First Home Theatre

[wellson]

Hi, everyone. I am Wellson.

I just moved in to my new place and got a Sony 60" HDTV. Now, I am thinking to set up my first home theatre, but i know nothing about it! I need your input and help.

The sony's guy introduced a sony set of home theatre;
http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?ProductSKU=DAVLF1&Dept=tvvideo&CategoryName=hav_HomeTheater_DVDDreamSystems

but my later on reading about home theatre, found out i should get a separate cpmponents, instead of HTIB. So, i went to an audio shop nearby, got few choices:

receiver and amp : denon, NAD and yamaha
speaker : NHT, PSB, elite and focus audio , sub : psb and vedolyne
cable : audioquest

I did try to listen to few model and combination of these components, but maybe i am a newbie, i cant really tell the different and the guy keep pushing some most expensive models to me. I just cant make the decision and i don want to be "fooled".

ok, i don know how much should i spend to get a "good" HT, I watch DVD most of the time, and listen to music sometime. To make it easier, what are your recomendation with this budget 15k - 20K (for dvd player, receiver, amp, full 7.1 speakers, cable and other accessories). Pls specify the brand and model. thanks

Thank you.

 

[mtrycrafts]

Hi, everyone. I am Wellson.

I just moved in to my new place and got a Sony 60" HDTV. Now, I am thinking to set up my first home theatre, but i know nothing about it! I need your input and help.

The sony's guy introduced a sony set of home theatre;
http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-Start?ProductSKU=DAVLF1&Dept=tvvideo&CategoryName=hav_HomeTheater_DVDDreamSystems

but my later on reading about home theatre, found out i should get a separate cpmponents, instead of HTIB. So, i went to an audio shop nearby, got few choices:

receiver and amp : denon, NAD and yamaha
speaker : NHT, PSB, elite and focus audio , sub : psb and vedolyne
cable : audioquest

I did try to listen to few model and combination of these components, but maybe i am a newbie, i cant really tell the different and the guy keep pushing some most expensive models to me. I just cant make the decision and i don want to be "fooled".

ok, i don know how much should i spend to get a "good" HT, I watch DVD most of the time, and listen to music sometime. To make it easier, what are your recomendation with this budget 15k - 20K (for dvd player, receiver, amp, full 7.1 speakers, cable and other accessories). Pls specify the brand and model. thanks

Thank you.

If you want it bad, you will get it bad

So, take your time, don't rush into anything. You wanted a big picture, a great move , enjoy it until you get a better idea what is going on in audio without getting ripped off or fooled by the audio voodoo, myth, bs, hype, etc.

The easy part is the cables. Audioquest gets expensive. There is a lot of hype about cables. No need to spend much to get good cables. The web site here has a few recommendation for good, reasonable cables. Radio Shack has cables. WalMart, Target, Home Depot has cable. Yes, these are good sources for cables. Monster is good but it is expensive and the company is very predatory so you should look for other cables.

The most importan issue in sound are the speakers and you room acoustics, not the other compoents. Try to find speakers that pleases you, and fits your room, along with a wife approval if you have one

Then you would need a receiver to drive those speakers, unless you happen to fall in love with a insensitive speaker with a terrible impedance that demands a more capable amp. The rest, DVD player is not a big deal. Get one that is a universal player that plays many different formats.

This will get you started in your quest.

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

Hold on a sec, and slow down. You were originally looking at a $1999 Sonystyle setup, and now are budgeting for a $15,000 to $20,000 system? Did the guys in the high end shops talk you into this or what? That's an amazing jump.

This is your first home theater, so you really are going to need some time to set this up. No need to go paying some overcommissioned sales guys at a high end audio store big bucks. You did well in coming to this site.

What size is your room?

Do you have room for 7 speakers and a large subwoofer?

What would you LIKE to spend, rather than what someone else would like you to spend on the entire setup?

What do you need? Receiver, speakers, dvd player, cables, ... ???

These guys here can recommend the best and point you to where to get the equipment at the best prices. Take your time on this thread, and we will help you.

 

[wellson]

Thanks for the inputs so far.

I am really impressed with the theatre room at the audio shop i visited, and I am going to have one, better one! The guy said they set it up with about 15K. So i am budgeting 15-20K (or more) to get my system done.

