HD and BD DVD Compromise?

[Duffinator]

Let's hope so. A similar article was reported in the WSJ today. Not sure who has the upper hand here but what we all need is one format. Let's just hope it's BD and not HD.


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=581&ncid=581&e=8&u=/nm/20050413/tc_nm/tech_dvd_formatwar_dc

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

I would have to venture Blu-ray will win out this battle. In any event, we as consumers benefit from the awesome technology. Question is, will the recording industry be able to keep up with technology.

 

[MACCA350]

In any event, we as consumers benefit from the awesome technology

Not always, I fear whats happening with DVD-A and SACD may happen to the HD formats. With 2 different formats people will hold off waiting to see which format will stick around, so in the end neither may do very well.

They should have learned, consumers dont want to choose which is best, we will only invest in something that is backed by the whole movie industry and is guaranteed to be future proof. IMHO, the MPAA or someone should step in and decide which format to use, only this approach will raise consumer confidence.

cheers

 

[BMXTRIX]

DVD-A and SACD aren't new technolgoies, they are new recording formats on old technologies.

The new technology has nothing to do with HD. Okay, yes it does, but still...

The big push for a lot of DVD stuff came about because of storage capabilities on DVD. Suddenly every computer in the world has a DVD-ROM drive and a ton of new computers ship with DVD-R drives. Now you can back up a years worth of photos onto a single DVD-R. But, it isn't enough for a corporatation that needs to back up files on a nightly or weekly basis. The HD drives definitely start to fill that void. Just one muli-layer BD can hold what may be the entire accounting data for a fair number of small and mid-sized companies.

It seems like a lot of movie producers are backing HD-DVD, but they aren't being exclusive, while a LOT of hardware manufacturers, especially PC side manufacturers are supporting Blu-Ray Disc. That says a lot as next year I am sure we will see PCs shipping with Blu-Ray included with them. The PS3 is supposed to have it as well. Between new PCs and the PS3, that'll put Blu-Ray disc into a ton of homes... so movie makers will have some demand for the movies.

I would say the main hope for market penetration for HD-DVD is to hit the market first, be very price competitive, and to get into the new Nintendo gaming system. Not sure that'll do it either though. If there isn't going to be a war, then BD better be the winner, or we are all losers in this format debate.

 

[duff]

Now there's this from a PS3 mag:

http://ps2.ign.com/articles/606/606547p1.html?fromint=1

sounds like good news to me

 

[REWJR]

"I would have to venture Blu-ray will win out this battle"

IMHO all Sony/Mats camp is trying to screw Toshiba with the charade of unified format to delay HD-DVD from getting the jump on them...

I for one hope Toshiba HD-DVD camp does not fall for this and remains on target to release it's player in the fall along with 100 titles ...

I think all arguments about Blue-ray having more capacity are a red herring due to the latest announcement by Toshiba of there triple layer 45GB HD-DVD player which will compete quite easily with the schmooray camp...

The SmithSONYian institute of failed proprietary products will have another item to add to there museum .

 

[BMXTRIX]

I would question the failure of any product that is virtually guaranteed of having about a million players in people's homes within the first few months of release. This is something Blu-Ray is basically guaranteed itself of - and at a price of (expected) under $500.00 per player, it will be hot.

That is...

PS3

 

[LDanix]

Blu-Ray all the Way

The new revelation that Blu-ray will have price-competive manufaturing cost with current DVD will possibly win over some of the HD loyals. Before now, HD's main advantage was that manufaturing costs were as low as current DVD.
The Blu-ray format has now canceled out HD's advantage.

Infact, Blu-ray now has a major advantage over HD. A triple layer, 45GB HD-DVD is the latest announcement about HD. An eight layer, 200GB Blu-ray is the latest about Blu-ray. With four times the capacity, that capacity can be used for four times the content or future advancements in audio and video quality.

Even if HD had eight layers, the disc would max out at only 120GB- 40% lower than Blu-ray.

 

[korgoth]

blue ray wins, toshiba already admits there will be a unified disc out there since they dont want a war, and blue ray says the only way they can unify is if hd-dvd makes the exact same specs as BR.

toshiba already knows they will lose. negotiations are going on now, if nothing happens in the next few weeks they will both be released but toshiba has no chance.

plus ps3 is br, and if you already own a blue ray player, chances are youre going to want to buiy BR discs and not hd-dvd.

 

[GettinDegreez]

Ok this has been confusing me for sometime about the two new formats. They are supposed to be next generation, correct. Well to me, next generation means 1080p video and lossless 24-bit 192kHz 7.1 audio encoded on the disks. I have yet to read that the next generation will have both of those. I seen stuff about 720p and 1080i, and Dolby Digital Plus which is still lossy being used with the formats. It may not be a disc issue but whether the studios decide to put those formats on there. Is the current space on the next generation discs enough for all that, I know like a 5 minute song 24-bit, 192kHz 5.1 is about 1.10GB alone(uncompessed, not lossless.)1080p is also the limit for now until about 20 years from now when UHDTV rolls around. If the new discs don't offer this, why are they next generation. I don't want to go drop a couple thousand on a 1080p set and the next-gen player only to upgrade again in 5 years when they come out with new stuff that is theoretically available now.

 

[av-man]

If you want to know who will win the war ask the Porn industry. They are the ones everybody is looking at to make the decision.

