Gen1 JBL S38

[MrBoat]

All because I stuck my nosey nose into FBMP. Saw them for a month, looked the other way because I have been thoroughly enjoying my S312 pretty much non-stop. I also have two pair of the S38ii, which I also like a lot and really saw any need for these, from not really missing anything from those. This does it for me, though. This was the last curiosity of the studio series of this era. I am not an audiophile card holder. Just a music head that likes low (low enough) distortion. This series of speakers has a solid mid bass punch (that so many audiophiles are missing, but they don't know it) without being muddy. These things can really jam, without losing anything, or gaining anything unwanted.

I played Edgar Winter's "Frankenstein," and my son remarked that he thought he had never heard that version before, but it was just that he had never heard it quite like that. I had no idea he was at the table behind me when I let it rip. I thought he was out back. I turned it up even louder when the drum part came on. These speakers held it together. Synth effects, were just clean as could be, too. These are really good accompanied by my 12" Dayton RSS subs. Match made in heaven, really. Still, without subs, I was hearing/feeling bass below 40hz, which is plenty for my use.

 

[Alex2507]

Well how much? You said 75 to 200 was the norm but what was your breaking point?

I made a weird mistake on FB thinking they were Infinity and the admin declined my post trying to explain the brain fart. I take it these were from before Harman got JBL and Infinity under one roof?

They look cool as do the others you posted pics of on FB. I've gotta set up a small desktop setup and am currently racking my brain to come up with the space. Freakin' real estate is holding me back. Or the lack thereof.

 

[MrBoat]

Well how much? You said 75 to 200 was the norm but what was your breaking point?

I made a weird mistake on FB thinking they were Infinity and the admin declined my post trying to explain the brain fart. I take it these were from before Harman got JBL and Infinity under one roof?

They look cool as do the others you posted pics of on FB. I've gotta set up a small desktop setup and am currently racking my brain to come up with the space. Freakin' real estate is holding me back. Or the lack thereof.

They don't last long on market place once they get below 200. I paid 200 for these and that for one pair of the s38iis. One pair I got for $75. I'm not a flipper, or an investor, and tend to think in terms of whether I can get $200 worth of pleasure from them and the answer in this case is, "easily." Saw one pair of the S38BE recently, that looked perfect for $70 and they were just blocks away from me but I hesitated and. . .poof. A lot of pairs have the dreaded pushed in dust caps and these don't appear to be replaceable and I would hate to rig a repair with a different dust cap.

New, 'affordable', 8" 3-way speakers are rather rare, to non-existent, and the technical "good reasons" for such things don't align with my needs. One thing I noticed with a well implemented 3-way is, you never really hear anyone complaining about, or having to fuss over bass, regardless if it's flawed, in audiophilic terms. I turn to 3-ways when I am tired of reasoning with audiophiles, and just want to listen to music.

I have a small desk'top' as well. All one really needs to do is take the "top" out of the term. There's a pair of 12" subs there as well. No room treatments, nada. The other thing is to turn off the audiophilia, perhaps hold one's nose a little, and remember to stop listening long enough to eat, for bathroom breaks, or to finally go to bed.

ETA: I'm sure these are since Harman JBL and Infinity were as one. I had no idea that was you from here on FB.
Currently, I have the F-12 Tempests pictured behind the JBLs in the photo as my near field speakers and it is so ridiculously bada$$. Near field subs are no joke, either. I can change sound pressure characteristics, simply by opening/closing doors in other parts of the house. This room is 30ft long. if I open the door at the other end, the standing bass at the opposite end literally goes out the door. as does whatever hint of reflective feedback (unnoticeable anyway, likely due to all the furniture and stuff in here) there maybe gets cancelled as well.

 

[Alex2507]

I had no idea that was you from here on FB.

Funny. Where did you think I came from? No doubt I started as Alex and then just reverted to my real name. I can't actually remember how I figured out you were the boat guy nor do I recall sending the friend request. Did you just think I was a random FB guy talking about 420 passing him by? F^%&in' hilarious.

I know for a while I used the crazy monkey avatar there as well so you might have know who I was a one point. The name on FB easily identifies me to anyone who has ever dealt with getting me paid or to anyone related to me. English speaking folks in general would be thrown for a loop seeing that name.

I'm sure these are since Harman JBL and Infinity were as one.

So the MMD cone tech is probably in use on those. I went looking for the right term for the cone tech and found that Gene did a review in the Infinity Primus Towers. I was and still am like the #1 fanboy for those. I've got some of those drivers kicking around after cooking the surrounds on one speaker from placing it too close to a heater in a huge garage. Too bad I don't know anything about speaker design.

I can see the allure of an 8" driver in a small 3 way. That must thump! And I can relate to the 'good enough' concept for audio. I'm currently chasing that 'good enough' threshold with 4" drivers and a sub that someone abandoned on a porch. It's like Sanford and Son Audio.

