Audioholics OOPS?

[sivadselim]

#3 is Audioholics recommendation(provided by another source) in the link this thread is about. In my case, and anyone else using mid-fi Yamaha, it is incorrect. The bass management needs to be set in the dvd player, as well as the receiver, for dvd-a/sacd playback using speakers that are not full range. This is assuming 6ch analog connection is made.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, but it is NOT incorrect.

Yes, you must bass manage the multichannel analog output of a universal player using the player's bass management settings because most receivers don't bass manage their multichannel inputs. But some will, though.

And if you use some outboard bass management device, like an ICBM, then you absolutely DO want to set the player's bass management settings to LARGE as you don't want any bass management at the player in that case; it's all done by the ICBM.

And you don't HAVE to use a digital connection for your DD/DTS if you already have the 6-channel analog connections from a universal player. I bass manage everything that comes from my player at my player; redbook CDs, DVD movies, SACD, and DVD-A.

 

[zumbo]

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, but it is NOT incorrect.

Yes, you must bass manage the multichannel analog output of a universal player using the player's bass management settings because most receivers don't bass manage their multichannel inputs. But some will, though.

And if you use some outboard bass management device, like an ICBM, then you absolutely DO want to set the player's bass management settings to LARGE as you don't want any bass management at the player in that case; it's all done by the ICBM.

And you don't HAVE to use a digital connection for your DD/DTS if you already have the 6-channel analog connections from a universal player. I bass manage everything that comes from my player at my player; redbook CDs, DVD movies, SACD, and DVD-A.

That is exactly what I am saying. I never meant to have a conversation about the ICBM. Have you read the link? It states NOT to use the bass management in the receiver AND dvd player together. I am saying you need TO use both. DVD player for 5.1 analog out, and receiver needs to be set to handle everything else.

http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/setup/avhardware/audiovideosetup.php
From the link.
"Bass Management: Large/Small speaker settings. Only one component should handle bass management. Receiver, DVD player or another specialty component such Outlaw’s ICBM. If another component is handling bass management set all speakers to large or turn off bass management.
S/PDIF: Use your DVD player’s digital audio output only (coax or optical). Do not use the RCA stereo output if you already have the digital output connected to the receiver."

All speakers do not need to be set to LARGE if they are not full range. That statement is what this thread is about. It states "only one". Forget about the ICBM.

 

[sivadselim]

Zumbo, I think you are over-reading or misinterpreting it. You don't use BOTH to bass manage SIMULTANEOUSLY. If you had a receiver that could bass manage it's multichannel inputs, you wouldn't want to bass manage in both places; you'd pick one or the other.

And even with the usual receiver that does not bass manage it's analog multichannel inputs, you still choose to either bass manage with your player OR your receiver depending upon your specific need and your specific preference for the particular media you are decoding at the time.

It's simple. The receiver's settings are not applied to the analog multichannel inputs, only the digital input. Likewise, the player's settings are not applied to it's digital output, only it's analog multichannel outputs.

Yes, absolutely, you can bass manage your digital connection with your receiver and your player's multichannel analog connection with the player. And even have completely different settings for each. But if you wish, you don't even HAVE to use the digital connection AT ALL if you have the 6-channel analog connection.

Sorry, I don't understand your complaint. The point is that you should (and in most cases CAN) only let ONE bass managing device bass manage any given media at any one time. You shouldn't bass manage something redundantly.

 

[gene]

Geez I can't believe this thread has gone on for so long.

The intent of that comment was to tell the reader to only apply bass management (BM) at one device. Most receivers don't have bass management on their EXT inputs, so in that case, use the DVD player's BM functions. In the case where the receiver can do BM in the analog domain, if the person chooses to use the receivers BM, then they should bypass the DVD players BM by setting all of the speakers to large. I hope this clears this up.

 

[zumbo]

Zumbo, I think you are over-reading or misinterpreting it. You don't use BOTH to bass manage SIMULTANEOUSLY. If you had a receiver that could bass manage it's multichannel inputs, you wouldn't want to bass manage in both places; you'd pick one or the other.

And even with the usual receiver that does not bass manage it's analog multichannel inputs, you still choose to either bass manage with your player OR your receiver depending upon your specific need and your specific preference for the particular media you are decoding at the time.

It's simple. The receiver's settings are not applied to the analog multichannel inputs, only the digital input. Likewise, the player's settings are not applied to it's digital output, only it's analog multichannel outputs.

Yes, absolutely, you can bass manage your digital connection with your receiver and your player's multichannel analog connection with the player. And even have completely different settings for each. But if you wish, you don't even HAVE to use the digital connection AT ALL if you have the 6-channel analog connection.

Sorry, I don't understand your complaint. The point is that you should (and in most cases CAN) only let ONE bass managing device bass manage any given media at any one time. You shouldn't bass manage something redundantly.

