Floorstanding speakers $3,500 - 4,500 ADVICE PLEASE

[GranteedEV]

nnever mind my previous post either. an xpa2 isnt stable into 4 ohms bridged. You'd need to step up to a crown xls 2500 or Xpa-1s to get that kind of current.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

So I went totally over budget. I ended up ordering Salk HT3's and two of his Rythmic 15" subs...

Thank you all for the advice. If this doesn't satisfy me I think I'll need a second job.

BTW - he said he had some HT3's with the tweeter used before the RAALs (G2 I think) for a $1000 off. That was tempting when I heard 60 days build time....

No what do I do for the next 60 days?

So you ended up spending over $7K total.

Should sound great.

 

[Nuance AH]

You might wanna pick up a second XPA-2 and bridge both of them into monoblocks, and get some 20A lines installed. I believe those HT3s are very current hungry. I think they hang around 2.5 ohm and are only around 84db sensitive...

You probably want an amp that can belt out 1000w or more into 3 ohms. For reference levels you would need an amp that can dish out 3200w into 3 ohms, so reference is out of the question.

They don't "hang" there, but they do dip into those regions; it's mostly because of the bass woofer. Once you get into woofers like that and of that size you need a good amount of power to get good control over them.

 

[GranteedEV]

They don't "hang" there, but they do dip into those regions; it's mostly because of the bass woofer. Once you get into woofers like that and of that size you need a good amount of power to get good control over them.

You're right, but the FR region covered by that woofer is pretty much the region where power demands would be centered. They're (probably?) 6 ohm nominal above that region but i'd still treat them as ~3ohm because the power demands. even if it's a dip, if it's in the power region then i'll treat it as such a load. If that same dip were in the 6khz region otoh i wouldn't pay it any mind at all.

 

[83benz240]

Amp ?

Sooo. It sounded to me that the XPA-2 would drive those ok. Do I need to step the amp/ampS? if so, what are some recommendations for the HT3's? 2 x emotiva mono blocks?

I only have a day or so left to return the amp back to emotiva. They would NOT give me any extra time for military deployment. SVS was very easy to deal with and gave me a. Extension on the trail period all the way through the end of Maarch

 

[Nuance AH]

You're right, but the FR region covered by that woofer is pretty much the region where power demands would be centered. They're (probably?) 6 ohm nominal above that region but i'd still treat them as ~3ohm because the power demands. even if it's a dip, if it's in the power region then i'll treat it as such a load. If that same dip were in the 6khz region otoh i wouldn't pay it any mind at all.

Right - I think we're both seeing eye to eye here.

 

[Nuance AH]

Sooo. It sounded to me that the XPA-2 would drive those ok. Do I need to step the amp/ampS? if so, what are some recommendations for the HT3's? 2 x emotiva mono blocks?

I only have a day or so left to return the amp back to emotiva. They would NOT give me any extra time for military deployment. SVS was very easy to deal with and gave me a. Extension on the trail period all the way through the end of Maarch

Don't run those mono-block, no. Honestly, it's up to you. You can try the Emotiva with the speakers and sell it used if it doesn't work out. If you'd rather not do that, perhaps look into something with more stable power down to 2-3 ohms. The only downside to the HT3's is controlling that bass woofer, which will need a good amount of power to do. I know people with less power than the XPA-2 driving the HT3's, so I don't think you'll have issues, but who knows. What is your budget for an amp(s) if you were to return the Emotiva and buy something else?

Grant, you don't think 500 watts into 4ohms is stable enough for the HT3's?

 

[GranteedEV]

Grant, you don't think 500 watts into 4ohms is stable enough for the HT3's?

I'm sure it'll be fine for the most part. As a 3-way speaker i'd give them at least 2m for the drivers to all converge. At 2m away you will have a max spl of over 100db. At 3m away. you're still looking at max spl of over 97db.

It's about the equivalent of running some songtowers off a 100wpc receiver.

That's not a ::ton:: of headroom though. It might clip on some dynamic content like classical or something with a loud dominant drumline. Would be nice to have an extra 3-5db of headroom IMO, but also most 15A lines won't deliver the current. A step up to 20A would be a good start even for an xpa-2. At the very least that TC Sounds woofer can take a beating.

I would not bridge the xpa 2 into this load - my earlier post made the silly assumption that a bridged xpa2 is as good as an xpa1. Better to use the xpa2 in stereo.

 

[83benz240]

Well considering I have completely gone overboard and about doubled the initial budget on the speakers and went 50% over budget on the subs I'm not really sure. I guess in the end I just want to do it right.

For example, I asked about options on the HT3's and Salk mentioned caps and we talked about the quality of the OPPO 93 vs 95 and both answers were that the value of the standard caps and the OPPO 93 made more sense than the extra money and minute benefits in the upgrades/95.

So - for amps I guess it's kind of what makes sense. If people say that I'm not really going to get anything decent for less than a 2 - channel amp at $2,000 then I guess that's where I'm starting.

@Nuance AH - Why did you say NOT to run the HT3's with monoblocks? With my limited knowledge I thought once you started getting into the larger wattage, amps went from multi channel into mono blocks, but again I'm not sure.

 

[GranteedEV]

@Nuance AH - Why did you say NOT to run the HT3's with monoblocks? With my limited knowledge I thought once you started getting into the larger wattage, amps went from multi channel into mono blocks, but again I'm not sure.

He meannt ;;not to bridge;; the xpa-2s into monoblocks. Xpa-1s are fine.

On a whole high wattage amps are pretty ridiculous and audiophiles like huge class A mono blocks but that doesn't mean they're necessary either.

Few AC lines can even provide the power for high end mono amps. Class A should be out of the question even at 40wpc.

