Denon AVR-3808CI First Look

[fresno1232001]

Sticker on face of receiver!!!

Yes, Denon, certainly feel free to slap a sticker on the face of what would be MY new receiver, if I bought one. Maybe with enough paper towels soaked in hot water I could get it off without scratching the face of the unit forever with my fingernails, and maybe not. I will not buy one of these, and if you do it to the 4308, I won't buy one of those. Why don't you include the stickers in a little bag and if we want them on the face of our unit, we can put them on ourselves!

 

[Rex]

The RRC-1 is not wireless. (its also not available)
It requires three wires to run to it.

Ok, then it is like a smarthome Insteon devices I am installing to control lighting around my house.

 

[Seth=L]

Yes, Denon, certainly feel free to slap a sticker on the face of what would be MY new receiver, if I bought one. Maybe with enough paper towels soaked in hot water I could get it off without scratching the face of the unit forever with my fingernails, and maybe not. I will not buy one of these, and if you do it to the 4308, I won't buy one of those. Why don't you include the stickers in a little bag and if we want them on the face of our unit, we can put them on ourselves!

I doubt that sticker is going to be hard to get off. Every receiver I have purchased new had a sticker on it, but it wasn't a very strong adhesive, almost like a static sticker.

 

[edmcanuck]

No Reon? Gosh I hate the look of these new Denons, they are ugly IMO, and it only weighs 35 pounds. Unless it is completely unquirky it really isn't competitive with the Onkyos.

A lot of harsh reactions for a receiver that nobody has yet heard or seen in person. Particularly for the Denon 38xx series which has consistently been an impressive market-leader. I don't know why you think it wouldn't be competitive with the Onkyo offerings... Onkyo has never managed to match the performance of Denon before, IMO. If I want a space heater I get Onkyo; if I want a great power supply it's Denon all the way.

And the AL24+ arguments are a tad silly for me as well. The 3808 has AL24 on all channels and AL24+ on the front 2. Lets not pretend that anyone here could ABX it on or off in any event, but you're still getting one form of it on all channels and the high-end version on your main music channels so it seems to me to be a non-argument.

 

[mike c]

i think it looks nice they matched the looks of their current integrated amps. (which I like) ... it's a more classic look (doesn't get old in time) unlike most of the modern looks of today's receivers which "look" old when the next model comes out. (e.g. yammy 2500)

 

[Seth=L]

A lot of harsh reactions for a receiver that nobody has yet heard or seen in person. Particularly for the Denon 38xx series which has consistently been an impressive market-leader. I don't know why you think it wouldn't be competitive with the Onkyo offerings... Onkyo has never managed to match the performance of Denon before, IMO. If I want a space heater I get Onkyo; if I want a great power supply it's Denon all the way.

And the AL24+ arguments are a tad silly for me as well. The 3808 has AL24 on all channels and AL24+ on the front 2. Lets not pretend that anyone here could ABX it on or off in any event, but you're still getting one form of it on all channels and the high-end version on your main music channels so it seems to me to be a non-argument.

LOL, this is funny.

Why is it that you think Denon is a better performer than Onkyo? Through personal experiance with both company's receivers I can say there isn't much sonic difference, if any among comparitive receivers. The funny part is you go on to mention an ABX test where one would not be able to defer the difference between AL24 and AL24+, a bit of a contradiction IMO.

Space heater....hmm. I know that MDS can vouche for Onkyo being fairly even in temp. with other comparitive receivers. It has been mentioned that the 600 series from Onkyo runs warmer than their other receivers, but they don't run very hot with their upper models I have noticed.

I would expect the power supply in the Denon to be quite good, but no match for the Onkyo's even in the TX-SR805. The Onkyo is a 50 pound behemoth where the Denon weighs a more typical 35 pounds for it's price range. I believe they have made changes in their amplifiers for the upper line receivers. You can also bet that Onkyo did not merit the THX Ultra II badge for nothing. THX has power stipulations for each of its specifications. I will quote Gene from a THX FAQ.

THX Select is a more affordable version of THX Certification. It is designed to play at reference levels in rooms of approximately 2,000 cubic feet,. THX Ultra2 is a 7.1-speaker extension of the original Ultra spec. Ultra2 is designed to work well with multi-channel music and movie presentations playing up to reference levels in rooms of 3,000 cubic feet or larger. Each certification requires components to produce high volume levels, to play at a low level of distortion, and to disperse sound in specific ways, as well as to have extremely low noise and behave in a stable and predictable way.

And some bits about the Dual Push-Pull amplifier topology that make it ideal for HT applications, capable of delivering massive amounts of power when needed. Allows for extreme dynamics, good headroom.