With an estimated 11000 DVD releases each year; some would say (Reuters) that adult entertainment industry is actually driving the DVD industry. Because high definition recording is the desired medium, the amount of space needed to record hi-def recordings is almost 3 times as much when compared to a normal "red ray" DVD disc.
"We're kind of riding it out a little further to see where the trend goes," said Jackie Ramos, an executive in the DVD division at leading porn producer Wicked Pictures. But if he had to choose, Ramos said, "Blu-ray technology sounds pretty attractive."

Paul Hesky, chief operating officer of Multimedia Pictures Inc., one of the smaller groups, disagreed.

"Most of the DVD manufacturers in my business do not want the Blu-ray format because it requires new capital investment," he said, adding, "I know for sure one format or the other will be out (on the market) by this time next year."

Because the next generation recorders (Blu Ray and HD-DVD) not expected to hit the shelves until the end of the year, deciding which format reigns at the top probably won't be settled anytime soon.

 

[BMXTRIX]

Ok this has been confusing me for sometime about the two new formats. They are supposed to be next generation, correct. Well to me, next generation means 1080p video and lossless 24-bit 192kHz 7.1 audio encoded on the disks. I have yet to read that the next generation will have both of those. I seen stuff about 720p and 1080i, and Dolby Digital Plus which is still lossy being used with the formats. It may not be a disc issue but whether the studios decide to put those formats on there. Is the current space on the next generation discs enough for all that, I know like a 5 minute song 24-bit, 192kHz 5.1 is about 1.10GB alone(uncompessed, not lossless.)1080p is also the limit for now until about 20 years from now when UHDTV rolls around. If the new discs don't offer this, why are they next generation. I don't want to go drop a couple thousand on a 1080p set and the next-gen player only to upgrade again in 5 years when they come out with new stuff that is theoretically available now.

While it is hard to pin down what the final numbers are, you should take a look at the Blu-Ray Disc Association website (say BDA fast enough and it sounds like Beta)

This is from their website and states that 1080/24p is specified to be included and that 192/24 is possible as an audio format.

FROM: http://www.blu-raydisc.com/Section-13627/Index.html

"Video highlights
The BD-ROM format for movie distribution supports three highly advanced video codecs, including MPEG-2, so an author can choose the most suitable one for a particular application. All codecs are industry standards, meaning easy integration with existing authoring tools, and choice from wide range of encoding solutions. All consumer video resolutions are available:
- 1920 x 1080 HD (50i, 60i and 24p)
- 1280 x 720 HD (50p, 60p and 24p)
- 720 x 576/480 SD (50i or 60i)

Audio highlights
The BD-ROM format for movie distribution supports various advanced audio codecs, so an author can choose the most suitable for a particular application. The high capacity and data rate of Blu-ray Disc allow for extreme high quality audio in up to 8 channels to accompany High Definition video. Final audio specification details are still being determined, and might include DTS (core format), Dolby Digital AC-3 and LPCM (up to 96/24) . Optionally, the format might support DTS++ and LPCM 192/24 7.1."

 

[GettinDegreez]

Well if Blu-Ray is 1080p and DTS++ with 192/24, then I'm all for it. If DSD could somehow creep into the picture, that would be even better. I'm also going to go ahead and assume it's HDMI as well, however the Blu-Ray recorders in Japan only have up to compenent on them, strange. I was looking at some pictures of the disks, and correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the actual disk inside a plastic shell with a slot that opens up, similar to floppy?

http://www.ixbt.com/dvd/sony/sony-blue-ray-disks.jpg

If this is the case that seems like another plus because that means the likely hood of scratches on the disk are thus reduced. I just want them to hurry up, get all this stuff sorted out and give me a product. I have just begun my journey into home theather and high end sound, and I'm itching for a better experience. All I got now is a cheap Cyberhome CH-500 DVD player, mind you it works really well, has all the hookups I need now, but I'm sure there are betters ones out there in terms of quality. I just don't want to go drop upwards of $600 on a new player, only to have next gen stuff come out next year.

 

[Duffinator]

Well if Blu-Ray is 1080p and DTS++ with 192/24, then I'm all for it. If DSD could somehow creep into the picture, that would be even better. I'm also going to go ahead and assume it's HDMI as well, however the Blu-Ray recorders in Japan only have up to compenent on them, strange. I was looking at some pictures of the disks, and correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the actual disk inside a plastic shell with a slot that opens up, similar to floppy?

http://www.ixbt.com/dvd/sony/sony-blue-ray-disks.jpg

If this is the case that seems like another plus because that means the likely hood of scratches on the disk are thus reduced. I just want them to hurry up, get all this stuff sorted out and give me a product. I have just begun my journey into home theather and high end sound, and I'm itching for a better experience. All I got now is a cheap Cyberhome CH-500 DVD player, mind you it works really well, has all the hookups I need now, but I'm sure there are betters ones out there in terms of quality. I just don't want to go drop upwards of $600 on a new player, only to have next gen stuff come out next year.

The original BD were in a shell like a floppy. But I think they are trying to eliminate it. From what I've read the consumer perceives that as a "negative" plus the added manufacturing cost involved. But until we have them in our hands it could still change.

jetyi83, I don't think it's as one sided as you stated. It's in both camps interest to have one format and both sides has stated they are working on a compromise, which means both sides give a little, and technology from both sides will be included.