I

Isade

Enthusiast
Looking for some advice. I currently own a Sony CDP-591 cd player from 1991 that seems to be acting up but still works. Would I be able to tell a difference in sound quality between the Sony to lets say a newer Yamaha CD-S300, is it worth the upgrade? I have a Yamaha receiver and would like to stick with Yamaha.
 
Last edited:
davidscott

davidscott

Audioholic Ninja
If the Sony is acting up then you will probably hear a difference.:) Seriously the built in dacs of current cd players should be much better than a 1991 player. But you still may or may not hear a sonic difference.
 
I

Isade

Enthusiast
Just reading about DACs in current players are superior to older units, will I actually notice the difference.
My Sony just has an issue with not opening or closing at times or detecting a cd loaded, just power off on seems to fix it.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
If you must rely on the dacs in the cd player then it could be an audible difference altho not too likely IMO. If you're using a digital connection it's just acting as a transport. I haven't used a cd-only player in man years, otoh, have preferred using optical disc players that also play cd but even more these days I simply rip the cd to flac and stream the flac file.
 
M

mjcmt

Audioholic
Is your Yamaha receiver a 2 channel receiver? Are you using the analog outputs of your cdp to it? You will definitely hear a difference. Sounds like your current Sony cdps laser may be at the end of it's life, so the upgrade will be necessary sooner or later. The Dac, analog board, and how Yamaha implemented it within the new Yamaha is likely better than using the digital out to an avr's internal processing because Yamaha has designed their cdp to have excellent performance as a stand alone unit.
 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
I'm not a believer in the DAC argument.

I just don't think there's any *audible* difference that isn't distortion between any competent DACs.

I'd strongly recommend you just go grab a recent, used DVD or BD player from your local pawn. Save yourself $395 plus shipping.

I've owned quite a few CD players, including several for SACDs; and the only difference I've seen (at least in the last 20 years) is in connections, control interface, and what formats they support.
 
M

mjcmt

Audioholic
Remember Jerry there is more than the Dac, it eventually becomes an analog signal so analog implementation in a cdp or stand alone dac is as important as the dac used. I used a basic bdp's analog out vs. the digital out into 2 different stand alone dacs. The better Schiit Dac offered the best sound while a budget $25 24/192 dac was the worst, with the bdp in the middle. The new Yamaha cdp is a very fine unit. The OP likes the new Yammie because his old player is dying and it matches his receiver, so I hardily endorse his choice.
 
Last edited:
I

Isade

Enthusiast
I have a 2 ch Yamaha that Im using for music only connected with RCA, didnt like the way the avr performed with 2 ch.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
I have a 2 ch Yamaha that Im using for music only connected with RCA, didnt like the way the avr performed with 2 ch.
Does the 2ch unit have digital capabilities or do you rely on your cd player for dac? It's customary to simply provide make/model of gear involved....
 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
Remember Jerry there is more than the Dac, it eventually becomes an analog signal so analog implementation in a cdp or stand alone dac is as important as the dac used.
That's literally what DAC means... Digital to Analog Converter.

If you are talking about the aplifier on the DAC output; that's one of the reasons I tend to recommend doing DAC in the AVR; for one thing it's nice to keep the signal digital as long as possible and for another the pre-amp in the AVR is generally better than in your CD player.

The better Schiit Dac offered the best sound while a budget $25 24/192 dac was the worst, with the bdp in the middle.
I assert that there's no audible difference between a competent AVR's DAC and the DAC of your choice unless yours is coloring the sound.

Let's follow the rabbit hole a bit, shall we?

We have ~40 years of DAC building.
We have a massive price differential.

Which of those two affects sound?

If it's price: then get an expensive CD player from 5 years back at pennies on the dollar and get that sweet premium DAC.

If it's time, perform regular upgrades on your cheap player to stay ahead of the curve.

In neither case is the wise choice spending $400 on a current high-end CD player.

Unless you will be buying new $400 CD players every year (and the fact that this poster hasn't upgraded his player from the 80s suggests he will not); you are either just as served by a used one, or your new one will be "sounding bad" within a couple of years relative to the new ones.

The new Yamaha cdp is a very fine unit. The OP likes the new Yammie because his old player is dying and it matches his receiver
Even if you *do* think there's a difference in DACs (and see my previous comment as even more damning than this one); Yamaha made the DAC in the AVR... why not go ahead and use it rather than the DAC in the Yamaha CD player?
 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
Can anyone point to a comparison of two modern DACs where
1) there was a measurable difference in the output waves
2) the difference was audible in DBX
3) the difference was that the "better" DAC was closer to the source wave?
 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
I have a 2 ch Yamaha that Im using for music only connected with RCA, didnt like the way the avr performed with 2 ch.
1) How old is your Yammy?
2) You are stating that it sounded different (worse) when connected to your CD player by optical cable than by RCA cables? How so?
 
B

Beave

Audioholic Chief
Can anyone point to a comparison of two modern DACs where
1) there was a measurable difference in the output waves
2) the difference was audible in DBX
3) the difference was that the "better" DAC was closer to the source wave?
I evaluated DAC chips as part of my job for a number of years.

There were measurable differences among all of them - although all measured very good and the differences were likely not audible.
 
B

Beave

Audioholic Chief
As for the analog components supporting the DAC IC, yes, they obviously matter. But the chip vendor generally supplies a recommended "reference design" for their chip. If you follow that design, or only make changes that are wise, you will get excellent performance. It's hard to screw it up, in other words - but some still might do so.
 
M

mjcmt

Audioholic
BTW Jerry, there is still the issue of how well the DAC chip is implemented. There is a sonic difference. Plus I was making the comparison in a 2 channel audiophile system, not a HT which is what I suspected the OP was refering to looking for a cd player. I guess this is the wrong forum to bring up my points, so good by.
 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Samurai
BTW Jerry, there is still the issue of how well the DAC chip is implemented. There is a sonic difference. Plus I was making the comparison in a 2 channel audiophile system, not a HT which is what I suspected the OP was refering to looking for a cd player. I guess this is the wrong forum to bring up my points, so good by.
You seem to be dodging the issue and also tossing up some cognitive dissonance.

Let's assume that there is a difference in DAC + implamentation + any other factors you want to assert. I will grant your position as entirely true for the sake of the discussion.

If there's a lot of change from cheap to expensive: Buy expensive from a couple of years ago for pennies.
If there's a lot of change from year to year: Buy cheap but keep buying every year/model/whatever.
If there's a lot of change in both (both the quality is improving every year and the gap from cheap to expensive is improving every year)... well. that's a *lot* of change. It should be as apparent to the ear as the move from VHS to HDR UHD is.

Can you offer even a hypothesis that fits all those facts and still yields a "buy a current $400 player for sound" result? Because I honestly cannot.

Would you agree that, unless there's been a sudden paradigm shift, for there to be a difference for "golden ears" between the best DAC of 5 years ago and the best DAC of right now; the difference between the average DAC of 30 years ago and the best DAC of now should be obvious and apparent to everyone?
 
newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top