Denon 3805 died, UPS dropped it

[Buckeyefan 1]

So over the holidays, my right amp channel decided to quit working. I found a detached wire out of a banana plug (nice soldering job by myself ). The unit was going on 3 years and out of warranty - no big deal, I got it B stock and saved ~$400. So I call Denon and get a certified repair shop in Indiana. I ship the unit to them (insured for $750) and they fix it for $130. Good deal, right? They ship it back, and I open it up and find the back bashed in. Classic Stereo insured it for $750 at my request, but since they paid return shipping/insurance (actually I did but they shipped it), they get the unit back as well as the $750 insurance money. I called UPS and they won't talk to me - said to call Classic Stereo (the unit got shipped back to them). I called Classic Stereo, and they said it's not repairable, but that they would sell me a 3806 for $950, or something else in stock. They offerd me an Integra DTR 6.6 for $800, or Yamaha RXV 2600 or RXV 1700 for $1000. They would credit the $750 so my net would be much less. Keep in mind, I'm still out the $130 for repair, but that was my fault for not insuring it for more.

So do I wait for the new receivers, or buy one of these "discounted" units. The 3806 for $200 doesn't seem too bad (after my credit). I like Integra, but that unit doesn't have HDMI and it's a bit underpowered compared to the 3806. I've also contemplated requesting the $750 - I wonder how they'd fell coughing that up?

Opinions?

 

[highfihoney]

Wait one minute.

Are you saying that this stereo repair shop is keeping your insurance refund & only offering you some bs in store dredit? If so they are stealing your money plain & simple.

Here's how it works,ups has a contract with the shipper,in your case the shipper is the repair center,ups will only deal with the shipper,once damage is notice the reciever(you)call ups & report the damage then you notify the shipper(repair shop) & they inturn file a claim with ups for the full amount of insurance.

Here is where it gets tricky,ups will give you a bs story about sending your amp to some inspection center,there is no such place as a ups inspection center,they will tell you that they are issuing a pick up & are sending a truck for the amp,tell them in no way are they picking up the amp & that they need to send an on site inspector to look at the damage,this is very important,DO NOT THROW AWAY ANY OF THE PACKAGING FOR THE AMP,NOT EVEN A PEANUT,ups will make an appointment for their insurance companies agent to inspect the amp in your home,ups outsources their insurance for all items shipped.

If you allow ups to pick up your amp you can be assured 100% that your claim will be denied on the grounds of improper packing no matter how it was packed,by keeping the amp & forcing an onsite inspection you can show somebody in person just how it was packed,if ups picks it up their policy is to reject all claims,the amp will be shipped straight from your house to the repair center & the claim will be rejected.

After the onsite inspector from the outsourced insurance company makes his decision(on the spot) the repair center will need to fill out some paperwork then send it back to them,after ups gets the paperwork they will issue a check in the name of the repair center which should then be fowarded to you.You need to remember that the amp was insured on your behalf & that you paid for the amp & shipping.

If the repair center refuses to give you the insurance claim they are ripping you off & a store credit is not how it works.

 

[highfihoney]

Hey buck,i jusr re read your post,please listen to me on this,ive shipped close to 400 peices of gear & have had shipping damage claims with ups,fedex,dhl,usps & bax global,dont call the repair shop & request anything call them & demand your insurance claim & unless you really want to buy something from them dont accept their bs offer of in store credit,this is your money no if's and's or butt's.

I know ups told you that they must pick up the amp but they are bs ing you,if you insist then insist again they will send thier inspector to your home,if you turn loose of the amp your chances are very small of getting anything at all back,if you tell them it cant be repacked because its too dangerous to handle due to sharp edges they will send the inspector,the amp will never be sent anywhere except straight back to the repair shop if you let them take it.

After you talk to the repair center tell them to have ups send the check to your address,ups will do this if the shipper requests it.

In the future when you ship anything of value you can have ups pick up the package from wherever it is & pay for the shipping yourself that way you are always the one who ups has a contract with,i ship all my gear this way,when i buy a peice over the internet i request a pick up from ups after i get the box size & weight from the seller then i pre pay, that way im the only one dealing with ups.

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

Highfi,

Thanks for the info. I will request the insurance check from Classic Stereo. I simply thought $850 was a reasonable deal for the 3806, but I'd be inclined to wait for the new models to come out, or upgrade to a Rotel unit.

My fear is that UPS will hold off paying the claim to Classic Stereo for months, which I told Classic Stereo I don't want to be without a unit for a long period of time. Classic Stereo has been in business for 40+ years and has a decent track record (and answers the phone when I call), so I'm not worried about them ripping me off, but simply playing a waiting game for the insurance check.

I have already made the mistake of repacking the Denon (very, very well) and having UPS pick it up. I took a dozen photos just in case. It was received by Classic Stereo the next day. Classic Stereo said the claim would have been approved for more than the $750 had I requested more insurance (they had 4 units busted in the last month via UPS - you'd think they'd use someone else).

I'm sure Classic Stereo doesn't have to cough up the $750 until receiving the insurance proceeds. If they agree to sell me the 3806 for $100, I may be ahead, don't you think?

