Choose an amplifier for me

[gcmarshall]

What amp would you buy to turn an already good sounding Yam RX-v2500 5 channel experience into a 5 channel experience that will shake the house, awaken the neighbors and provide crystal clear acoustics? Most important considerations are (in decreasing order) reliability, power, and cost (I want to do this ONCE only and do not want to have to upgrade anytime soon, so while money is "an object", it is not the most critical factor).

 

[jcPanny]

Emotiva "Big Dog" Amp

Check the audioholics review of the Emotiva 7 channel amp. It will deliver 200 Watts @ 8 ohms into 7 channels and more into 4 or 6 ohm speakers. It also passed the brazillian party test and is very reasonable at $2K.
http://www.audioholics.com/productreviews/avhardware/emotivaMPS1p1.php

There were also a couple threads which specifically recommended this amp for use with your Yamaha 2500 due the the clean pre-amp stage of the yamaha. You can use the etra 2 channels to upgrade in the future, power speakers throughout the house, or for a passive sub. Just make sure that your speakers can handle the power.

 

[MacManNM]

A multi channel amp isn't going to do that for you. You need to get several 2 chan amps. Even if they are plugged in to the same circuits you will have more power because each unit has its own power supply, thus more of a reserve. I would look into Adcom or Outlaw 2 ch unit if you want to stay with a home line, or look into Crown or Mackie, both provide outstanding power in smallish packages.

Oh yeah, Marantz MA700's would also be a good choice.

 

[jaxvon]

Might have to disagree somewhat Mac. The Emotiva is actually 7 monoblocks with a centralized control that share a power plug. Each one has its own dedicated caps and transformer. If you can drop the cash, you might also want to think about Bryston's multi-channel amps. They use the monoblock approach like Emotiva (5 monoblocks in the same housing), but their amps are traditional Class A/B design. The other attractive things about Bryston are their build quality and their 20-year transferrable warranty.

 

[ht_addict]

What amp would you buy to turn an already good sounding Yam RX-v2500 5 channel experience into a 5 channel experience that will shake the house, awaken the neighbors and provide crystal clear acoustics? Most important considerations are (in decreasing order) reliability, power, and cost (I want to do this ONCE only and do not want to have to upgrade anytime soon, so while money is "an object", it is not the most critical factor).

So what is it about the sound of the Yamaha you don't like? Unless your powering inefficient speakers, or the room their in is huge your only wasting your money. Most off the time your only using 1-2watts to power your speakers. If you have a SPL meter, watch a movie or listen too some music at the level on the dial your accustomed too and let us know what reading you get. I'd be suprised if it went higher than the efficiency of your speakers.

 

[j_garcia]

I'll echo what ht_addict said. It would be good to know what the problem is before just throwing money at it.

 

[Snap]

I'll echo what ht_addict said. It would be good to know what the problem is before just throwing money at it.

One thing it could be is the desire to upgrade to seperates. From the sounds of it....money being last on the list.....seems to me the dude just wants to go with seperates. Having said that....

I too will have to disagree with Mac, and echo what Jaxvon said. Bryston would be at the top of the list. Right under that would be Earthquake. And of course if money is really no option, then there is always McIntosh and Carry. All of these amps will do exacly what the poster was asking for!

Blessed,
Snap

 

[gcmarshall]

Thanks for all the inputs. Appreciated one and all. I am simply considering how to get the best "do-it-myself" home theater experience. I need to do some research/thinking before I move ahead, but thx again for the comments and recommendations.

 

[MacManNM]

Sorry guys, maybe I didn't explain well enough. The Emotiva is a good amp. it will not have the peak power of a few good 2ch amps. The caps alone in a 2ch amp will fill up 40% of the case. You can't beat those big caps for reserve power. So the "Buckeye rule" comes into effect, weight rules. 3 2ch amps are going to weigh more than one 5ch amp.

 

[PENG]

A multi channel amp isn't going to do that for you. You need to get several 2 chan amps. Even if they are plugged in to the same circuits you will have more power because each unit has its own power supply, thus more of a reserve. I would look into Adcom or Outlaw 2 ch unit if you want to stay with a home line, or look into Crown or Mackie, both provide outstanding power in smallish packages.

Oh yeah, Marantz MA700's would also be a good choice.

I agree, if you really want to shake your room with undistorted sound, I don't have experience with Outlaws, but Adcom is one of the relatively low cost solutions out there. I am still amazed with the effortless performance of my old Adcom GFA555. It's toroidal transformer and big 60,000 microfarad capacitors can really do a lot of damage to an average room.

 

[mtrycrafts]

Thanks for all the inputs. Appreciated one and all. I am simply considering how to get the best "do-it-myself" home theater experience. I need to do some research/thinking before I move ahead, but thx again for the comments and recommendations.

Yes, doing more research is in order. After all, audio components and amps will be there tomorrow and the day after, what is the rush?

Your speakers are the main sound producers, along with room acoustics and the software supplying the signals.

The speaker dictates the amp you need. Room size has an input and your desire for volume levels. A good sub is part of it. That will rock your house.

 

[jcPanny]

Sorry guys, maybe I didn't explain well enough. The Emotiva is a good amp. it will not have the peak power of a few good 2ch amps. The caps alone in a 2ch amp will fill up 40% of the case. You can't beat those big caps for reserve power. So the "Buckeye rule" comes into effect, weight rules. 3 2ch amps are going to weigh more than one 5ch amp.

The Emotiva is no slouch with a total weight of 115 lbs with the 7 monoblock amps installed.