 

[Mark E. Long]

Use two sets in the theater for front and rear heights up on big heavy oak shelves . They do sound very nice I always thought these sounded way better than there price point even when new I’ve got a second system in the garage that uses 3 sets of original S-38’s with a s center 3 way it does not take much to get loud even in a big 3 bay garage most of those came from eBay for less than a hundred a pair. I like you can’t help myself when I see a nice pair of S-38’s . I’ve never tried the larger towers in the studio line but I have read good things about them I already had my first set of HP-520’s so I had no need. I believe these were a Greg Timbers design or at least had his fingers in there somewhere.

 

[MrBoat]

Funny. Where did you think I came from? No doubt I started as Alex and then just reverted to my real name. I can't actually remember how I figured out you were the boat guy nor do I recall sending the friend request. Did you just think I was a random FB guy talking about 420 passing him by? F^%&in' hilarious.

I know for a while I used the crazy monkey avatar there as well so you might have know who I was a one point. The name on FB easily identifies me to anyone who has ever dealt with getting me paid or to anyone related to me. English speaking folks in general would be thrown for a loop seeing that name.



So the MMD cone tech is probably in use on those. I went looking for the right term for the cone tech and found that Gene did a review in the Infinity Primus Towers. I was and still am like the #1 fanboy for those. I've got some of those drivers kicking around after cooking the surrounds on one speaker from placing it too close to a heater in a huge garage. Too bad I don't know anything about speaker design.

I can see the allure of an 8" driver in a small 3 way. That must thump! And I can relate to the 'good enough' concept for audio. I'm currently chasing that 'good enough' threshold with 4" drivers and a sub that someone abandoned on a porch. It's like Sanford and Son Audio.

"Good enough," is a lot better than it used to be. I liked the Infinity speakers just fine. Just got into the JBL by chance and liked how they could make affordable, high performing speakers, pretty much for everyone, while other companies pretty much let you know that you weren't their target consumer. I thought a lot of the consumer line Infinity speakers looked pretty much identical to JBL's "polyplast" drivers, which have been around forever, and for good reason, it seems. I think they hit it out of the park with those vs price point/performance, plus being easy to clean. Infinity vs JBL, I really could have went either way.

I don't recall where I thought you came from. Two Channel Audio on FB, I think, or perhaps DIY loudspeakers or some such? Then I think we hit on something like drywall, maybe. I was a 20 year hanger finisher and there are others on my page who I worked with and ended up with some of their friends on my list, but I suck with names, so, they are half a mystery to me until I see who is friends in common. No matter. You post things that make me laugh at times, that I could possibly go to hell for laughing at.

 

[MrBoat]

Use two sets in the theater for front and rear heights up on big heavy oak shelves . They do sound very nice I always thought these sounded way better than there price point even when new I’ve got a second system in the garage that uses 3 sets of original S-38’s with a s center 3 way it does not take much to get loud even in a big 3 bay garage most of those came from eBay for less than a hundred a pair. I like you can’t help myself when I see a nice pair of S-38’s . I’ve never tried the larger towers in the studio line but I have read good things about them I already had my first set of HP-520’s so I had no need. I believe these were a Greg Timbers design or at least had his fingers in there somewhere.

They sound killer. It's where I want to stop, with regard to climbing any audiophile ladder. My F-12 Tempests are excellent and ridiculous at the same time and they are definitely better and more powerful than the JBLs but, whichever speaker I start out with, is the one that sets the bar for that time, and there really is no need to compare, otherwise. I have so much fun with the JBLs that I don't want any pursuit of high-end, the seeming neurosis that goes along with a lot of that, to ruin the JBL experience, ignorance being bliss, whatever.

Someone had fun designing this series. Like they were showing off what they could do regardless of the constraints/challenges that the budget department at Harman may have inflicted.

William Lemmerhirt turned me on to the S38. The S312 I got to fill in while I built the F-12s. I had no idea I really liked the S312 until about a year ago, and had them for 8 years! They were sitting out in the garage covered with a blanket all that time! Was not until I built the ICEpower 1200AS2 amp that I brought them out to test this amp with. Caused me to make a system around them.

 

[Mark E. Long]

They sound killer. It's where I want to stop, with regard to climbing any audiophile ladder. My F-12 Tempests are excellent and ridiculous at the same time and they are definitely better and more powerful than the JBLs but, whichever speaker I start out with, is the one that sets the bar for that time, and there really is no need to compare, otherwise. I have so much fun with the JBLs that I don't want any pursuit of high-end, the seeming neurosis that goes along with a lot of that, to ruin the JBL experience, ignorance being bliss, whatever.

Someone had fun designing this series. Like they were showing off what they could do regardless of the constraints/challenges that the budget department at Harman may have inflicted.

