Energy Microstar 12.1

[JES14]

Anybody have one these beasts? I have a chance to buy a floor model, slightly scratched up. There are no specs on the Energy site, some reviews on audio review.com is all I can find so far. I would be upgrading from a Velodyne CHT-10 and VX-10, room about 16' x 22' large opening on one side about 10'. About 70/30 ht/music. I listen quite loud, when alowed...

 

[Sheep]

This is the closet thing I could find.

http://www.audioreview.com/cat/speakers/subwoofers/energy-loudspeakers/PRD_123373_2741crx.aspx

Seems to be a servo driven sub with a long throw driver. (looks kinda like an SPL series Velodyne). Have your heard it yet?

SheepStar

 

[JES14]

Yes, I found the same reviews and also found the specs from a google search. Obviously an older unit, am hoping to hear from some owners past/present. Was it a great old unit? or just older. Original msrp was $1600 U.S., plus the reviews are good, so one would think this was a highly regarded sub in it's day. I can get it for around 7-800 CDN. Would it outperform most in that dollar range today? (not counting U.S. net direct subs like SVS)
I have not heard it yet as it was not hooked up and I only had limited time. It was in a clearence area. I will be going back one day this week for a demo, but I would like some input first.
I have tried searches here and in the speaker section on audioreview, but nata.

 

[Sheep]

For that cash, look at HSU, an STF-2 or 3 would be a better choice.

BUT, go listen and see what you think.

SheepStar

 

[JES14]

I had a chance to demo the STF-2 a few weeks back, But the MS 12.1 specs are superior to both those HSU units, ON PAPER. But I'll know better after I demo them on Wed.

 

[Sheep]

I had a chance to demo the STF-2 a few weeks back, But the MS 12.1 specs are superior to both those HSU units, ON PAPER. But I'll know better after I demo them on Wed.

If your referring to power and FR as the "specs" the HSU's win. The STF-2 and 3 are TUNED to 25Hz. You can insert a port plug into the STF-3 and it is then TUNED to 18Hz. From the reviews I read, the Microstar didn't have anything below 25Hz.

Power is relevant. If the driver needs more power, then it gets more. It doesn't mean it will play louder or lower.

SheepStar

 

[JES14]

By the spec, it goes down to 18hz, heavier voice coil, more power etc...
But we'll see. Thanks.

 

[Sheep]

By the spec, it goes down to 18hz, heavier voice coil, more power etc...
But we'll see. Thanks.

Back then, Energy tended to lie about sub FR's. My E:XL-S8 was rated to 29Hz, but couldn't make much noise below 40Hz.

Again, power is relative. If the cone is harder to move, its will take more power, but it doesn't mean it will be louder.

I believe you are referring to the magnet structure. The HSU's have something the Energy doesn't, a larger enclosure. Match point HSU.

BTW, how do you know the Mricostar has a heavier magnet? Where did you get this Data? The 1500W is a peak measurement, which means squat. The HSU has a peak of 1200watts, but the 300RMS is a better indicator of performance.

SheepStar

 

[JES14]

Not sure that a larger enclosure equals better, depends on the quality of parts and engineering.
As for specs by Energy being fudged, thanks I had not heard that before.
Yes, quite aware that RMS is the true benchmark, but I only have peak numbers to go by for the MS 12.1, which is 1200 for HSU and 1500 for Energy. With that kind of peak power I doubt the RMS ratings will be under 300.
Specs say 2.5" voice coil, 9# magnet on HSU, 3" voice coil, 6kg for Energy.
BUT I AM NOT LOOKING TO DEBATE SPECS! I only bring it up as a reference point. Please post if you have actual real world experience with this sub.
Thanks for your input sheep.

 

[Sheep]

Not sure that a larger enclosure equals better, depends on the quality of parts and engineering.

When it comes to bass, the bigger the better. Speakers obvisouly don't need huge enclosures, but look at the subs around you.

SVS: Giant enclosures with well deisigned, but simple drivers that yeild excellent results.

Velodyne: Small enclosures with DSP's, EQ's, Servo's, and high power amps that yeild basically the same performance.

The only difference is that most SVS subs play REALLY low, while only the top end Velodynes do. Sure hte DD series is great, but they use a servo to limit distortion. Without it, they would not play very low cleanly.

SheepStar

 

[warpdrive]

Sure hte DD series is great, but they use a servo to limit distortion. Without it, they would not play very low cleanly.

So what if it uses Servo? You are almost implying they are cheating by using Servo....if the end result is utterly clean bass (which they do deliver), that's all the matters. The DD series has onboard PEQ, which to me, is the real appeal of the DD series...something SVS doesn't have.

 

[Sheep]

So what if it uses Servo? You are almost implying they are cheating by using Servo....if the end result is utterly clean bass (which they do deliver), that's all the matters. The DD series has onboard PEQ, which to me, is the real appeal of the DD series...something SVS doesn't have.

Servo's are useless if you have a driver with long linear travel. All they do is hog up amp power.

You can buy a BFD and eq the sup too.

SVS subs can hit much lower AND louder then Velodynes.

SheepStar

 

[warpdrive]

SVS subs can hit much lower AND louder then Velodynes.

I'd rather have the Velodyne. It sounds better. I prefer *accuracy* over louder and lower. I think it's worth the extra money.

The BFD is crap IMO. It adds coloration (try listening to it with no EQ applied, it alters the signal). It's no sustitute for the DD EQ which is a LOT more flexible and has more settings.

 

[JES14]

Interesting, Velo DD's are more accurate, SVS's are lower and louder...
ANYBODY ACTUALLY HAVE AN OPINION ON THE ENERGY MICROSTAR 12.1?
Sorry for the yelling, but an informed opinion would be much appreciated. Thanks.

 

[Sheep]

Interesting, Velo DD's are more accurate, SVS's are lower and louder...
ANYBODY ACTUALLY HAVE AN OPINION ON THE ENERGY MICROSTAR 12.1?
Sorry for the yelling, but an informed opinion would be much appreciated. Thanks.

I don't think there IS one. Its an old subwoofer, and not many people are even familiar with Energy's latest offerings.

SheepStar

 

[JES14]

Apparently...

 

[warpdrive]

I did hear the Mirage equivalent to the Energy years ago (must have been about 5-6 years ago), and I thought it was ok, I could hear the sub drivers fluttering at high output. The salesguy said he was disappointed in the performance for the money. I wasn't serious so I didn't pursue it any further than a 5 minute demo.

 

[todd612]

...Seems to be a servo driven sub with a long throw driver. (looks kinda like an SPL series Velodyne). Have your heard it yet?SheepStar

How do you tell it's a servo driven sub? I have one of these and the amp module blew. I'm thinking of getting the oaudio 500W plate amp as a replacement. Would I have any problem using a regular amp and a servo sub?

 

[Patrick_Wolf]

I'd rather have the Velodyne. It sounds better. I prefer *accuracy* over louder and lower. I think it's worth the extra money.

My knowledge on subs is basically nil, but I thought good subs were about "cleanliness". Which involves accuracy and extension while maintaining volume...

Based on my experience with Energy's latest speakers I think they're poo and would avoid their subs just the same.