Thank you that is what I was trying to say. AVRs and vinyl don’t get along. The power supply even if it has the power doesn’t have clean power. To get the power i need for my AR90s I have to go with an external amp. I have a Grado Gold 3 and a Schiit phono amp hopefully with the Emotiva Gen 3 3 I can have better sound quality with my records and my movie’s. If I had my choice i would prefer a Caver pre amp with two Carver mono power amps for my vinyl but knowing my wife, thats not going to happen
True to point about the power supplies typically used in AVRs, but please do keep in mind some basic facts and factors. It's the internet, you bound to hear lots of hyperbole..
For entry level AVRs:
- True enough that entry level AVRs tend to have power supplies and output devices (more so the power supplies) that are too small for even 5.1, but it is still highly dependently on other factors.
- For example, even entry level AVRs (e.g. I have a Denon AVR-1911 that I have given it away, but still working) could drive a 5.1 system in a 13X16 room based on Polk bookshelf and satellite speakers with very good results.
- Power requirements are mostly determined by one's target/desired spl (sound pressure level), listening distance and speaker sensitivity.
- Each time you double the power output, you only get 3 dB more SPL. To perceived twice as loud, it is generally agreed that you need to increase SPL by 6 to 10 dB, dB is the unit in log scale, 10 dB increase in power output is 10 times. So a 200 W into 8 ohm that a power amp can give you versus 120 W into 8 ohm that you will get with a mid range AVR (Denon, Marantz, Yamaha etc) will basically let you crank he volume up by a few clicks.
- Power output is not the only thing that matters, so are distortions, noise, freq. response, among other things, but may AVRs performed better than many power amps based on some very detailed test bench measurements.
For mid range, and flag ship level AVRs (e.g. Yamaha RX-A3000 series, Denon AVR-4000 series, Marantz SR7000, SR8000 series):
- Typically will give you 120 to 140 W into 8 ohms, >200 W or even >300 W into 4 ohms (based on bench test results) for two chanel driven, but for 5 to 7 channel driven simultaneously, you can expect about 70 % give or take, that will give you 5, or 7 X 100W.
- Good power amps, including the mediocre Emotiva amps, typically can sustain higher levels of output for prolong period, while AVRs cannot, because they don't have adequate heatsinks for such use. However, for real world use, such as movies and most music genres, AVRs can do just as good unless you listen to highly compressed music at loud levels.
- It does not matter how much extra power reserve you have on hand, it makes no audible difference it you don't even tap into that reserve. For example, even if you are watching an action movie at levels as loud as you will hear in a movie cinema, if the AVR, or power amp, is outputting only 100 W peak during the maximum peak SPL in the movie, the AVR (say an Yamaha RX-A3080) can do it at very low distortions, low enough for it to be at below the threshold of audibility, so in that case, external amps or not will mostly not make any difference, at least no obvious difference anyway.
