Building a Home Theater PC: Why do I need a Soundcard?

Hi Ho

Hi Ho

Audioholic Samurai
No question... Coolmaster is a decient case manufacture. The point I was making is that a Rackmount Case would look better (WAF) in the rack. I do like Antec, because of the high quality of the power supply that comes with their mini-tower. There is generally no need to replace the PSU, where I would be very hesitant of using any PSU that came with a coolermaster.
I agree that CoolerMaster PSU's should be avoided. Most don't come with a PSU though. I always think of a case as personal preference. Unless it's a really, really bad case it's hard to go wrong with one based on looks. It's almost always necassary, however, to replace the PSU. How do manufacturers get away with producing such crap PSU's? Some can even catch fire!
 
jonnythan

jonnythan

Audioholic Ninja
jmprader said:
Pardon my momentary hijack of this thread, but some of you guys seem to have your PC HT knowledge down a lot better than this tech dinosaur (think "this guy's first computer must have been an Apple 2+ with a 1mhz 8 bit 6502 processor, dual floppies and 64k memory", ok?!)

I'm interested in knowing what info any of you might be able to provide on:
1. 1080i or 1080p output capable DVD drives (not Blu-Ray or HD-DVD) that might be out there...I don't even know if today's standard DVD drive can output 1080i/p content, that's how archaic I am. :confused:
Any DVD drive, coupled with a graphics card with HDTV out (most of them these days have this) like a Geforce 6800GS will allow you to use your computer to upscale the DVD content to 1080i or 720p.
jmprader said:
2. 1080i or 1080p capable A/V cards, preferably with HDMI, but DVI with digital or ieee1394 outs are just great, too.
Not sure exactly what you're asking, but most video cards today have two outputs - generally one VGA/RGB and one DVI. Some have 2 DVI, etc. These DVI ports are physically compatible with HDMI - it's easy to buy a cable that has HDMI at one end and DVI at the other. Adapters are also cheap. These ports are perfectly happy running at 1280x720 or 1920x1080
 
T

Topher

Junior Audioholic
The computer I'm going to be using has optical & coax digital out on the mobo (an MSI K7N2 Delta-L), but there's no digital-in on it or the Hauppauge 150MCE.
Is it possible to record, or at least pass through the dolby digital signal from either a satellite receiver or a cable box? The OP mentioned an analogue connection from the cable box to his HTPC.
 
K

kleinwl

Audioholic
Topher said:
The computer I'm going to be using has optical & coax digital out on the mobo (an MSI K7N2 Delta-L), but there's no digital-in on it or the Hauppauge 150MCE.
Is it possible to record, or at least pass through the dolby digital signal from either a satellite receiver or a cable box? The OP mentioned an analogue connection from the cable box to his HTPC.
M-Audio produces the Revolution 5.1 (or 7.1) for $100. It has a 24 bit/96 KHz line in for recording. It also supports PCM, A3D, DTS, & Dolby Digital.

Run the signal from the receiver or cable box into the Revolution line-in. Note: I have done this successfully with TV tuner cards... but not tried it on satellite boxes... however I don't see why they would be any different.

BTW: there are a number of sound card with line-in so don't feel forced into a M-audio. Turtle Beach and others are also reasonable alternatives. Go check on newegg.com
 
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K

kleinwl

Audioholic
Hi Ho said:
I agree that CoolerMaster PSU's should be avoided. Most don't come with a PSU though. I always think of a case as personal preference. Unless it's a really, really bad case it's hard to go wrong with one based on looks. It's almost always necassary, however, to replace the PSU. How do manufacturers get away with producing such crap PSU's? Some can even catch fire!
The same way anything else is produced.. If you make enough profit to pay off the lawsuits then you stay in buisness... otherwise... not.

To be honest though... even the $1.99 PSUs shipped with a cheapo case are good enough to power an office computer (at least for a while :eek: )... just don't try to run more than a 150W off of the ULTRA 800W PSU that came with your $40 case.
 