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

FWIW, Ubid has the Yamaha 5990 for $499 B stock (had HDMI 1.1). Accessories4less has the Marantz 7500 for $629 and the 8500 for $899. I love the look of Marantz. They also have the Onkyo 803 for $579, and 804 for $649. It's just a shame both Marantz units don't have HDMI I/O's. The 8500 has DVI I/O's.

 

[mike c]

don't they have the 2700?

other than that, logical upgrade for you would be the 3806 (only if their selling price is considered a deal where you are)

sorry to hear about this btw.

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

don't they have the 2700?

other than that, logical upgrade for you would be the 3806 (only if their selling price is considered a deal where you are)

sorry to hear about this btw.

They have the 2600 for $1000. That's too much. A buddy of mine had the Yammy 2500 and it blew up on him (couldn't handle his towers). I've never had that problem with the Denon 3805.

I've been out of the market for AVR's for some time. You know me, I go by weight (Mtrycraft's scientific method). Anything under 33lbs. is not capable of driving my 7 Polk RTi's. I just wish I could find and older Denon 4802 and be done with it.

 

[PENG]

I've been out of the market for AVR's for some time. You know me, I go by weight (Mtrycraft's scientific method). Anything under 33lbs. is not capable of driving my 7 Polk RTi's. I just wish I could find and older Denon 4802 and be done with it.

I sure know you go by weight, and I have, in the past tried to convince you to look the other way (as long as you get that 33 lbs minimum). If weight is so important, get a Sony STR-DA7ES, or HKAVR6XX. Seriously if you like weight, and SQ is still important, consider the NADT773. It will give you about the same power as the 3805 (based on lab measurements) but probably 20 lbs heavier. Being an older model, price must have come down quite a bit by now. Otherwise, I am sure you will be happy with the 38 lbs 3806. Good luck!

 

[mike c]

some manufacturers might have included the remote and mic in their weighing of the units

anyway, the heavy receivers seem to be going extinct ... most of the new AVR's coming out now are lighter than the previous models ... HK and yamaha included.

 

[MDS]

Let me see if I understand the situation correctly. The defective Denon was shipped by Classic Stereo to a repair shop in Indiana but you paid the $130 for the repair and the fee for insurance? Now Classic Stereo thinks they get to keep the $750 insurance settlement and you get nothing? Your're out $130 for the repair AND you no longer have a receiver?

As highfihoney said, you really should ship it yourself so your name is listed as the shipper but Classic Stereo doesn't get to keep the insurance money just because they collected payment for the insurance and called UPS to come pick it up.

It is b.s. to offer you a new receiver and apply the $750 towards it because it isn't their money in the first place. What if you wanted to take the insurance money and buy a different receiver they don't sell or buy something somewhere else at a lower price?

 

[mtrycrafts]

some manufacturers might have included the remote and mic in their weighing of the units
.

If they know he is coming, maybe some fishing weights too

 

[Buckle-meister]

Sorry to hear about your kit. It's never nice when it happens.

It is b.s. to offer you a new receiver and apply the $750 towards it because it isn't their money in the first place. What if you wanted to take the insurance money and buy a different receiver they don't sell or buy something somewhere else at a lower price?

I agree with MDS Buckeyefan. At the very least (if I understand things correctly) you should be entitled to get $750 back so that you can source a replacement receiver (or clothes or food or anything for that matter) yourself.

If however you've the choice of that or another unit that they can provide which you consider to be a good deal, well that's something for you to decide if you want to accept. That'd be the ideal scenario.

 

[corysmith01]

Buckeyefan, agree with the above posts. This is a hose job on their part. That money is yours, not theirs, plain and simple. You should be able to use it how you see fit. What if you wanted to repurpose that money on something else. It's not theirs to hold hostage.

Let's say the reverse happened. Let's say they shipped you a receiver to audition. You weren't happy with it and decided to ship it back. But, oops, ups destroyed it and offered to send you the insurance check of $750 for it, since you're the shipper right? I'm gonna guess they'd be on the phone with you right quick, expecting you to give them the money as that was their property and are entitled to the money...which is exactly the case for you. Of course, you could always tell them they could put that $750 towards buying something from your attic.

 

[Jack Hammer]

Have you politely asked them about the money yet? Of course they would offer to apply it to a new purchase, that is smart business on their part, as long as they don't try to keep the $ and they are willing to send it to you if you decide to buy somewhere else. They likely want to keep a customer and make a sale, and they are offering reasonable prices.

What I'm unclear on is if they are offering you an immediate credit toward a purchase, while payment from the shipper is pending, as a courtesy (some times it takes a while to get a check issued). In which case they may have to wait a month to actually get the insurance money and they are trying to make you not wait. Or if they are trying to mislead you into thinking that it is their money and the only way you get access to it is to buy something from them.

Jack

 

[j_garcia]

If you have everything documented well, mention small claims court to them if you have any problem getting your money back. At the very least, they should be offering you a better than average deal on one of their units.