I got the 60" sony HDTV in my living room. i am wondering my wife will allow me to mess up her lovely living room with all the cables...

so, thinking to set my system in another room, about 10 meters x 10 meters. (heard it's not good to setup a system in a square room, true?). I think the room is big enough for me to put a projector or plasma. I love and enjoy movie very much! so i want to setup a "very good" home theatre. i know nothing, so i need all your help, sincere and helpful advice, not from those audio shop guys!

I came across the 12K recommendation system by audioholics.com. acceptable?

ok, i need these :
1. Projector and big screen for the room (how big can i get for that room size?)
2. Player, receiver, amp.
3. Full set of speakers, 2 sub if possible??
4. cables....
5. room acoustic treatment??

i don know how much should i spend to get my dream system setup, but i got up to 30K budget.

Pls help.

 

[wellson]

how about JBL?

hi, guys,

or how about this JBL Synthesis® Digital Home Theater System?

http://www.jblsynthesis.com/products/the_systems.aspx?Language=ENG&Country=US&Region=USA

Thanks

 

[jaxvon]

Wow, that's really awesome to have a budget that high! At the $30k price point, you can do a LOT of great stuff. Since you're a lover of movies, at least some of the money should be allotted for making the room awesome, stuff like controlled lighting, maybe a motorized screen, some nice seating, etc.

Room treatment is also important to think about. First of all though, I think you may want to decide whether you want in-wall speakers (for that clean look) or just regular floor standing speakers. At this point, it'd be good to go hit the dealerships and start listening to speaker systems to find which ones you like and build from there.

 

[BMXTRIX]

Well there are a couple of things that I would really ask for you and everyone here to consider...

1. It sounds like you may not have the technical ability to set a nice theater up yourself. Many people start with 1-2 thousand dollar systems, or far less, and learn over years, until they build their dream theater. You have the money, but no technical experiece so...

2. You will need to budget for installation labor which is typically a fairly fixed number. X dollars for running wires (regardless of brand) Y dollars for hooking everything up Z dollars for hanging a projector, screen, etc. Add it all up and you are left with the actual amount of equipment you should budget for.

3. I'm not sure what area you are in, but you are talking in Meters, so I'm guessin' not the USA. Another Canadidian? Where at? Maybe some locals can point you to a decent store or invite you over for a cup of tea and a mind blowing theater experience.

4. $30K in Canada is not the same as it is in the US, hopefully people will be aware of that.

5. $30K in Canada is STILL a lot of money and you can set yourself up nicely, especially if you want to do a lot of research yourself and think you might have the technical prowess to do some work yourself.

In your 30 foot square room are there windows? A projection system sounds nice in that amount of space, most people have far less for their home theaters and use projectors anyway. How tall are the ceilings in the room? 8 feet? 10 feet? 12 feet?

If you are at 10 or 12 foot ceilings, you can likely do at least two levels of seating, which is always cool in a theater, but most theater installers can't do tiered seating like that. So, it's a job for a handyman/carpenter to come in a do if you want it.

If you have good light control in the theater area, then I would definitely be looking at a projector, and NOT a plasma. Plasmas are cool, but don't have nearly the impact that a 10 foot screen has. At 15 feet away (5 meters) from the screen, and a decent projector, you are definitely in the real world possibilities for a 10 foot WIDE screen - about 3 1/3 meters wide.

In a dedicated room it is always nice to run wires behind walls, but not necessarily as important as it is in a non-dedicated room.

So... your Sony 60" should stay where it is. If you are looking for surround sound with your Sony, you can go with some decent in-wall speakers, and some in-wall surrounds and even an in-wall, or SMALL subwoofer. Some 10" boxes can be placed under coffee tables at the end of couches or even behind couches to hide them. It can make the one room sound much better and not disturb the rooms integrity almost at all. Think 'inexpensive' A/V receiver for that room and a cable box and dvd player. Likely just a few thousand dollars can cover that one room. Though, if all the wires are run inside the wall, there may be a need for a handyman to fix the drywall and apply some touch up paint.

