[B]SVS Cylinders vs. Boxes, Let's get it on!!![B]

[Daz3d&Confus3d]

SVS Cylinders vs. Boxes, Lets get it on!!

Is it just me, or does it seem that just about everyone that goes with svs gets a box instead of one of the cylinders. WHY???

Is it the looks? Because it seems to me the cylinders give you a little more bag for the buck!

Why is everyone buying the boxes instead of their cylinders? The reason why I ask is I still haven't made my sub purchase and probably won't be able to do so till the holidays, but when I do, I'm undecided between a SVS Pci 20-39 (or the Plus model), a SVS PB-12 ISD or ISD/V, and lastly, HSU VTF-3 MK 2 ....which happens to be reduced to $649 in the high gloss black

http://www.hsustore.com/vtf3.html

My room dimensions are 16 x 19 x 10, roughly 3000 cubic feet. My sitting area is 12 ft from the fronts and the sub will be place along the side wall (next to a fireplace) approx. 3 1/2 from the front right corner. HT 65 % Music 35%

What are you guys thoughts on these subs? And besides the cylinders looking like a Lynx cat scratch, are they really that bad of an appearance in a living room? (Maybe a better question for my wife..lol)..

 

[Daz3d&Confus3d]

Oh I forgot to mention, I like deep chest pounding bass! but price is a factor as well, I want to stay within the price range of these subs.

 

[Sheep]

I think the main reason is that the cheapest tuneable sv sub is a box, and that is a huge selling feature. Plus, Some people can't have a big tube in their house.

If I was buying i would get one of the dual driver box ones. I just love that sub(brian ) I'm basing this pruely on reviews, so im no expert on them. I just like how it looks, plus, the ultra is 190 pounds.


The Sheep

 

[Buckeyefan 1]

Mac liked the cylinders for music. I preferred the box overall for chest pounding, home theater bass. IMHO, the cylinders have a very different sound to them. Not bad, just different. (lack of resonance???)

 

[shokhead]

Got the water heater and belive me,its great for anything i throw at it. My 1K Klipsch never rattled the windows like this thing at almost half the price. Also some lay the cyl on its side which is fine.

 

[Rock&Roll Ninja]

I have a balck couch (BTW, don't ever buy black furniture unless its leather) and the fabric on the cylinder subwoofer matches it perfectly. Most people don't even notice it, partially because its mostly obscured by said couch.

But with the boxes you can have multiple drivers.....

 

[Duffinator]

Dazed, I have a similar room setup along with a 3805 and purchased the PB12-ISD over the summer. I'm quite happy with it and it was a significant improvement over my older Mirage 12" sub. For home theater it's added a new dimension to the sound that rumbles the room without being boomy at high SPL s. It did not add as much for music but still a nice improvement over what I had and makes my speakers sound better with two channel music. For the price it's probably hard to beat for HT. I don't like the looks of the cylinder subs so that was out from the get go. I would have preferred the Plus but the box was too big for my space and the ISD is significantly larger than my previous sub. I was also please with the quality of construction along with the service I received from SVS.

 

[QED]

FWIW, I prefer the appearence of the cylinder over the box...It just seems less intrusive.

I'm planning on getting the CS Ultra very soon.

I do however have a recurring nightmare that someone will set their beer atop it & it will spill down the ports

 

[Tomorrow]

Just a couple of thoughts....

Hsu is soon (!!) to release the VTF-HO that you may want to consider! (That may be why that VTF-3 is on sale. ) They also are returning to the cylinder design with their TN series.

I think if you're considering a tube, you might want to think about a separate amp with either the SVS or Hsu. Onboard (inboard) amps tend to somewhat spoil the sound design benefits of cylinder subs.

No matter which you get....you're gonna have some fun!

Happy hunting.

 

[shokhead]

Just a couple of thoughts....

Hsu is soon (!!) to release the VTF-HO that you may want to consider! (That may be why that VTF-3 is on sale. ) They also are returning to the cylinder design with their TN series.

I think if you're considering a tube, you might want to think about a separate amp with either the SVS or Hsu. Onboard (inboard) amps tend to somewhat spoil the sound design benefits of cylinder subs.


Come again?



No matter which you get....you're gonna have some fun!

Happy hunting.

Spoil the sound?

