoic chamber.

You guys are great! Thanks!!

 

[Kvn_Walker]

I mostly mean tone quality. Just picked up some vintage Klipsch that sound pretty good and have more range than what I had but they sound lighter than what I prefer. Didn’t feel that when I listened them before bringing them home.

Often that's the result of listening to the same speakers in different rooms. You could possibly replicate the tonality you heard by trying various placements if you have the space in your listening room.

 

[VMPS-TIII]

The problem with vintage speakers is they are old.
As speakers age, they tend to start the journey back to dust. My subwoofer was making a weird noise the other day and I noticed one of the cones is separating. I thru some Hydroxychloroquine into the port but so far no cure.

 

[dadriver]

Haha! You’re killin’ me, Smalls.

The KG3s I found really do sounds nice though. I did manage to get really warm tone out of them and maintain the horn tones too. Pretty nice!

 

[Pogre]

I tried getting through your first post but there are so many contradictions I don't even know where to start... lol.

I'm gonna stick with my original suggestion for you with the BMR Philharmonitors for speakers. Like I said in your other thread, I think they're a great example of modern tech, engineering and superior build quality while still retaining an old school vintage feel. In my opinion that speaker hits all of your marks and I don't think I've ever heard anyone say they were less than stellar sounding speakers. I'm talking truly top of the heap. You will be extremely hard pressed to find a better sounding speaker, hands down. The guy who designed it is a legend in the industry.

Salk Sound

salksound.com