Almost the same thing happened to a friend of mine.

 

[highfihoney]

Highfi,

Thanks for the info. I will request the insurance check from Classic Stereo. I simply thought $850 was a reasonable deal for the 3806, but I'd be inclined to wait for the new models to come out, or upgrade to a Rotel unit.

My fear is that UPS will hold off paying the claim to Classic Stereo for months, which I told Classic Stereo I don't want to be without a unit for a long period of time. Classic Stereo has been in business for 40+ years and has a decent track record (and answers the phone when I call), so I'm not worried about them ripping me off, but simply playing a waiting game for the insurance check.

Hi,how fast ups pays on an insurance claim depends on the agressivness of the shipper,being that this repair center ships gear regularly i'd be guessing that they have had their share of damage claims & are used to dealing with the claims process at ups,if they have their act together & move foward on this promptly there is no reason the claim cant be processed & paid in 30 days or less.

Heres the deal ,weather or not ups smashed your amp has no bearing on the repair centers responsibility to make sure you get your amp in perfect working order or to step up & take responsibility for the package that you paid for,for a business this is all part of the cost of doing business,you entrusted them with your gear & they accepted the responsibility of fixing it & getting it back to you safely,ups smashed the amp while it was still in their custody.

Just the fact that they didnt offer you 100% of your cash back the first thing they got the amp back from ups would make me very leary of future dealings with them,you should not have had to ask them for anything.

 

[audiofox]

If you paid the shipping and repair fees with a credit card, you have yet one more avenue that you can explore-you have a legitimate claim for non-delivery of goods that most credit card companies would have to honor under the applicable laws of your state. I would definitely get your money back first, then decide which AVR to buy and where to buy it after you are whole financially. If you run into any legal problems, LMK-my brother-in-law is a PI attorney in Columbus and might be able to help out (or at least give me some free advice that I can pass on to you). I would also make certain that you are dealing with the owner of the store, not one of the sales persons-the owner has the ultimate authority to make things happen and will be much more interested in the possibility of this issue damaging his future business if you decide to spread the word about your treatment at his establishment.

PS: I have two 3806 receivers (one for each of my two AV setups), and they are great.

 

[Tyreman]

I'll take the lower road on this.
Since they have your money for an initial purchase and it had repairs(not your fault I know)
Its going to be less pain to do it their way in all likelyhood.Within reason of course.
Just make sure its the receiver you want!!
If they offer you a good deal.......and its a good deal go for it!!
As for your money back? Maybe-+ ? or Credit towards future purchase-+?
You'd have to ask them really.

 

[Methodical]

...I'm sure Classic Stereo doesn't have to cough up the $750 until receiving the insurance proceeds. If they agree to sell me the 3806 for $100, I may be ahead, don't you think?

Yeah, especially if UPS denies the claim. Then Classic Stereo would have to do the fighting for the money. And they have the where with all to do so. Besides UPS wants to keep there business I'm sure. Just be sure that if you purchase the equipment that there could be no claims against you (all sales is final etc. etc.). If you are not ready to buy now be sure to get a credit slip right away from Classic for documentation purposes.

Here's what I'd do. I'd ask them to reduce there offerings by $130 (your repair cost) in addition to the $750 credit. If they go for it and they have what you want then go for it. If not then request your money that may make them rethink your request knowing that you may go elsewhere and possibly lose a coustomer. Be prepared to get your money though.

 

[Methodical]

Are you saying that this stereo repair shop is keeping your insurance refund & only offering you some bs in store dredit? If so they are stealing your money plain & simple.

Here's how it works,ups has a contract with the shipper,in your case the shipper is the repair center,ups will only deal with the shipper,once damage is notice the reciever(you)call ups & report the damage then you notify the shipper(repair shop) & they inturn file a claim with ups for the full amount of insurance.

Here is where it gets tricky,ups will give you a bs story about sending your amp to some inspection center,there is no such place as a ups inspection center,they will tell you that they are issuing a pick up & are sending a truck for the amp,tell them in no way are they picking up the amp & that they need to send an on site inspector to look at the damage,this is very important,DO NOT THROW AWAY ANY OF THE PACKAGING FOR THE AMP,NOT EVEN A PEANUT,ups will make an appointment for their insurance companies agent to inspect the amp in your home,ups outsources their insurance for all items shipped.

If you allow ups to pick up your amp you can be assured 100% that your claim will be denied on the grounds of improper packing no matter how it was packed,by keeping the amp & forcing an onsite inspection you can show somebody in person just how it was packed,if ups picks it up their policy is to reject all claims,the amp will be shipped straight from your house to the repair center & the claim will be rejected.

After the onsite inspector from the outsourced insurance company makes his decision(on the spot) the repair center will need to fill out some paperwork then send it back to them,after ups gets the paperwork they will issue a check in the name of the repair center which should then be fowarded to you.You need to remember that the amp was insured on your behalf & that you paid for the amp & shipping.

If the repair center refuses to give you the insurance claim they are ripping you off & a store credit is not how it works.

Good info this is going in the Vault for future reference.

Peace