Changing Axiom M80 V2 crossover

W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
I may change my Axiom M80 V2 speaker crossovers to V4 crossovers. Has anyone experience with this? Advice? Thanks
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Spartan
More often than not, when a speaker manufacturer comes out with a different version of an existing speaker model, it's because a woofer, mid-range, or tweeter from the older version is no longer made or available. Any part of that driver, the frame, magnet/voice coil assembly, or cone may have changed, requiring a modified crossover.

Many speaker manufacturers would rather market this as "new and improved" rather than admit they were forced into changes by circumstances beyond their control.

I don't know if this applies to the Axiom M80 V2 vs. V4 or not. But you shouldn't assume it does not.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Seriously, I have no life.
Is this something Axiom recommends doing?
 
W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
Yes, I have contacted Axiom and it's okay. I posted the thread hoping to find someone who has experience doing this, because Axiom doesn't have an instruction sheet
 
W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
Yes, I have contacted Axiom and it's okay. I posted the thread hoping to find someone who has experience doing this, because Axiom doesn't have an instruction sheet
More often than not, when a speaker manufacturer comes out with a different version of an existing speaker model, it's because a woofer, mid-range, or tweeter from the older version is no longer made or available. Any part of that driver, the frame, magnet/voice coil assembly, or cone may have changed, requiring a modified crossover.

Many speaker manufacturers would rather market this as "new and improved" rather than admit they were forced into changes by circumstances beyond their control.

I don't know if this applies to the Axiom M80 V2 vs. V4 or not. But you shouldn't assume it does not.
Thanks for your reply. Axiom has already said the V4 crossover is more linear. I don't know if they have changed the speaker units. I should ask them
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Seriously, I have no life.
Yes, I have contacted Axiom and it's okay. I posted the thread hoping to find someone who has experience doing this, because Axiom doesn't have an instruction sheet
If they say its fine I imagine they don't need you to change drivers as well (or was that part of the conversation?). Installing a crossover is fairly simple, tho as long as you keep track of driver connections. Hopefully they didn't glue the crossover board or otherwise make it hard to remove/install. Have you removed a driver to see what you might need to do to remove the crossover?
 
Swerd

Swerd

Audioholic Spartan
Thanks for your reply. Axiom has already said the V4 crossover is more linear. I don't know if they have changed the speaker units. I should ask them
If the V4 crossover is more linear (does that mean it creates a flatter frequency response curve?) and if it works with the drivers in your V2 speakers, then you should be good to go.

The M80 looks like it's a 3-way speaker with 2 woofers, 2 mid-range drivers, and 2 tweeters. It's 4 ohm impedance suggests each pair of identical drivers is wired in parallel. That means that one pair of wires (a plus wire & a minus wire) coming from the crossover board will branch to pair of parallel drivers.

As lovinthehd said, open up your V2, find the crossover board and make a simple sketch of where all the wires go. You should see at least 4 pairs of wires – they should be color coded or clearly marked. Write it all down or get photos if you can. One pair of wires goes to the terminals on the cabinet back, a second pair goes to the 2 woofers, a third pair goes to the mid-ranges, and the fourth pair goes to the tweeters. Don't remove anything until you are certain how the old board is hooked up.

Look at the new V4 board to find connection points for all those wires.

I'll stop here as the next steps depend on what you find inside, and exactly how you have to make the wire connections. Things will be easier if Axiom provides Quick Disconnect (QD) points on the board, drivers, and wiring. QD connectors snap together and look like these, but come in many colors, or without plastic insulation:
1581505086495.png
 
W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
If the V4 crossover is more linear (does that mean it creates a flatter frequency response curve?) and if it works with the drivers in your V2 speakers, then you should be good to go.

The M80 looks like it's a 3-way speaker with 2 woofers, 2 mid-range drivers, and 2 tweeters. It's 4 ohm impedance suggests each pair of identical drivers is wired in parallel. That means that one pair of wires (a plus wire & a minus wire) coming from the crossover board will branch to pair of parallel drivers.

As lovinthehd said, open up your V2, find the crossover board and make a simple sketch of where all the wires go. You should see at least 4 pairs of wires – they should be color coded or clearly marked. Write it all down or get photos if you can. One pair of wires goes to the terminals on the cabinet back, a second pair goes to the 2 woofers, a third pair goes to the mid-ranges, and the fourth pair goes to the tweeters. Don't remove anything until you are certain how the old board is hooked up.

Look at the new V4 board to find connection points for all those wires.

I'll stop here as the next steps depend on what you find inside, and exactly how you have to make the wire connections. Things will be easier if Axiom provides Quick Disconnect (QD) points on the board, drivers, and wiring. QD connectors snap together and look like these, but come in many colors, or without plastic insulation:
View attachment 34017
If the V4 crossover is more linear (does that mean it creates a flatter frequency response curve?) and if it works with the drivers in your V2 speakers, then you should be good to go.

The M80 looks like it's a 3-way speaker with 2 woofers, 2 mid-range drivers, and 2 tweeters. It's 4 ohm impedance suggests each pair of identical drivers is wired in parallel. That means that one pair of wires (a plus wire & a minus wire) coming from the crossover board will branch to pair of parallel drivers.