An amplifier circuit (30) has the capability for driving a large number of loads while still maintaining the desirable gain response. The amplifier circuit (30) includes two push-pull amplifier circuits (31 and 41). A first push-pull amplifier circuit (31) has a pair of bipolar transistors (33 and 34) connected in a cascode circuit configuration and a second pair of bipolar transistors (35 and 36) connected in a cascode circuit configuration. In addition, the second push-pull amplifier circuit (41) has a first pair of bipolar transistors (43 and 44) connected in a cascode circuit configuration and a second pair of bipolar transistors (45 and 46) connected in a cascode circuit configuration. The channel distortion and gain response of the amplifier circuit (30) are significantly improved by the push-pull amplifier circuits (31 and 41)

 

[fresno1232001]

I sure hope you are right. Today we get an article on the AVR 4308CI and, sure enough, they have put the same sticker on the face of it, unless the picture is just a re-print of this receiver's picture. I just note that the pix released of the Sherwood Newcastle R-972 and the Onkyo TX-NR905 show no stickers on their faces, so some mfrers are careful not to enrage buyers with that. Onkyo does put the acronym WRAT on the face of theirs, and it's not a sticker. I personally don't like that on a product I'll display in my home. Maybe Japan is crawling with rats, but my city is not. Maybe they feel they are selling their products to a bunch of rats. You attacked us, Japan, we defeated you, get over it.

I doubt that sticker is going to be hard to get off. Every receiver I have purchased new had a sticker on it, but it wasn't a very strong adhesive, almost like a static sticker.

 

[Seth=L]

I sure hope you are right. Today we get an article on the AVR 4308CI and, sure enough, they have put the same sticker on the face of it, unless the picture is just a re-print of this receiver's picture. I just note that the pix released of the Sherwood Newcastle R-972 and the Onkyo TX-NR905 show no stickers on their faces, so some mfrers are careful not to enrage buyers with that. Onkyo does put the acronym WRAT on the face of theirs, and it's not a sticker. I personally don't like that on a product I'll display in my home. Maybe Japan is crawling with rats, but my city is not. Maybe they feel they are selling their products to a bunch of rats. You attacked us, Japan, we defeated you, get over it.

Pardon my confusion, but where exactly are you going with this? In order to get a receiver without logos all over it you will likely spend more money. Seperates is another route for those looking for the "clean, uncluttered" look. Of coarse, there is also B0SE.

 

[MDS]

If they are actual stickers rather than being engraved into the faceplate (so they don't wear off), I would agree that it sucks. I wouldn't want stickers all over the face of the receiver.

I'm concerned about that very thing with TVs as I've seen a lot of them with stickers for the acronyms of all the technology they support. I hope it's just on the floor models because there is no way those stickers are coming off without leaving a big gummy residue or scratching the crap out of the bezel.

I don't think it would be a good idea to use Goof-Off to remove them either because although that stuff works extremely well it eats plastic.

 

[Hi Ho]

OK, I maybe I'm missing something here but why are there so many people here that seem to be concerned about stickers on this new Denon?

I install equipment every day and nearly every component has at least one sticker on it. It's for store display. They peel off very easily. They are plastic, not paper and the adhesive does not leave any sort of residue. I actually ask customers whether they want me to peel them off because I have had people stop me in the past wanting to keep the stickers on to show off to their friends.

Now, about the receiver. Is the new GUI an actual nice looking interface? It's not that it makes a whole lot of functional difference in setting it up for someone like me but when customers see the butt-ugly GUI on the current Denon receivers they don't take too kindly to it. A clean looking GUI is especially important for features such as music streaming and internet radio. I find my Yamaha 2700 to be much more user friendly simply because of the GUI. Yamaha has had a real color GUI since the 2500. It's about time Denon got caught up.

 

[Duffinator]

I'm concerned about that very thing with TVs as I've seen a lot of them with stickers for the acronyms of all the technology they support. I hope it's just on the floor models because there is no way those stickers are coming off without leaving a big gummy residue or scratching the crap out of the bezel.

I don't think it would be a good idea to use Goof-Off to remove them either because although that stuff works extremely well it eats plastic.

You guys are making waaaay tooooo much of the stickers. Here's the silver model that doesn't have the sticker on it.

My Sharp 45" LCD with the high gloss black finish had some stickers on it and they came off without a mark. I'm much more interested in how it sounds. I've been very pleased with my 3805 and have been waiting for this receiver to hit the market so I can upgrade. My concern is the 3808 is a few pounds lighter than the 3805. Wimpier power supplies???

 

[MDS]

My Sharp 45" LCD with the high gloss black finish had some stickers on it and they came off without a mark.

Well that's exactly what I wanted to hear. I'm not so much the true videophile but stickers and reflective crap will bother me because it draws your eye to it rather than the image on the screen.

