Can You Have TOO Much Bass?

[Zarg]

I just bought my second HT/Music system -- an upgrade from my first, which did not make me very happy. I bought a Denon 3805 (great price from Pacific Sales, BTW), Axiom Audio M60ti's front, Axiom Audio VP 150 Center, and Axiom Audio QS-8 Surrounds. I also bought a SV PB-12 ISD/2 Subwoofer. It's the latter purchase that's causing the questions.

I'm installing the system in a moderately sized room with cathedral ceilings. Learning from my previous mistake(s), I'm having a professional installation/calibration done -- wires through the walls, etc. The installer represents that he has nearly 20 years' experience and has good references -- seems like a very knowledgable guy. But he tells me I have too much subwoofer.

The SV Subwoofer has a 600 watt BASH amplifier and two 12-inch cones. I bought it because I was worried about subwoofer placement and room acoustics, and wanted to be able to outpower any problems. It's not like I plan to shatter the windows or anything ... I just want clean, tight bass -- which is what my previous HT system totally lacked.

So the installer is telling me that my sub won't integrate with the Axiom speakers because they are "full range" -- all I will get is bass. He says I should get half the sub and spend the difference on a new DVD player (he recommends Denon, BTW).

That doesn't sound right to me -- can't I set the cross-over to avoid a boomy bass, regardless of how much power the sub is putting out? Doesn't the volume control count for anything -- I'm 99% sure the sub has a separate volume control.

Part of the problem may be that he's just not familar with the SV line (which he admitted). But on the off-chance that he's right, I wanted to see if y'all will confirm his theory.

Is it possible to have too much subwoofer compared to the rest of the system? Is is possible to have too much base so that you can't adjust the system's response into a clean, integrated whole?

Thanks!

 

[cam]

Is it possible to have too much subwoofer compared to the rest of the system? Yes, but believe you me, this is a good thing. There are so many situations where people under sub their system. The sub becomes the limiting facter. Your other speakers may not be your speakers in a year or so, you might buy bigger and also buy a bigger amp. No need to upgrade the sub, you've already got a killer sub. Is it possible to have too much bass? Yes, if not calibrated properly your sub can easily become too loud compered to the rest of your system. This so called repretable guy that is going to calibrate your system, get rid of him. Your money will be better spent on a sound pressure meter and an afternoon to calibrate for yourself. With a sub, bigger is better, you may not need it now all the time, but when you do it will be ready to hit you in the chest when ever it is called upon.

 

[Unregistered]

It's certainly possible to have a sub that is capable of putting out more bass than you can reasonably use for your room, but the installers explanation that it will be problematic because the Axioms are 'full range' is bogus. He might not be familiar with bass management.

If you set all speakers to small, as is generally recommended, and choose a reasonable crossover frequency you won't have 'all bass' as the installer put it. You will have to calibrate the system properly of course.

He does have a point though that you will likely have the volume on the sub rather low, thus not utilizing much of its potential. Better to not push the sub beyond its capabilities, but you could argue that it is a waste of money to buy an incredible sub and then use only 1/3 of its potential. Cam's points are valid too. If you do with the SVS sub, you will likely never need to upgrade it when/if you upgrade other components or speakers.

 

[Sheep]

He is a Fool

Yes i agree with the others. The Axiom M60ti go down to a solid 37hz but you don't have ot run them that low, you can set them to small and give the bass responsibilities to the subwoofer. Another thing that the installer missed is that you can cross the sub out. It doesn't play full range, as a matter of fact your supposed to cross the sub out a little higher then your main speakers for the best integration. Man, i hope you didn't pay this guy anything yet. Here is what i propose.

set up all your speakers and get your system running, then tel tha guy to @!#%#$& off.
play some music and figure out where you system sounds proper to you, or what your tastes are.

Some one else can't tell you how you like it

sheep

 

[Zarg]

Thanks for the input

Thanks all.

I think maybe I didn't do a good job of explaining the guy's reasoning. Basically, I think he was saying that my front Axioms already had a good bass response (unlike say, bookshelf speakers) so the subwoofer would be less important than otherwise.

But in any case, I will take most of your advice and tell him that the sub stays! (I'm still going to let him calibrate the system for me though.)

Thanks again!

 

[mtrycrafts]

I also bought a SV PB-12 ISD/2 Subwoofer. It's the latter purchase that's causing the questions.

I'm installing the system in a moderately sized room with cathedral ceilings. Learning from my previous mistake(s),

What may they be?

I'm having a professional installation/calibration done -- wires through the walls, etc. The installer represents that he has nearly 20 years' experience and has good references -- seems like a very knowledgable guy. But he tells me I have too much subwoofer.

What is he actually doing for you? How is he calibrating the system? Any EQ involved or just level matching that is a DIY project? What professional training and certification does he have? I had a plumber with 20 years experience, taught school but he was lacking knowledge a great deal. So, not all experience is equal ijn qialioty, right?

The SV Subwoofer has a 600 watt BASH amplifier and two 12-inch cones. I bought it because I was worried about subwoofer placement and room acoustics, and wanted to be able to outpower any problems. It's not like I plan to shatter the windows or anything ... I just want clean, tight bass -- which is what my previous HT system totally lacked.

These subs will do this well.

So the installer is telling me that my sub won't integrate with the Axiom speakers because they are "full range" -- all I will get is bass.


What? All you get is bass from which speaker, the sub? Not clear what he is getting at.

He says I should get half the sub and spend the difference on a new DVD player (he recommends Denon, BTW).

May want to consider soemone else?

That doesn't sound right to me --

Me neither.

can't I set the cross-over to avoid a boomy bass, regardless of how much power the sub is putting out?

Boomy bass will depend on your room size and the sub. Crossover may or may not help, nor another sub may do that. You may need an EQ for it.

Doesn't the volume control count for anything -- I'm 99% sure the sub has a separate volume control.

And you can also level match it to a lesser volume through the receiver.

Part of the problem may be that he's just not familar with the SV line (which he admitted). But on the off-chance that he's right, I wanted to see if y'all will confirm his theory.

Or, he may be a DIY installer, lacking real knowledge?



Is it possible to have too much subwoofer compared to the rest of the system?

No way.

Is is possible to have too much base so that you can't adjust the system's response into a clean, integrated whole?

Thanks!

Maybe. Your room is a factor as well. You should not have a problem with this sub.

You can also send an email to customer service at SV and tell him what the installer told you. Tom is a great guy and knowledgeable.

 

[Unregistered]

I have the same axiom speakers. This guy sounds worthless Calibrate yourself. That is great equipment

 

[dreadstar]

To much sub?

Unlikely. crossing over your sub to a higher point and letting it handle some if not all of the bass information from your mains will make the mids on them that much cleaner. Also it will lighten the load on your amp going to the mains so it will run more efficiently.

Having a sub that excedes your room is prefered over one that can not produce enough to satisfy the source media. There is nothing worse than a clipping sub. Well maybe a blown tweeter.

Calibrating your system to your ears is much prefered over doing it with someone elses. Ratshack opps Radioshack has inexpensive db meters buy one. and get a good test DVD and run your setup through the paces.

You will be much happier with the system if you do.