J

jmprader

Audioholic Intern
kleinwl said:
...(Note: I'm assuming that your copying the file to the HTTP's HDD, otherwise 1080P bitstream could be to high to be supported by the DVD's read rate.)

I can't find the specs for a Dell 4550 or E310...

BTW: My first computer was an Apple II (I thought the IIe was awesome.. so much smaller/lighter). So what are you talking about tech dinosaur?
Thanks for helping. I think I get it on the DVD side...users would more likely be copying the HD material from DVD to their HDD then "on with the show". That makes sense. The card info is appreciated, too, I got somewhat confused reading the marketing material for several. probably due to suspicions from all the doubletalk regarding true resolutions in the DLP marketing materials and ability to accept/output 1080i/p based material.

Our Dell's should work, the older CPU is @ 2.4 as I recall, the E310 is @ 2.8.

Ok, you trumped me, the II came first, but did you ever use a cassette player to upload your applesoft programs? Geez, I remember my z-80 card, paged memory, 300 baud modem and "Visi-Calc"..I was the envy of my MBA class...until one guy got an IBM PC...

Thanks again for your help.

-minor content edit-
 
R

redshifter

Enthusiast
kleinwl said:
The same way anything else is produced.. If you make enough profit to pay off the lawsuits then you stay in buisness... otherwise... not.

To be honest though... even the $1.99 PSUs shipped with a cheapo case are good enough to power an office computer (at least for a while :eek: )... just don't try to run more than a 150W off of the ULTRA 800W PSU that came with your $40 case.
the coolmaster case i chose does not come with a psu.

if you read my previous post, here is the psu i chose:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817104954
 
K

kleinwl

Audioholic
redshifter said:
the coolmaster case i chose does not come with a psu.

if you read my previous post, here is the psu i chose:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817104954
I understand, I was just suggesting the Fortan and coolmaster case was not the most cost efficent option. The Antec SLK1650B comes with decient 350W PSU all for $57. (newegg). If you wish the Coolmaster for style, etc... then that is, of course, your preference.

However, the point that I kept making, and at this point is obviously a non-starter, is that I do not recommend a mid-tower at all for a HTPC. I find that it is much more astically pleasing to purchase a rack-mount case and use that instead. I also recommend a wireless keyboard/mouse as the interface (for obvious reasons).

Edit - additional note -
One of the things that I find that people don't consider when first putting together a HTPC is noise. The average PC is noisy... and it is a real irritant when watching a movie or lisening to music. One of the things that I highly suggest when building an HTPC is thinking about what can be done to lower the noise from the machine.

1) The most critical is the case itself. Since airflow management is key in keeping temperatures reasonable, the case design will make or break your noise floor by allowing you to keep fans running slowly... or forcing you to up them to extreme levels. The other point in a good case, is some have HDD isolators, Noise suppression coatings, and other features to keep your case quiet.

2) The second most critical are the fans. oversizing and undervolting is a tried and true way of keeping airflow up, but lowering fan noise. The noise generated from a fan is normally generated at the fan tip and directly proportional to fan tip speed. However, CFM is also directly proportional to fan size.... so larger fans running at lower speeds are generally quieter (at the same CFM) as smaller fans running at higher speed. Similarly a good cpu cooler will be more efficent in keeping the cpu temperatures at reasonable levels allowing for lower fan speed.

3) Heat generation. AMD cpus are generally running cooler than intel cpus (with the exception of the moble P-M and Core duo). Running an AMD cpu undervolted/underclocked can help reduce the heat generated by the PC and thus lower the airflow necessary to keep temperatures low. Seasonic PSUs are also higher efficency PSUs than standard, this means that they give off less waste heat converting AC to DC for the computer... again allowing for lower speed fans. The other point is that Asus has come out with a mobo (MVP32) that has more regulators than normal for the cpu... that means conversion to cpu voltage is more efficent and again heat generated is lower.