You know it's possible that the reason companies put all these stickers on the faceplate is due to licensing requirements. For example, you are supposed to affix the sticker with the serial number for your copy of Windows XP to the computer you install it on to be in compliance with EULA.

What I find troubling about Sharp (which is what I'm almost positive I will buy in the next few weeks) is that the TVs have all those stickers on them but the manual doesn't list ANY of the features/specs of the TV (like 120 Hz refresh rate for the d82u models).

 

[Seth=L]

I don't think it would be a good idea to use Goof-Off to remove them either because although that stuff works extremely well it eats plastic.

Ha, I learned that the hard way once. Darn duct tape residue wouldn't come of the old Fisher stereo system, goof-off got the residue, and some plastic from the tape deck as well.

 

[Seth=L]

You guys are making waaaay tooooo much of the stickers. Here's the silver model that doesn't have the sticker on it.

My Sharp 45" LCD with the high gloss black finish had some stickers on it and they came off without a mark. I'm much more interested in how it sounds. I've been very pleased with my 3805 and have been waiting for this receiver to hit the market so I can upgrade. My concern is the 3808 is a few pounds lighter than the 3805. Wimpier power supplies???

Denon gets lighter and raises price, Onkyo gets heavier, adds THX Ultra II, and stays about the same price (still lower than Denon). Nothing against Denon, but what are they thinking? They had better perform damn well to beat Onkyo out. Though I can see how many folks who think that Denon "sounds better" than Onkyo would still buy the Denons. I would think they would have geared themselves similarly to Onkyo to compete. Oh, well, I just keep the JVC for now.

 

[Duffinator]

What I find troubling about Sharp (which is what I'm almost positive I will buy in the next few weeks) is that the TVs have all those stickers on them but the manual doesn't list ANY of the features/specs of the TV (like 120 Hz refresh rate for the d82u models).

Which one are you looking at? I was just looking at the 65" and it's pretty sweet. I'm still waiting for the 57" as that is what will fit in my space. Now that I have an HD DVD player and the new Denon 3808 is coming out with HDMI 1.3 and the new sound formats I can upgrade my TV as well.

 

[MDS]

I'm thinking that the 46" D82U is good enough for me. I just had a custom solid wood entertainment center built and I designed it to perfectly hold the 46" D82U with a few inches on the sides and top for ventilation. It will also hold pretty much any 50" TV perfectly but LCD strangely only comes in 52" = not 50". I will sit approximately 10-11 feet from the screen.

I have some space restrictions due to the fireplace to the right and the need to reserve 10" on each side of the unit to place floorstanding speakers (which will also be upgraded...eventually).

I could perhaps go with the 52" but it would have to be pulled out a few inches from the hutch (rather than have the screen line up perfectly with the hutch as the 46" would). I hope the 46" is sufficient but I don't know. Pretty much everyone I know says you get used to the big size and think you could have gone bigger...with the exception of one friend who admits that the 60" TV he bought is actually a bit too big for his living room.

 

[Duffinator]

I hope the 46" is sufficient but I don't know. Pretty much everyone I know says you get used to the big size and think you could have gone bigger...with the exception of one friend who admits that the 60" TV he bought is actually a bit too big for his living room.

Bigger is better. I thought the 45" was going to be too big for our bedroom and my wife would flip when I mounted it. It's actually very nice in there and my wife has said it could have been bigger! The newer versions have a noticeably better picture than the one I have although I think my version is one of the nicer looking sets they have made. Denon 3808 - just so we don't get too far off track.

Here's my set.

 

[Onac]

If I was one of these companies I would just use thicker metal on the case and put lead in the feet of the receivers. I can't believe so many people keep saying one receiver is better than another due to weight without knowing where the weight is actually coming from. How do you know Onkyo didn't use copper heat sinks that weigh a ton?

Now if the weight came from quality components than yes I would probably agree with the weight having some meaning. But, to compare weight on paper is laughable.

 

[subtweeter]

HDMI video plus digital audio from different souces?

Does anyone know if the 3808 will support HDMI video in to HDMI video out (DVD to TV, for example) whilst doing digital audio in to the speakers?
Or can I go "down" the range for this?
Or must I go "up"?
Competitors?

The goal here is to listen to a CD while "watching" a DVD.

Or in the future, to have a HD-TV input active while listening to a CD.

With the 2307CI, if I am listening to a CD (digital audio in) then it will only process S-Video or composite from the DVD in (ignores HDMI in.) Not ideal.

 

[avaserfi]

Does anyone know if the 3808 will support HDMI video in to HDMI video out (DVD to TV, for example) whilst doing digital audio in to the speakers?
Or can I go "down" the range for this?
Or must I go "up"?
Competitors?

The current 3806 supports HDMI video with audio through digital sources and it seems like a feature that will stay.