Do I need two HDMI out ports?

[Contentt]

Looking for a new receiver and going with a Denon but wondering if I'd really benefit from the two HDMI out ports on the new Denon AVR-3311CI. Currently have a Panasonic AX200 projector and in the hunt for a new TV. That's a bit of $$$ just for a 2nd out port, thoughts?

 

[Stripes]

You could always just get a splitter/switcher, if you went with a single out hdmi.

 

[yepimonfire]

what do you need a second HDMI out for?

 

[PearlcorderS701]

what do you need a second HDMI out for?

I've pondered this possibility myself, as I always thought it was best to ALWAYS separate audio from video -- with HDMI 1.3a, all audio and video up to 1080p could be transmitted over one cable from a Blu-ray player, but then it needed to be "split" at an A/V receiver or processor, where a second HDMI cable would carry the video on to the display. This is how my system is set up and has been since the advent of high definition and when I bought into it.

However, Denon introduced some high end BD players which offered two HDMI outs -- so you could separate audio from video, or so reviews claimed, and thus this could potentially erase any video degredation that a receiver could introduce when splitting the video signal, or passing it on, to a display. It's been said HDMI is an ALL-DIGITAL system, so there should be no loss when passing video on, but I can see where separating audio from video so video goes DIRECTLY into a display device from a source device is preferred.

Anyone with additional thoughts on two HDMI outs for this purpose?

 

[yepimonfire]

generally, since they are digital signals, there is not the possibility of degradation, digital signals either work right or don't work at all. also if im not mistaken the video signal runs on a different "line" then the audio. i could be wrong about that though.

 

[Stripes]

I think the o.p. probably just wants to hook up multiple displays, sounds like he wants to hook up a projector and a TV.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I had an brand new Oppo HDMI switcher. Sending the split-HDMI signal to my Projector did NOT work. But using the 2nd HDMI output on my Denon receiver worked.

So I would get the receiver with dual HDMI output.

 

[Contentt]

Correct

Yes looking to hook up two displays, I'm assuming if I go with a reciever with one HDMI out then I have to use Component for one of the displays which isn't as ideal.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Well, if looking to feed two displays, then dual HDMI outs are helpful.

I was talking about a different scenario, where purists would want to send audio and video separately out of a source device for the signals to remain "pure" -- especially the VIDEO signal, where some claim there is some degredation occuring when the video goes through an AVR.

 

[Warpdrv]

Or sending signal out to your plasma and your projector if one would desire, then just select which you are using.

 

[jostenmeat]

I've pondered this possibility myself, as I always thought it was best to ALWAYS separate audio from video -- with HDMI 1.3a, all audio and video up to 1080p could be transmitted over one cable from a Blu-ray player, but then it needed to be "split" at an A/V receiver or processor, where a second HDMI cable would carry the video on to the display. This is how my system is set up and has been since the advent of high definition and when I bought into it.

However, Denon introduced some high end BD players which offered two HDMI outs -- so you could separate audio from video, or so reviews claimed, and thus this could potentially erase any video degredation that a receiver could introduce when splitting the video signal, or passing it on, to a display. It's been said HDMI is an ALL-DIGITAL system, so there should be no loss when passing video on, but I can see where separating audio from video so video goes DIRECTLY into a display device from a source device is preferred.

Anyone with additional thoughts on two HDMI outs for this purpose?

Even if there was a measurable difference (probably not), I will subjectively say that 99.99999999999999999999999999999% of the setups out there would not benefit, including my own. However, I don't believe there is any difference at all, just going by subjective experience. I have a double digit ft wide screen in a dedicated dark area, coupled with a high quality projector, and I've ran stuff directly to PJ a couple of times, and of course normally thru the receiver. The source and setup are so overwhelmingly more important it's not even funny.

I've asked silly questions myself, though not related, like if there are any color saturation differences among BDPs. The answer, for all intents and purposes, was no.

Now, if you own an HDMI 1.3 receiver, but upgrade to 3D video, you will likely have to use two outputs anyways (which I believe the Pana player does, so that your receiver is not instantly outdated).