4) The last point is the most questionable because it directly effects component life. There is a thermal envelope that the cpu and system has been designed at. The higher the temperature that you let your system heat up to (within the envelope) the higher the heat flux from your machine to the enviroment will be. In other words, let you pc heat up by throttling fans, etc and let the case itself radiate heat to the enviroment. Yes your machine will be hot to the touch. Yes you will be lowering the lifespan of the PC... but you will be rewarded with the quietest machine around, because for each CFM you flow out, more joules of waste energy will be exhausted... I highly suggest being careful with this... but the termal managment options built into BIOS will allow you to take advantage of this natural flux.
 
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K

kleinwl

Audioholic
jmprader said:
Our Dell's should work, the older CPU is @ 2.4 as I recall, the E310 is @ 2.8.

Ok, you trumped me, the II came first, but did you ever use a cassette player to upload your applesoft programs? Geez, I remember my z-80 card, paged memory, 300 baud modem and "Visi-Calc"..I was the envy of my MBA class...until one guy got an IBM PC...

Wow... a cassette player... that would have been awesome! I was stuck with a whole bunch of 5.25" floppies. My favorite moment was the day I stuck my floppy holder in the back seat and set off for class... by the time I got back they were are visably warped... oh well... at least they were still useful as freebees!

One of the things I would be careful about Dell's is that they always have pretty good processor specs... but everything else sucks! Make sure they have at least 512MB of ram (preferrably 1GB). Most DDR / DDR-II ram is cheap and easy to install. If you still have Rambus-RAM, your stuck. Rambus-RAM is still hundreds of dollars for 512MB. The other check point is the video card which we already talked about.
 
R

redshifter

Enthusiast
kleinwl
wow, great info.

i chose the microatx coolmaster case because the media pc cases were all overpriced, and i intend to have the pc upright next to the tv on the cabinet. the case matches the silver/black components in my ht too.
 
T

Topher

Junior Audioholic
kleinwl, thanks for the info, it's good to know I won't have to sacrifice DD surround.
 
K

kleinwl

Audioholic
redshifter said:
kleinwl
wow, great info.

i chose the microatx coolmaster case because the media pc cases were all overpriced, and i intend to have the pc upright next to the tv on the cabinet. the case matches the silver/black components in my ht too.

I understand completely. Rack mount or HTPC cases are more expensive. If you run two 80mm panflow fans (The centurion only allows 120mm intake) and undervolt them to ~8V they should be nice and quiet (you can stage the turn on with a good fan controller). Or just run one 80mm panflow (they are good for 21 CFM @ 12V).

I recommend an aftermarket cpu cooler such as the XP-120 (I didn't check clearances on the mobo... so check that first) or zalman 9500 to keep CPU temp in check.

The max thermal envelope (from AMD) on a sempron is 70C. Due to variablity in Motherboard thermal couples, I recommend keeping the cpu at least 10C below the thermal envelope. ie. at 60C. Use the cool'n'quiet fan management to run full at 60C and throttle off at 50C. This will allow you to consistantly keep your CPU at ~55C or so... which is higher than normal... but it minimizes fan noise. A pretty normal CPU temp is ~ 45C.

You can also switch your hard drive to silent mode (on some models) which will reduce the hdd speed slightly, but also decrease the noise (if you notice it).

Again, if you use temperature management to keep cpu noise in check be certain to check that the mobo's north/southbridge is within specifications, otherwise you will have to increase you case air flow.

Thanks for the complements!
 
K

kleinwl

Audioholic
Question:

For all you guys that had questions about HTPCs. Do you think that audioholic readers would be interested in purchasing custom built HTPCs?

ie. Would it be worth the time/expense to build an HTPC and ask Gene to review it?

If the answer is yes... what would be an reasonable price point for such a system? I have in mind a $1500 system that is well configured rack mount with both gaming and general a/v in mind.

Thanks for the feedback!

-Note: if this post is against the forum rules please disregard.
 

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