William Lemmerhirt turned me on to the S38. The S312 I got to fill in while I built the F-12s. I had no idea I really liked the S312 until about a year ago, and had them for 8 years! They were sitting out in the garage covered with a blanket all that time! Was not until I built the ICEpower 1200AS2 amp that I brought them out to test this amp with. Caused me to make a system around them.

There still hard to beat for what they are I still enjoy the original S center that goes with these a fella can pick one of them up very cheap if ya look around . They do seem to enjoy good power too . I seen on hear a while back where someone redid the cabs of a pair of s38’s in a much nicer cabinet gorgeous build too lol iam not on hear enough to remember who it was but it really caught my eye and was top notch work . I never read how they sounded .

 

[Alex2507]

I seen on hear a while back where someone redid the cabs of a pair of s38’s

Probably Mr. Boat.

I finally looked them up and they originally sold for $600. I hate it when they say 599. Anyway it's a different cone tech than I suspected and they're pretty heavy too (28 lbs). Not an easy wall mount situation but not impossible.

I figured out the FB thing. I recognized your boat. You always had my attention on AH due to the DIY stuff so once I spotted that boat on FB, probably on some audio related group, I sent out a friend request. I always knew who you were. The epoxy saturation of MDF has always mesmerized me. I've never done anything with epoxy but dabbling in DIY has made me hate MDF. Anyway, now you know. I snooped through your FB pics and saw that you had completed the Tarkus build. That got past me because I had a coronary bypass that Thanksgiving. How time flies when you're having fun.

So is there anything about the ii version that stands out from Gen1? And there's a center channel version of these? I just looked it up, cute. I also wanted to ask if there's an appreciable difference from the stock and the modded ii versions you have.

I went out yesterday and dragged home the Sanford and Son sub to go with my latest less-than system. It's in the car and just barely heavy enough to drag out the hand truck. Here's to all the unneeded systems spawned from too much free time *holds up cup of coffee*.

 

[TLS Guy]

They don't last long on market place once they get below 200. I paid 200 for these and that for one pair of the s38iis. One pair I got for $75. I'm not a flipper, or an investor, and tend to think in terms of whether I can get $200 worth of pleasure from them and the answer in this case is, "easily." Saw one pair of the S38BE recently, that looked perfect for $70 and they were just blocks away from me but I hesitated and. . .poof. A lot of pairs have the dreaded pushed in dust caps and these don't appear to be replaceable and I would hate to rig a repair with a different dust cap.

New, 'affordable', 8" 3-way speakers are rather rare, to non-existent, and the technical "good reasons" for such things don't align with my needs. One thing I noticed with a well implemented 3-way is, you never really hear anyone complaining about, or having to fuss over bass, regardless if it's flawed, in audiophilic terms. I turn to 3-ways when I am tired of reasoning with audiophiles, and just want to listen to music.

I have a small desk'top' as well. All one really needs to do is take the "top" out of the term. There's a pair of 12" subs there as well. No room treatments, nada. The other thing is to turn off the audiophilia, perhaps hold one's nose a little, and remember to stop listening long enough to eat, for bathroom breaks, or to finally go to bed.

ETA: I'm sure these are since Harman JBL and Infinity were as one. I had no idea that was you from here on FB.
Currently, I have the F-12 Tempests pictured behind the JBLs in the photo as my near field speakers and it is so ridiculously bada$$. Near field subs are no joke, either. I can change sound pressure characteristics, simply by opening/closing doors in other parts of the house. This room is 30ft long. if I open the door at the other end, the standing bass at the opposite end literally goes out the door. as does whatever hint of reflective feedback (unnoticeable anyway, likely due to all the furniture and stuff in here) there maybe gets cancelled as well.

For a small speaker they do have a good bass response. -3db at 45 Hz confirmed by stereophile. FR is really pretty good apart from a couple of glitches. Their biggest weakness is a very poor and uneven vertical dispersion, probably due to the driver layout. Crossover points are 800 Hz and 3.2 KHz, so sensibly chosen for power distribution between drivers.

I am not surprised you like them.

 

[Mark E. Long]

Probably Mr. Boat.

I finally looked them up and they originally sold for $600. I hate it when they say 599. Anyway it's a different cone tech than I suspected and they're pretty heavy too (28 lbs). Not an easy wall mount situation but not impossible.

I figured out the FB thing. I recognized your boat. You always had my attention on AH due to the DIY stuff so once I spotted that boat on FB, probably on some audio related group, I sent out a friend request. I always knew who you were. The epoxy saturation of MDF has always mesmerized me. I've never done anything with epoxy but dabbling in DIY has made me hate MDF. Anyway, now you know. I snooped through your FB pics and saw that you had completed the Tarkus build. That got past me because I had a coronary bypass that Thanksgiving. How time flies when you're having fun.