As lovinthehd said, open up your V2, find the crossover board and make a simple sketch of where all the wires go. You should see at least 4 pairs of wires – they should be color coded or clearly marked. Write it all down or get photos if you can. One pair of wires goes to the terminals on the cabinet back, a second pair goes to the 2 woofers, a third pair goes to the mid-ranges, and the fourth pair goes to the tweeters. Don't remove anything until you are certain how the old board is hooked up.

Look at the new V4 board to find connection points for all those wires.

I'll stop here as the next steps depend on what you find inside, and exactly how you have to make the wire connections. Things will be easier if Axiom provides Quick Disconnect (QD) points on the board, drivers, and wiring. QD connectors snap together and look like these, but come in many colors, or without plastic insulation:
View attachment 34017
Thanks to swerd and loveinhd for the good advice. I have removed the speakers and photographed the old V2 crossover. It's physically attached to the plastic input plate where the 5 way binding posts are located. Also I have removed the woofers, tweeters and mid-range speakers and noted the color coding. The speaker wires are soldered to the crossover, but connected to the speakers by QD connectors.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Seriously, I have no life.
Sounds like it should be easy enough to swap out then. Curious, what is your reason for swapping out crossovers specifically? What cost or is this something Axiom is providing?
 
W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
Sounds like it should be easy enough to swap out then. Curious, what is your reason for swapping out crossovers specifically? What cost or is this something Axiom is providing?
I'm just trying to upgrade the V2 speakers best I can. I have already spent $408 upgrading the tweeters to V4. I just sent an email to Axiom asking why the crossovers have been modified. I think it's becoming cost prohibitive, the V4 crossovers cost $180 each. Now I'm thinking Klipsch RP8000F with SPL-120 subwoofer.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Seriously, I have no life.
I'm just trying to upgrade the V2 speakers best I can. I have already spent $408 upgrading the tweeters to V4. I just sent an email to Axiom asking why the crossovers have been modified. I think it's becoming cost prohibitive, the V4 crossovers cost $180 each. Now I'm thinking Klipsch RP8000F with SPL-120 subwoofer.
Wow, I'd think new speakers would be a better route but haven't heard Axioms, to say if slight updates are worth it....

ps Cannot think of any reason to use the Klipsch SPL-120....unless it was a really good deal.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Ninja
Now I'm thinking Klipsch RP8000F with SPL-120 subwoofer.
???
That doesn't even seem like an upgrade... just buying something new.
Why that in particular?
Do you really enjoy the Klipsch Sound?
Is there something about the Axioms you dislike?
What's at play here?
 
W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
Wow, I'd think new speakers would be a better route but haven't heard Axioms, to say if slight updates are worth it....

ps Cannot think of any reason to use the Klipsch SPL-120....unless it was a really good deal.
I would first buy the Klipsch RP8000F, and then if needed, the SPL-120.
 
W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
???
That doesn't even seem like an upgrade... just buying something new.
Why that in particular?
Do you really enjoy the Klipsch Sound?
Is there something about the Axioms you dislike?
What's at play here?
I cannot audition speakers. I live on the beach in the countryside in the Philippines. If you research in the internet, it's unbelievable how highly recommended the Klipsch speakers are. Also, they are bi-amp able, highly sensitive, 8 ohm speakers which would work well with my class A amps. Not to mention the fact that I can buy them here online.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Ninja
I cannot audition speakers. I live on the beach in the countryside in the Philippines. If you research in the internet, it's unbelievable how highly recommended the Klipsch speakers are. Also, they are bi-amp able, highly sensitive, 8 ohm speakers which would work well with my class A amps. Not to mention the fact that I can buy them here online.
;)
Fair enough.
Have you read the review our own James Larson did here?
It is not without its flaws, but as you've said... they are also widely appreciated.
 
W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
;)
Fair enough.
Have you read the review our own James Larson did here?
It is not without its flaws, but as you've said... they are also widely appreciated.
Yes, I did read the review. Another reason to buy the Klipsch is the "fix" Danny Ritchie of GR Research offers for $359 (plus shipping) to fix the crossover anomaly of the speaker.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Ninja
It's been discussed, and Danny's measurements were done very near field, likely at 1m, as opposed to the more common 2m. That fact alone shows the difference in measurements between his and James... but the fixed being based on that near field measurement is somewhat of a gamble when listening at the more proscribed 2-3 m for a speaker that size.
Not trying to talk you out of it. Just surprised.
I hope you stick around and share as the story continues to unfold.
 
W

WJGJ

Enthusiast
It's been discussed, and Danny's measurements were done very near field, likely at 1m, as opposed to the more common 2m. That fact alone shows the difference in measurements between his and James... but the fixed being based on that near field measurement is somewhat of a gamble when listening at the more proscribed 2-3 m for a speaker that size.
Not trying to talk you out of it. Just surprised.
I hope you stick around and share as the story continues to unfold.
I will post as the story goes on. Thanks again!
 

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