For the basement, I would look towards a Denon 3805 or Yamaha 2500 receiver (or similarly priced/featured item) one of the lesser-expensive 1280x720 DLP projectors, and some decent speakers with one good sub. Perhaps, an outboard amplifier for your main speakers to really get the audio going if budget permits. Speaker choices are hardly limited, but prices are all over the place. In my opinion, floor standing loudspeakers are the way to go in a theater. In your living room... no, but in a theater, yes. I would get a decent DVD player, but nothing to far into the 'high-end' area. But that's just me. I fully expect HD disc players to be available within 1-2 years and I can wait for HD disc players instead of spending 1,000 dollars or more on a DVD player that I know won't ever match the quality of the chepest HD disc player.

Cables: A good place will likely custom make all the cables for you on site as they put your room together. No 'brand names', but basically the same quality components you find from a company like www.bluejeanscable.com - I know where I used to work it was all Belden Cable with Canare connectors everywhere. Some places are definitely better than others though, so shop around and pick up your yellow pages.

Finally: Stores typically have stuff you can see, which is nice, but smaller, custom installers and integrators, typically have a much deeper knowledge base than store sales reps do. The guy who is doing it for himself is basing his life on being able to tell you what you need, and knowing how to get it done. The guy at your local high-end store, may only be there to earn a paycheck and not have any vested interest in you getting what you want.

Oh yeah - don't forget to budget for a decent remote control so the entire family can use your theater... including you.

 

[wellson]

Thank you for all the input! Thanks.

1. I am origin from Asia, and now living in NY. I used to say in meter.

2. My uncle owns a renovation company, i can get help from his staff doing all necessary works, painting, furnishing and lighting..... My budget is mainly for the electronics. With their help, i really wish to hook up and install the whole system by myself. I am reading and doing some research to do so.. but i just don know what electronics to get.

3. I think i would get a wireless HTIB system for sony 60" in living room. My wife hates the cables.

4. and for my theatre room, i am going to install a new system. The ceiling of that room is about 12 feet. I read from somewhere, trying to avoid any square room for home theatre, should i ask someone to do something on this? No windows.

5. Regarding the room treatment, any comment on RPG, Sonex or ACS?

6. What is the best cable for DVD digital out? coaxial or optic? heard for short distance, coaxial does better, but how short distance?

Thank you.

 

[BMXTRIX]

Alright: My follow up would be.

At that price I would take a close look at a Select HT300 projector which is a really nice projector with a decent wall mounted screen. (About $15K for the two)

I'll stay out of the speaker debate, but there are lots of excellent choices available to you. In the $8,000.00 range for speakers things start all sounding pretty darn good, so you are going to be left with a lot more personal preference than actual quality and sound performance improvements. So much of audio is personal preference, not actual improvements.

For a receiver... Well, if I had a few grand to spend and a dedicated room, I would likely get a Rotel receiver and several outboard amps to run all the speakers. Killer.

Definitely would get an IR repeater system and hide the equipment at the back of the room in a cabinet (well ventilated!)

That leaves you a couple of grand for working on the room. Which I think is very open to personal preference again. With 12 foot ceilings I would definitely build up for a second row of seating. I'd probably do the second row 2 steps up instead of just one. Nice and high over the front row. Okay, a foot higher.

In a room like that you typically want dark furniture, dark walls, dark everything... so, when you put lights in, put LOTS in! It makes sense when you think about it.

With a room that inherently dark, it requires more light for the room to feel 'natural' and bright enough to clear properly. When the movie starts you dim the lights, or turn them off completely, so having more lights doesn't affect the movie experience, it just makes the room easier to deal with when the movie is over or before it begins and for cleaning/install work. If you can: Wall sconces are cool, rope lighting under stair edgings is cool, perimeter lighting for the entire room is good, then a row of can lights for each row of seating (2 in this example) each set of lights is called a load, and you would be looking at about 5 loads of lighting, all of which can be setup for scenes. "Entry", "Movie", "Reading", "Cleaning", "Off" By doing this it really adds to being able to use the room as you want to and doesn't limit your usage of the room to just movie watching. You can turn the lights up over the back row and check the sports scores during the commercials of the football game if you want. Or, when hitting the restroom after pausing a movie, you aren't in a completely dark room.

There's just about any amount of money that could really easily be spent on a theater, it's almost scary.