Of course multiple monoblock or 2-channel amps will weight more, however, the additional weight of seperate chassis, front pannels, and controls on each amp provide no audible benifit. The 2-channel or monoblocks make sence when amplification is only needed for the front channels.

 

[MacManNM]

The Emotiva is no slouch with a total weight of 115 lbs with the 7 monoblock amps installed.

Of course multiple monoblock or 2-channel amps will weight more, however, the additional weight of seperate chassis, front pannels, and controls on each amp provide no audible benifit. The 2-channel or monoblocks make sence when amplification is only needed for the front channels.

The total capacitance is increased when using multiple amps. That increase equates to more available peak power per channel.

 

[markw]

You may be barking up the wrong tree here.

Mtry and HT Addict hinted at this but I'll come right out with it.

By doubling the amp's power to 200 watts, you will only gain a 3 decible increase in peak loudness. And, 3 decibles isn't a heckuva lot. Quadrupling your power to 400 watts will provide a 6 decible increase, but that's not a lot either considering the financial outlay.

To effectively double the preceived loudness you'll need 10 times your current amp's power. That would put you in the 1000 watt range.

If you want a marked improvement in loudness, I'd be looking at more efficient speakers.

There's where your room for improvement lies. A speaker that is 3 decibles more efficient than another will only need half the power to reach the same loudness. Likewise, a 6 db more sensitive speaker will only need one quarter the power of hte original.

...or else you could just get a bigger subwoofer...

BTW, it's nice of you to clarify the initial postijg after several people asked.

 

[MacManNM]

Mtry and HT Addict hinted at this but I'll come right out with it.

By doubling the amp's power to 200 watts, you will only gain a 3 decible increase in peak loudness. And, 3 decibles isn't a heckuva lot. Quadrupling your power to 400 watts will provide a 6 decible increase, but that's not a lot either considering the financial outlay.

To effectively double the preceived loudness you'll need 10 times your current amp's power. That would put you in the 1000 watt range.

If you want a marked improvement in loudness, I'd be looking at more efficient speakers.

There's where your room for improvement lies. A speaker that is 3 decibles more efficient than another will only need half the power to reach the same loudness. Likewise, a 6 db more sensitive speaker will only need one quarter the power of hte original.

...or else you could just get a bigger subwoofer...

BTW, it's nice of you to clarify the initial postijg after several people asked.

3db is twice as loud.

 

[markw]

wrong. it's twice the power applied to the speaker.

3db is twice as loud.

Unfortunately, the ear doesn't interpret gains in loudness in a logical, linear fashion. We respond to changes in volume in a logarithmic fashion

For twice the relative loudness you need approximately ten times the power.

"The ear can respond to a remarkable range of sound amplitude. (Amplitude corresponds to the quality known as loudness.) The ratio between the threshold of pain and the threshold of sensation is on the order of 130 dB, or ten trillion to one. The judgment of relative sounds is more or less logarithmic, such that a tenfold increase in sound power is described as "twice as loud". The just noticeable difference in loudness varies from 3 dB at the threshold of hearing to an impressive 0.5 dB for loud sounds"

Here's the full link which this was excerted:

http://arts.ucsc.edu/ems/music/tech_background/TE-03/teces_03.html

 

[MacManNM]

Unfortunately, the ear doesn't interpert gains in loudness linearly. For twice the relative loudness you need approximately ten times the power.

"The ear can respond to a remarkable range of sound amplitude. (Amplitude corresponds to the quality known as loudness.) The ratio between the threshold of pain and the threshold of sensation is on the order of 130 dB, or ten trillion to one. The judgment of relative sounds is more or less logarithmic, such that a tenfold increase in sound power is described as "twice as loud". The just noticeable difference in loudness varies from 3 dB at the threshold of hearing to an impressive 0.5 dB for loud sounds"

Here's the link:

http://arts.ucsc.edu/ems/music/tech_background/TE-03/teces_03.html

First of all that is called dynamic range (130db). 2nd of all you are speaking of what the ear perceives. Just because your ear is a nonlinear device doesn’t mean that 3db isn’t twice as loud, it is. Please don’t tell me I’m wrong when you are comparing your apples to my oranges. How do you know that he isn’t sitting 70ft away from his speakers and the average SPL at his position is 85dbm, so an increase of 3db would be measured as twice as loud, and perceived as twice as loud. 3db is twice as loud period.

 

[markw]

First of all that is called dynamic range (130db). 2nd of all you are speaking of what the ear perceives. Just because your ear is a nonlinear device doesn’t mean that 3db isn’t twice as loud, it is. Please don’t tell me I’m wrong when you are comparing your apples to my oranges. How do you know that he isn’t sitting 70ft away from his speakers and the average SPL at his level is 85dbm, so an increase of 3db would be measured as twice as loud, and perceived as twice as loud. 3db is twice as loud period.

whatever you say. I'll stick to what the link says though.

You did notice I used the term "percieved loudness", didn't you? Unless he "listens" with meters I do believe that's all we are concerned with here, isn't it?

 

[MacManNM]

whatever you say. I'll stick to what the link says though.

You did notice I used the term "percieved loudness", didn't you? Unless he "listens" with meters I do believe that's all we are concerned with here, isn't it?

Again, you don't know what the levels are at his listening position, so you can presume what you like. It doesn't matter to me, but 3db is 3db no matter how you slice it.

 

[markw]

True. 3 db is 3 db.

Again, you don't know what the levels are at his listening position, so you can presume what you like. It doesn't matter to me, but 3db is 3db no matter how you slice it.

...but it ain't twice as loud to anybody listening to it. ...sorry