Parasound class AB stuff is pretty stable. If you can score something rated for around 500wpc into 8 ohms it should do the trick.

A crown XLS-2500 for example is not a mono amp but will be perfect for your goals without costing much. This is thanks to its highly efficient class D circuitry.

If you can figure out a way to acquire some Hypex NC1200 modules they would be amazing.

Walter Duque is our resident ultra high power amps expert. He can probably give you some nice suggestions.

On a whole low impedance and low sensitivity are a tough place to begin for a system that you stated is meant to "get loud". My main hope is that your definition of loud isn't all that loud.

 

[Nuance AH]

He meannt ;;not to bridge;; the xpa-2s into monoblocks. Xpa-1s are fine.

^ This.

If you want to do it "right," then get a pair of the Emotiva XPA-1's. That will blow your entire $2000 budget, but you'll be set for life. Of course, if you don't have 20A circuits this might all be moot. In that case, just use the XPA-2 and enjoy; I'm sure it'll be just fine.

Emotiva Audio XPA-1 Differential Referenceâ„¢ Mono-block Power Amplifier

At the very least that TC Sounds woofer can take a beating.

They sure can! My TC2000's can take a lickin' and keep on tickin'. One of these days I want to try one in a vented enclosure.

 

[MiguelF]

I'll have to second the KEF Q900's. I just installed them for a friend, and it was paired with the Emotiva XPA 5 and a Marantz SR6006 as a preamp/processor. I was really very impressed. It was very detailed, natural and not fatiguing, like B&Ws. And they were effortlessly LOUD.

Excellent looking AVR. Excellent looking amp. Excellent looking subwoofers.

It seems the key here for you is being able to buy something that can be returned if you don't like in your room.

If you can audition Philharmonic, Ascend, Salk, etc, that would be crucial.

I believe both Ascend & Salk offer a 30 day return policy, but you have to pay shipping both ways.

Aperion, NHT, and Amazon direct offer free 30 day trial with free shipping both ways.

For example, if you buy speakers from Amazon Direct, like KEF Q900 &
Martin Logan, you could return for free.

If you can audition Paradigm & PSB & DefTech, that would also be good.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I'll have to second the KEF Q900's. I just installed them for a friend, and it was paired with the Emotiva XPA 5 and a Marantz SR6006 as a preamp/processor. I was really very impressed. It was very detailed, natural and not fatiguing, like B&Ws. And they were effortlessly LOUD.

So the Q900 sounded like B&W?

Edit: I just read your other post. You mean the Q900 sound detailed, natural, and not fatiguing, unlike the B&W's?

 

[MiguelF]

So the Q900 sounded like B&W?

Edit: I just read your other post. You mean the Q900 sound detailed, natural, and not fatiguing, unlike the B&W's?

Doh! Yes, I meant *not* like B&W's. If anything, they reminded me more of some PSB Gold towers that I heard many years ago.

Sorry about the confusion.

 

[bxboyjhs80]

that much cash to spend

I think if it was me who had the fortune that you do I'd look into the OHM/WALSH brand .They are still being made right here in NYC and depending on the model you order you could blow the perverbial house down .They are omni directional so placement isn't that specific and if you do have them made to spec you could pick whatever type of wood suits your taste.If you call and speak to John the pres. he is super knowledgeable and will help you in any way.If it was me I'd go for the 4xos but the're kinda big for my apt.Check out their site it just might interest you being U.S. made.
Best of luck the hunt as they say is the most fun if you can handle the sale schpleels.One other point of this company is that they take their older models for trade-ups if your still into the brand.

 

[83benz240]

I'm still waiting on the HT-3's I ordered in late January. We had some communication in Late March about there being an issue with the woofer's quality control so he was looking for another vendor.

Has anyone heard anything about delays or quality control issues with "I believe" TC Sounds woofers that are in the HT-3's?

I don't mind waiting a little bit but this is starting to make me wonder......

 

[GranteedEV]

Has anyone heard anything about delays or quality control issues with "I believe" TC Sounds woofers that are in the HT-3's?

I don't know who makes the current woofers for the Salks... I think TC Sounds did in the past but they did declare bankruptcy a while ago. While they now make drivers, I suspect that the drivers Salk uses are made by Acoustic Elegance.

Acoustic elegance has had struggles getting parts in this year, from their chinese steel vendor. I wouldn't be surprised if this is the same problem Jim alluded to.

If I might suggest a 10" woofer worth building around...
Creative Sound - Product Details

I would strongly consider that.

 

[Nuance AH]

I'm still waiting on the HT-3's I ordered in late January. We had some communication in Late March about there being an issue with the woofer's quality control so he was looking for another vendor.

Has anyone heard anything about delays or quality control issues with "I believe" TC Sounds woofers that are in the HT-3's?

I don't mind waiting a little bit but this is starting to make me wonder......

As already mentioned, the company now supplying the drivers is Acoustic Elegance, and while they are simply outstanding drivers, the company's delivery time frame is unacceptable; such is how things go with a one-man operation. I doubt Jim wants to go with another vendor, but at this point I figure he has no choice.

Grant's recommendation should be considered. Jim Salk will use whatever driver choice you'd like, though the crossover will likely need to be modified. That'll probably take less time than it will for Acoustic Elegance to get their products to their customers, though.

 

[GranteedEV]

Grant's recommendation should be considered. Jim Salk will use whatever driver choice you'd like, though the crossover will likely need to be modified.

box as well, mind you

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I think I waited 5 months for my Phil3. I waited 6 months for my Orion. I waited like 12 months for 3 pairs of KEF 201/2. Probably 5 months on my Salon2.

Worth every minute of the wait.

What is it about great speakers and the wait time?