 

[mkossler]

If someone is foolish enough to set a beer on top of your SVS or Hsu cylinder while it is in service, trust me - you'll be cleaning beer from the ceiling, not from the port .

As for the sound difference that Buckeyefan cites, I for one don't hear hear it. I listen regularly to my 20-39, and to a friend's PB12-plus/2 - the essence and timbre of sound seems to be the same. I think my cylinder is a bit tighter, maybe. Then again, his two drivers will loosen your fillings at 100 paces.

In regard to the comment about plate amplifiers tending to spoil the sound benefits, I am curious as to your basis for the statement. Do you have either performance metrics or design specifications to support your assertion?

 

[Tomorrow]

In regard to the comment about plate amplifiers tending to spoil the sound benefits, I am curious as to your basis for the statement. Do you have either performance metrics or design specifications to support your assertion?

I have no supporting evidence. It was, in fact, only hearsay and should have been correctly stated as such. (Chris should be nailing me for this one!! ) My comment was the result of a design discussion on another a/v forum...and my buying the argument. The argument was basically that the presence of inboard equipment "spoiled" the sound signature of tube design...that is it impressed sonic distortion effects to what would otherwise be a clean waveguide. I also have no idea of the magnitude of the distortion (if any).

Thank you for correcting me, if this is indeed incorrect.

 

[mkossler]

rjbudz,

No biggie. To the best of my understanding, the SVS folks are careful to use an amplifier form factor that does not affect the internal profile of their powered cylinder subs. The cylinder walls are actually pretty thick, and those Class D plate amps are in turn pretty compact.

As for Hsu, I haven't the foggiest, but I can now say I have heard both, and it sure would be hard to not like what you hear

 

[QED]

If someone is foolish enough to set a beer on top of your SVS or Hsu cylinder while it is in service, trust me - you'll be cleaning beer from the ceiling, not from the port .

LOL

 

[Duffinator]

Here's a good article comparing SVS an HSU subs.

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htforum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=190398

 

[jaxvon]

One argument against the plate amps is simply the fact that your amp will last longer when it isn't mounted into the subwoofer enclosure. This is because it isn't exposed to the heat and vibration generated by the driver. And thus the reason why I think it's best to opt for a passive SVS if you have the option of getting the same thing in active or passive.

 

[mkossler]

An excellent point, jaxvon, and one I considered when I bought my sub. Cost and space considerations won the day. Of course, this factor has little-to-no bearing on the performance of the sub with respect to sound, which was the original point of debate .

It would likely be problematic, but beneficial, to establish if shortened life or reduced performance is a real risk of choosing powered subs. Subjective analysis of a single experience is pointless, since one could not know what the true root cause of some failure might be. We would need to trend the lifetime / acceptable performance of many subs of both kinds, and compare a good-sized sample set to see if any pattern emerges.

Well, I'm in - I'll let you know when mine fails.

 

[shokhead]

One argument against the plate amps is simply the fact that your amp will last longer when it isn't mounted into the subwoofer enclosure. This is because it isn't exposed to the heat and vibration generated by the driver. And thus the reason why I think it's best to opt for a passive SVS if you have the option of getting the same thing in active or passive.

Guess thats why maybe 90-95% of the subs are self amped?

 

[jaxvon]

Well, one easy way to see the problem is to compare a manufacturer's standard warranty on the woofer vs. plate amp.

Hsu: 7 Years on the woofer, 2 years on Electronics

Besides, anyone who works around electronics knows that heat and vibration kill circuits. Why do laptops fail so much more than desktops? [I know this for a fact, as I work in a computer repair shop]

I don't have any REAL statistical data, but I can say that judging by warranties AND from my experience with electronics, that it's best to not shove the amp into the sub cabinet if you can.

 

[Tomorrow]

It would be interesting if anyone had some insight as to why Dr. Hsu never made any tubes with the inboard amp. Surely he did some research on this very matter...?...

And Mkossler, I definitely am not looking for argument...only truth here. So let me turn your question around. Do you know of tests that show that inboard amps don't cause minimal amounts of distortion?

Finally, Jaxvon...excellent point. I hadn't thought of that. But again, we're looking at anecdotal evidence and intuitive logic. Chris is gonna come looking for hard data. (But you know, he's pretty deep into the technology/research aspects of this hobby. Perhaps he has input?)