Best Buy lead me here! Help

Soundman

Soundman

Audioholic Field Marshall
That's right. You haven't heard the speakers, and neither have I. Peter Aczel has, and since I respect his ears, if perhaps not his tendency to hyperbolize, I thought it was worth a mention.

More importantly, I think it's a bit silly to dismiss a product simply based on its price. The analogy isn't perfect, but my $2,000 Mac notebook weighing 5 pounds runs rings around computers costing millions of dollars in the 1960s the size of a room and weighing thousands of pounds. Were I able to go back in time with this little computer and make that claim to someone in the business he'd probably laugh at me, and only look like a fool when I turned it on and showed him what I do every day in Photoshop.

There is very little correlation between sound quality and price when it comes to audio gear.
OK, first of all, you're right. I haven't heard these actually speakers. But that's why I did mention that they may be very good for the price. If I were looking for a $200 setup then I would not dismiss them. However, it looks like the OP is looking to step it up a little bit. It is foolish to think that a $200 system can compete with a real system. Meaning a dedicated amp, processor, speakers, etc. You say that it is silly to dismiss a product based on price. It is true that there are some products out there that are over priced. But what you will find in the audio industry is that good products sell themselves, not some cleaver review telling you that this product performs like others costing 5 times the price, etc...etc. It's just not possible. High quality drivers alone that are used in high quality speakers will cost a whole lot more then $200 and that's just the drivers.
Another thing to point out is your comparison of your computer to computer's in the 1960's. That's got to be one of the most ridiculous comparisons I've heard. First of all, we aren't living in the 1960's. Secondly, you need to understand that the computer industry works drastically differently then the audio industry. Computer technology can literally change over night. Speaker technology really hasn't changed all that much. Yes, there are newer designs as such, but you can still find good quality speakers from 20-30 yrs ago that still sound excellent. You just have to look for them. Uh, you can't say that about computers. By the way, I can build a PC that will run circles over your Mac for less money, but let me stop there b/c that's going way off topic.
Let me close by saying this, that $200 setup may be fine for some, and may be a great performer for the money, but high quality components used to make good quality speakers cost more then that to produce. That is just a fact, especially when you consider your $200 setup comes with 5 speakers, a sub, an amp, decoder, and remote control. A high performing setup like that can't be manufactured at that price. The materials alone would cost more then that. Again, the review was hinting that this system was going to compete on the high end and that is highly unlikely. If purchasing such a system you need to set reasonable expectations for it.
 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Ninja
More importantly, I think it's a bit silly to dismiss a product simply based on its price.
The [insert car-company] has a new car out for a $8000 MSRP that is more comfortable than a Rolls Royce, and out performs the McLaren F1.

You haven't driven it. You don't know it doesn't. You wouldn't honestly say that the car can't be the most luxurious and fastest car in the world simply because it only cost $8000?

Of course you can tell something by price... low price anyway. Though some people will spend money on snake-oil ($3000 power-cables), the market for mid-fi speakers wouldn't really exist as it does if the sound could be done far cheaper. Certainly busineses, like movie theaters, would not be spending what they do. That's money out of their bottom line.
 
M

mudrummer99

Senior Audioholic
Actually, I was considering using the speakers in the 1k or 3k setup listed on this web site and selling the Bose. Speaker size is a big issue. I have to keep them discreet. My wife actually does not want a surround sound system because of the problem, so I better do it right this time.

But I guess I am wondering if anyone KNOWS that the speakers are my problem. I suppose I could just buy a decent amp and do it in pieces.

As for the 2nd sub, I have a hard enough time defending the one we have to the "boss", no way I can add another!

Oh yes, one other thing BB is selling. for 300.00 (-100,00 if you buy the tv from them) they will tune your Plasma TV. They claim they can improve the picture and reduce heat output by 43%. They had a display where you could see (and feel) the difference. Interesting that I could not see the cable connections in back. I bet one was HDMI and the other was component video.

I did not question it until I saw the rest of the garbage in my quote.
I am a current Magnolia (BB) employee. I preface this with that, so take this for what you like. As far as $700 in cables, that's a little out of hand but that is what most sales associates are taught to do. As far as the calibration, I can definitely speak to my store and the ones in my area, we run HDMI from our Directv receiver to both tvs, so our calibration demo area is about as fair as you can get and it does save quite a bit of energy. 43% seems a little wishful, but 25-30% for most plasma is not out of the question, that is about the difference between our demo setup (~300 watts - ~200 realtime draw avg.) Whether or not it is worth it to you is up to you. Does it improve picture and efficiency, IMO yes, but what you see is up to you.

A tip for dealing with BB in general, atleast from the several stores I have worked in over the past few years. If you are coming back with that kind of quote, you are probably in an Magnolia store, talk to the associates, see if they can give you a reason for the difference between the M-series monster cables and the ultra series, especially at 4ft lengths. If they give you some cookie cutter line about shielding and blah blah blah, find another associate that won't BS you. Unfortunately you may not be at a store that can supply such an associate so if you choose to shop at that store in the future, just block any portion of the sale out that isn't the listening to the speaker parts. Hope this helps a bit and not all BB associates are dollar pushers (at least I like to think so :D)

Mike
 
J

jhb

Audiophyte
Mudrummer,

I have tempered my thoughts. Yes, it was a Magnolia store.