You must be a lawyer. First you say "You don't use BOTH to bass manage SIMULTANEOUSLY. "

And then you say "Yes, absolutely, you can bass manage your digital connection with your receiver and your player's multichannel analog connection with the player. And even have completely different settings for each."

Two different things. I agree with #2. That is it.

This is a simple thread pointing-out a simple thing.To playback dvd-a or sacd using bass management, it has to be set in the dvd player if the receiver bypasses BM with 6ch analog inputs. Most do.

You have confirmed this over and over. Why? I don't know. You are confirming my statements, and then in some way disagreeing at the same time.

 

[zumbo]

Geez I can't believe this thread has gone on for so long.

The intent of that comment was to tell the reader to only apply bass management (BM) at one device. Most receivers don't have bass management on their EXT inputs, so in that case, use the DVD player's BM functions. In the case where the receiver can do BM in the analog domain, if the person chooses to use the receivers BM, then they should bypass the DVD players BM by setting all of the speakers to large. I hope this clears this up.

I wish I could have worded it that easy.

Do you think you could put a notation in the set-up tips for people with dvd-a/sacd players? A person may get multi-channel hooked-up with 6ch analog, and assume the receiver's crossover and/or speaker size is set. Then kick-up the volume to get a nice plop from a speaker not intended to play fullrange.

I am trying to help keep that from happening, and delbertdumbutt is having a hard time agreeing with what he is agreeing with.

 

[zumbo]

But if you wish, you don't even HAVE to use the digital connection AT ALL if you have the 6-channel analog connection.

There is one problem with this in my situation. My receiver has MUCH better bass management than my player. So, if it's dvd, then I would want to use digital-out.

OTOH, if it is dvd-a, I HAVE TO use my players bass management because of the reasons I pointed-out. And, because of the reasons you listed as well. For some reason you felt it was necessary to repeat what I had said over-and-over. I guess you skimmed the thread. I can understand that. I have been guilty of that myself.

So, BOTH connections (digital and 6ch analog) are needed. And, BOTH components MUST have bass management set, if the receiver bypasses BM with 6ch analog inputs. Most do.

 

[j_garcia]

So, BOTH connections (digital and 6ch analog) are needed. And, BOTH components MUST have bass management set, if the receiver bypasses BM with 6ch analog inputs. Most do.

Yes, that's it in a nutshell. Mine bypasses for the m/c input (7CH INPUT is what it's called on mine).

 

[zumbo]

Yes, that's it in a nutshell. Mine bypasses for the m/c input (7CH INPUT is what it's called on mine).

That is what I have been trying to tell you this whole time. Glad to see you got it.

 

[sivadselim]

what an ***

 

[zumbo]

what an ***

I have spent days on this thread trying to get through to people to help them understand that BOTH components need to be set. Audioholics states "ONLY ONE". Then three of you decide to agree with me without agreeing. I could care less, and let all of you blow your speakers following the advice that was given in the link. But instead, I hung in there. That is not an ***.

There is a place for posting rude comments and calling names. It's called the Steam Vent.

 

[j_garcia]

That is what I have been trying to tell you this whole time. Glad to see you got it.

I know what you were trying to say, but I'm not sure you understood what I was trying to say. No need to continue on this one though, it just adds more to an issue that is not as complicated as this thread seems to be making it.

 

[zumbo]

Geez I can't believe this thread has gone on for so long.

The intent of that comment was to tell the reader to only apply bass management (BM) at one device. Most receivers don't have bass management on their EXT inputs, so in that case, use the DVD player's BM functions. In the case where the receiver can do BM in the analog domain, if the person chooses to use the receivers BM, then they should bypass the DVD players BM by setting all of the speakers to large. I hope this clears this up.

The more I think about it, the more this bothers me.

In the above statement, you again say "at one device". Then you say "Most receivers don't have bass management on their EXT inputs, so in that case, use the DVD player's BM functions." Most is the keyword here.

The second sentence is opposite of what you said in the first.

The bass management in a dvd player only applies to the multi-channel analog out.

The bass management in most receivers is bypassed using multi-channel analog in.

A correction needs to be made in yuns link I posted. Why is it soooo hard for this site to be corrected? I have seen many members find mistakes, and I have never once seen any of you say there was a mistake. That is not very cool. Your reply looks bad.

 

[shokhead]

I have looked through that manual 'til I am blue in the face. I don't see any m/c inputs.

OSM Input setup
ENT. In Sub Level
Its like a sub + or - level.

 

[zumbo]

OSM Input setup
ENT. In Sub Level
Its like a sub + or - level.

???
Multi-channel input.------FR-FL
-------------------------SR-SL
------------------------Sub-Cntr