So is there anything about the ii version that stands out from Gen1? And there's a center channel version of these? I just looked it up, cute. I also wanted to ask if there's an appreciable difference from the stock and the modded ii versions you have.

I went out yesterday and dragged home the Sanford and Son sub to go with my latest less-than system. It's in the car and just barely heavy enough to drag out the hand truck. Here's to all the unneeded systems spawned from too much free time *holds up cup of coffee*.

I have both series 1 and 2 of the centers both are in my opinion great a what they do but I like the LC-2 in a race . Both very efficient in power handling I can’t remember how it was that built new cabs for these but it was nice work . I was going to look it up today but got side tracked . I use the s center 2 in a garage setup it does a good job . The other I have is setting in a closet .

 

[MrBoat]

For a small speaker they do have a good bass response. -3db at 45 Hz confirmed by stereophile. FR is really pretty good apart from a couple of glitches. Their biggest weakness is a very poor and uneven vertical dispersion, probably due to the driver layout. Crossover points are 800 Hz and 3.2 KHz, so sensibly chosen for power distribution between drivers.

I am not surprised you like them.

I use them on their sides, immediate near field, with tweeters at ear level. The waveguide situation around the tweeter tends to make me want to listen to them horizontally. The stereo image/phantom center cannot be collapsed even leaning well forward into them. To me, they seem ultimately true to studio monitor form, but somewhat forgiving. In some respects, I get the sense of a coaxial arrangement, or head-phonic vibe from them. It doesn't make me go out of my way to listen for the sound stage, but draws my attention to it.

Woofers are stout. Mids are in sealed chambers. Just an odd little build for a budget speaker.

 

[MrBoat]

I have both series 1 and 2 of the centers both are in my opinion great a what they do but I like the LC-2 in a race . Both very efficient in power handling I can’t remember how it was that built new cabs for these but it was nice work . I was going to look it up today but got side tracked . I use the s center 2 in a garage setup it does a good job . The other I have is setting in a closet .

Might have been me. I upgraded the cabinets on a pair of the 2nd gen. Added bracing, thicker panels and altered the volume accordingly. Changed the baffles with solid wood edges and tied the veneer into that so it is seamless. Used epoxy on the whole works.

Forgot I sunk magnets in for eventual grilles. They're ridiculous.

 

[MrBoat]

Probably Mr. Boat.

I finally looked them up and they originally sold for $600. I hate it when they say 599. Anyway it's a different cone tech than I suspected and they're pretty heavy too (28 lbs). Not an easy wall mount situation but not impossible.

I figured out the FB thing. I recognized your boat. You always had my attention on AH due to the DIY stuff so once I spotted that boat on FB, probably on some audio related group, I sent out a friend request. I always knew who you were. The epoxy saturation of MDF has always mesmerized me. I've never done anything with epoxy but dabbling in DIY has made me hate MDF. Anyway, now you know. I snooped through your FB pics and saw that you had completed the Tarkus build. That got past me because I had a coronary bypass that Thanksgiving. How time flies when you're having fun.

So is there anything about the ii version that stands out from Gen1? And there's a center channel version of these? I just looked it up, cute. I also wanted to ask if there's an appreciable difference from the stock and the modded ii versions you have.

I went out yesterday and dragged home the Sanford and Son sub to go with my latest less-than system. It's in the car and just barely heavy enough to drag out the hand truck. Here's to all the unneeded systems spawned from too much free time *holds up cup of coffee*.

The modded cabinets are significantly heavier and ultimately inert. The stock ones are adequate. I think it seems to have tightened the bass but it's one of those things you would have to really do a side-by-side with. You can feel the difference when you put your hands on them though. The modded version feels really resilient. The extra heft adds an additional feel of quality to them, if nothing else. Kick drums are really clean, as is deep electric bass guitar notes.

I have not listened to the gen1 enough to say one is better than the other. The gen2 rocks. Will try the 1s more this weekend. I am thinking they are closer to the same, than different.

Here's a gen1 S312. I have read where some say these are muddy sounding compared to the S38. I beg to differ. I have these set up near field currently. There's nothing muddy about them. They are liken to the 8's to me. . .just more of it.

The Tarkus are no joke either. I have too many speakers, but I don't care. I may give those to my nephew, though. He's showing an interest in audio.

 

[Mark E. Long]

Might have been me. I upgraded the cabinets on a pair of the 2nd gen. Added bracing, thicker panels and altered the volume accordingly. Changed the baffles with solid wood edges and tied the veneer into that so it is seamless. Used epoxy on the whole works.

Forgot I sunk magnets in for eventual grilles. They're ridiculous.

Yes Sir this is what I was referring too again very nice work . Am interested in your thoughts on the difference in Gen 1 to the Gen 2 sound wise .