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Even if there was a measurable difference (probably not), I will subjectively say that 99.99999999999999999999999999999% of the setups out there would not benefit, including my own. However, I don't believe there is any difference at all, just going by subjective experience. I have a double digit ft wide screen in a dedicated dark area, coupled with a high quality projector, and I've ran stuff directly to PJ a couple of times, and of course normally thru the receiver. The source and setup are so overwhelmingly more important it's not even funny.

I've asked silly questions myself, though not related, like if there are any color saturation differences among BDPs. The answer, for all intents and purposes, was no.

Now, if you own an HDMI 1.3 receiver, but upgrade to 3D video, you will likely have to use two outputs anyways (which I believe the Pana player does, so that your receiver is not instantly outdated).

Interesting, Josten.

Most say exactly what you do here -- that they feel separating audio and video from an HD source (i.e. two HDMI outs) will make no discernable difference in terms of the video quality being better that the source is going direct to the display; you claim you have actually done these tests, but I always felt something was being clipped video-wise when a video stream goes through an AVR -- especially one as "cheap" as my Onkyo 605...

 

[jostenmeat]

Interesting, Josten.

Most say exactly what you do here -- that they feel separating audio and video from an HD source (i.e. two HDMI outs) will make no discernable difference in terms of the video quality being better that the source is going direct to the display; you claim you have actually done these tests, but I always felt something was being clipped video-wise when a video stream goes through an AVR -- especially one as "cheap" as my Onkyo 605...

You bring up a point. I will stand by what I said if we can assume that the receiver was correctly designed with video. However, some receivers out there do "clip" BTB and WTW for example. I won't get into the arguments about how much that matters, but those could be cited as bad implementations. However, IMO the issue is not due to a lack of double outputs.

If you really care, the day you upgrade to 3D capability, you can run dual outputs. You can just do it now probably, without the 3D display, by using one of those Pana players (no, I don't know how much).

 

[PearlcorderS701]

You bring up a point. I will stand by what I said if we can assume that the receiver was correctly designed with video. However, some receivers out there do "clip" BTB and WTW for example. I won't get into the arguments about how much that matters, but those could be cited as bad implementations. However, IMO the issue is not due to a lack of double outputs.

Yes, I am aware of the "blacker than black" and "whiter than white" clipping issues with some AVRs -- I was referring more to actual video degredation where, say, a 1080p transfer will be missing some...well..."pop" from its image because it's running through an AVR. That's what always made me question running video through a "splitting" device -- I always thought video should go straight from a source to a display.

I just have no way of knowing -- short of uncabling my setup and connecting my OPPO's HDMI out direct to my Sony rear projection set for a quick test -- if my Onkyo is degrading the incoming 1080p video signal...

If you really care, the day you upgrade to 3D capability, you can run dual outputs. You can just do it now probably, without the 3D display, by using one of those Pana players (no, I don't know how much).

Well, I'm not in the market for a new player, but it would make for an interesting test -- I am uncertain about buying into 3D and HDMI 1.4 yet...

Outside of feeding two display devices, Denon must have had something in mind when they designed their upper-tiered BD players with dual HDMI outs...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Outside of feeding two display devices, Denon must have had something in mind when they designed their upper-tiered BD players with dual HDMI outs...

Yeah, so they can sell you their $500 ethernet cable and another $500 on a pair of their HDMI cables.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

...I will subjectively say that 99.99999999999999999999999999999% of the setups out there would not benefit...

You are just too kind.

I will say that 200% of the setups out there would not benefit.

I've also done my share of the "purist" and separate Audio vs. Video connections back in my pure analog days a few years ago.

I sure can't tell any difference.

To make matters worse, I found out that bitstreaming the digital audio via HDMI cable sounded a lot better than using the Analog audio cables. That was the END of my analog days.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Yeah, so they can sell you their $500 ethernet cable and another $500 on a pair of their HDMI cables.

Are their HDMI cables really 500 bucks? I think I saw those ethernet cables of theirs on Amazon for the $500...

Nothing compares to what I saw when flipping through the pages of the Absolute Sound's "Editor's Picks" buying guide, and I noted speaker cable that went up to $20,000 plus hundreds and thousands more for extra meters. I believe there were interconnects in there for the same price or maybe higher -- I almost had a heart attack...