NOTE: For your living room 60" system: There is no such thing as 'wireless'. All spekaers require power, so you would have to plug in 'wireless' speakers to power them! This is far more imposing in a room, and usually is lower quality than just running wires to the speakers. A good wire junkie can get wires inside your wall with minimal drywall cuts quite often. If your wife doesn't mind a couple of days of drywall dust and some paint, you could completely hide all the wiring in your living room and get great in-wall speakers & sound which is very high on the WAF scale. I opted for on-wall speakers myself in the family room and just ran all the speakers in the wall. All wiring goes down the wall into my basement then back to the receiver. It works well and looks great.

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

BMX,

You are in the wrong business. You've just sold him your dream system, theatre room, and setup. I'm not really sold on the bi-level seating arrangements. I think he just wants our opinions on components, not interior decorating.

Wellson,

Square rooms are fine. That's what processing and parametric eq's are for. You'll have plenty of furniture and sound absorbing materials (carpeting, etc...) to cancel out any symmetrical reverberations.

Coax is better than optical at any length.

The JBL Synthesis systems are awe inspiring. They will blow your mind. This is a smaller scale of what cinema's use. The Synthesis subs are one of the few that will blow away SVS, HSU, and Martin Logan. Those systems are meant for huge rooms, so be prepared if you install one in your house. They are what other companies aspire to for HT. Big $$$. If you can swing it, that's the way to go.

 

[ptalar]

Buckeyefan 1,

Why is coax better than optical? I have an optical connection on my system but I would spend the money for a decent coax cable if I know there is going to be audibly better sound. Is there a paper on optical vs. coax you know of I can read? I know optical can not take sharp corners but that is not an issue with my system. No kinks or sharp corners to damage cable.

Please let me know.

Thanks,

Phil

 

[zumbo]

Here is a link to an article. link

 

[ptalar]

Zumbo,

Thanks. I found another article:

http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/audioprinciples/interconnects/toslink.php

Phil

 

[zumbo]

Zumbo,

Thanks. I found another article:

http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/audioprinciples/interconnects/toslink.php

Phil

Nice. Now it looks like I need to sell my optical cable. I am certain it has a clear plastic tip.

 

[wellson]

Thanks everyone!

ok, now. i think i need to setup a simple HT for my living room with that sony tv. And really take my time to do some research b4 i go for my theatre room.

yes, i know the rear speakers of those "wireless" system need the power. but i can skip running the speaker cable from the main unit, right? Here, i just concern about the sound quality. The sony is using IR for transmission, and according to sony's guy, the sound quality can be well maintaned and no interference compare to those (like pionner) using the radio wave. Good money to spend for the sony system??? or i just spend the money to get a simple AV receiver+speakers+cables...what kind of system can i get and which one is better?

for receiver : how much power i need? heard i need almost double watts to get 3db increase of sound level. so, the receiver with 100w and 120w (denon 2805 and 3805), no significant different??

for speaker : what are the parameters should i look at? no of driver? power handling? sensitivity? or how to choose a good one? or just by my ears?

ok, guys, pls help me take a look on the electronic components for this system :
http://www.jblsynthesis.com/products/system_overview.aspx?prod=SYN-HT4-L7&Language=ENG&Country=US&Region=USA

Thanks.................

 

[wellson]

Thanks everyone!

http://www.jblsynthesis.com/products/system_overview.aspx?prod=SYN-HT4-L7&Language=ENG&Country=US&Region=USA

Thanks.................

The JBL Synthesis HT system for those 3000 cubic feet room....

Thanks

 

[BMXTRIX]

The Synthesis line is awesome, but if 30K is the full budget for everything, then audio, video, and room aesthetics need to all be considered. A theater is far more than just good sound. The entire ambiance goes into it.

My dream system with no budget would not include Rotel, Sim2, or likely much else that I mentioned. But, at that price point, I wouldn't get a cheap projector just for good sound, likewise I wouldn't get an incredible projector for crud sound.

If I needed to fix the room as well, I would make sure I had a few bucks left over for that as well. I find that most audio people I have worked with are clueless on actually designing a room. Sure, they can pick all the components - but when your choices are all really good components anyways, it's hard to go to wrong. Then the room is screwed up so bad the person who has to it, and paid for it, is upset - to the point of wanting to return equipment.

Find that balance that makes you happy with your system all around.