I will still get my equipment from BB, too convenient, and they service what they sell, but I will not get any cables or the power conditioner. I will get the Service Plan for the TV ONLY. Been burned once. It would have paid for itself if I had done it the 1st time.

However, when I go back, I will be more informed and not so easily lead.
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
... I will get the Service Plan for the TV ONLY. Been burned once. It would have paid for itself if I had done it the 1st time.
.
Hindsight is 20/20, yes.:D
 
Soundman

Soundman

Audioholic Field Marshall
The [insert car-company] ...the market for mid-fi speakers wouldn't really exist as it does if the sound could be done far cheaper. Certainly busineses, like movie theaters, would not be spending what they do. That's money out of their bottom line.
agreed. :)
 
C

ChunkyDark

Full Audioholic
You can save ~25% energy on your plasma by setting the power levels. Every TV will be different but if you read your manual you'll see where you can set it. By lowering the power draw it makes the display slightly darker. Personally I noticed very little difference, but with my Kill-a-watt
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882715001&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Electronic+Gadgets-_-P3+International-_-82715001
I was able to see the consumption difference. If you have a bright room it might work for you, but just experiment and see what you like.
For more calibration you can also get something like this:
http://www.buy.com/prod/avia-guide-to-home-theater-2/q/loc/322/206148240.html
The other option is after you buy the TV go to avsforums and search for your TV. There is a good chance someone has posted their calibration. It probably won't be prefect for you, but good place to start.
 
R

rnatalli

Audioholic Ninja
I agree with what others have already said. Sell your Bose on eBay and look into Orbs, Mirage Nanosats, or in/on wall speakers. BJC and Monoprice are great for cables.
 
Midcow2

Midcow2

Banned
A long long time ago

That's right. You haven't heard the speakers, and neither have I. Peter Aczel has, and since I respect his ears, if perhaps not his tendency to hyperbolize, I thought it was worth a mention.

More importantly, I think it's a bit silly to dismiss a product simply based on its price. The analogy isn't perfect, but my $2,000 Mac notebook weighing 5 pounds runs rings around computers costing millions of dollars in the 1960s the size of a room and weighing thousands of pounds. Were I able to go back in time with this little computer and make that claim to someone in the business he'd probably laugh at me, and only look like a fool when I turned it on and showed him what I do every day in Photoshop.

There is very little correlation between sound quality and price when it comes to audio gear.
Whe IBM mainframes were king, there use to be two user groups: GUIDE and SHARE. I was on a SHARE futures committee ( also on a simialr GUIDE committe) and we were specing out and designing a device that would have the power of the mainframe yet could be contained on a desktop, this was in the 69 or 70, it later actually evolved and was called "PC". IBM produced their first PC in 73. An LOL I had a $700 pair of speakers at the time tied in to a Maratz 1060 amplifier and a Dyanaco FM 5 tuner I buiilt.. The name of the speakers and the brand escapes my memory :rolleyes: but they had nine little 4 1/2" cones in each speaker :D
 
J

jhb

Audiophyte
At this point I am debating the Yamaha rxv663 or the HK AVR246. The HK has the video upconversion sources for HDMI. I would only need it for the cablebox as the DVD or bluray will upconvert on its own.

I also might just get the Plasma TV and upconvert DVD and call it a day and save the surround sound for a later date.

I will most likely keep the Bose for a while longer, but definitely will consider getting the recommeded speakers from this thread in the future, with a sub.
 
cwall99

cwall99

Full Audioholic
In-Walls may be your thing

You may want to go with in-wall speakers. Granted, they have to make some sacrifices in their performance (they can't be custom-tuned to the box in which you put them like a free-standing speaker can), and they're probably a lot more expensive to install (if you're like me, and the best tool in your tool box is your check book, you'll want a professional installer to put them in).

Still, in-walls have come a long way in the past few years (and I don't even like them, but they may get you a much higher WAF - Wife Acceptance Factor). Most in-walls now allow you to paint right over their grills so they better match your walls.

Plus, I've heard it said (probably by someone selling in-walls) that having in-walls adds a lot of value to your home. He also suggested that what you do is you put all your money into your good in-wall speakers, and then, before you put your house on the market, take out the good ones and put in some more speakers that are a bit less expensive so you can take your good speakers to your next house.

Whatever.

Can't hear the dialog?
- Do you have a center channel?
- Have you set the speaker levels (or had a professional do it for you?)

I agree with everyone else: the Bose system makes a good door stop or paper weight.

Some of the EMP speakers they sell here are small and might also allow your wife to enjoy them.

Still, there's no substitute for cubic inches in a speaker cabinet.
 

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