Audio price hikes - Covid-19 or what?

Matthew J Poes

Matthew J Poes

Audioholic Chief
Staff member
My hunch is that electronic goods from China and the Far East will become virtually unobtainable soon, and get very expensive, probably 100% price rises before this is over. Quality and reliability are going to be king now, which will also drive prices, as I see a push to aviation and military specs for this sophisticated equipment too prone to failure.

In order to reopen western economies I see a forcing of return to home manufacture for multiple reasons.

We are just at the beginning of this round of price rises.
100% home manufacturing of consumer electronics would easily take ten plus years to achieve and require a massive importing of skilled labor. Everyone I have talked to has told me that won’t happen. There is no will to make it happen.

the more likely scenario is an expansion of other eastern Asian manufacturing outside China.

in America we have a number of barriers to returning CE manufacturing in full. We currently do not have the ability or capacity to take on the manufacture of the IC’s or beans and it’s not a simple task. We’ve never made many of them so it isn’t like restarting mothballed sites. It’s all new and the expertise all exists in China for the most part.

there was a push to start this with Foxcon but that seems to have failed. In fact, from what I’ve been told, then never intended to bring large scale manufacture of the electronics here. It would have been for some assembly work and R&D.

our labor costs are much higher, our environmental protections are much better, and our colleges are not setup for this kind of society. It all makes it hard to bring things back.

one other thing I was surprised to learn is that China essentially vertically integrated entire cities around the manufacturing and distribution of specific goods. So if an area makes a lot of the worlds smart phones, they optimize the entire city to support that effort. They have the most efficient logistics systems in the world. We don’t do that here, it isn’t how our economy works. I’m not advocating for a socialist or communist approach, but pointing out that in this case it is giving them an efficiency leg up. I think you could argue that the problem with this approach is that it’s not very lean. The moment things change you are stuck with an entire city and local society dedicated to doing something that is no longer useful. That would devastate the community.

I would love to see us restore some capacity to manufacture consumer electronics from Raw material to finished good. However to do that requires massive changes. We need to change how we educate our workforce and fundamentally change our trade schools. China and India are very good at this and it’s something we would need to look to in changing how we do things. It would have to be part of a public-private partnership to work.

I had some exchanges with the CTA and it was my impression that there was no real effort being made toward this goal. Nobody is lobbying for it. Nobody is trying to do it on their own. If anything, I just see a lot misleading or dishonest claims about American manufacturing. Many audio goods claimed to be made in America are basically a bunch of Chinese made guts and Chinese made chassis that are only final assembled here. There are exceptions but they are expensive and rare.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
I know what’s going on but I can’t talk about it.
I won't tell!
read my article on the impact of COVID-19 and I explains a lot of what is happening to the industry. Basically everything I said in that article has come to pass and worse and we aren’t even at the peak problem yet.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
100% home manufacturing of consumer electronics would easily take ten plus years to achieve and require a massive importing of skilled labor. Everyone I have talked to has told me that won’t happen. There is no will to make it happen.

the more likely scenario is an expansion of other eastern Asian manufacturing outside China.

in America we have a number of barriers to returning CE manufacturing in full. We currently do not have the ability or capacity to take on the manufacture of the IC’s or beans and it’s not a simple task. We’ve never made many of them so it isn’t like restarting mothballed sites. It’s all new and the expertise all exists in China for the most part.

there was a push to start this with Foxcon but that seems to have failed. In fact, from what I’ve been told, then never intended to bring large scale manufacture of the electronics here. It would have been for some assembly work and R&D.

our labor costs are much higher, our environmental protections are much better, and our colleges are not setup for this kind of society. It all makes it hard to bring things back.

one other thing I was surprised to learn is that China essentially vertically integrated entire cities around the manufacturing and distribution of specific goods. So if an area makes a lot of the worlds smart phones, they optimize the entire city to support that effort. They have the most efficient logistics systems in the world. We don’t do that here, it isn’t how our economy works. I’m not advocating for a socialist or communist approach, but pointing out that in this case it is giving them an efficiency leg up. I think you could argue that the problem with this approach is that it’s not very lean. The moment things change you are stuck with an entire city and local society dedicated to doing something that is no longer useful. That would devastate the community.

I would love to see us restore some capacity to manufacture consumer electronics from Raw material to finished good. However to do that requires massive changes. We need to change how we educate our workforce and fundamentally change our trade schools. China and India are very good at this and it’s something we would need to look to in changing how we do things. It would have to be part of a public-private partnership to work.

I had some exchanges with the CTA and it was my impression that there was no real effort being made toward this goal. Nobody is lobbying for it. Nobody is trying to do it on their own. If anything, I just see a lot misleading or dishonest claims about American manufacturing. Many audio goods claimed to be made in America are basically a bunch of Chinese made guts and Chinese made chassis that are only final assembled here. There are exceptions but they are expensive and rare.
I think you will be surprised by the number of IC factories in the USA!

There are at least 4 in Austin, a couple more in San Antonio and DFW. Arizona has a few, upstate NY is a hot bed, Utah, Idaho, not to mention silicon valley.

You underestimate the domestic chip production volume!

EDIT:
Click the link and sort by location!
 
Matthew J Poes

Matthew J Poes

Audioholic Chief
Staff member
I think you will be surprised by the number of IC factories in the USA!

There are at least 4 in Austin, a couple more in San Antonio and DFW. Arizona has a few, upstate NY is a hot bed, Utah, Idaho, not to mention silicon valley.

You underestimate the domestic chip production volume!

EDIT:
Click the link and sort by location!
Almost all of those companies make advanced computer chips, advanced sensors, etc. I don’t believe any of them make beans. There are very few advanced parts used in home audio equipment.

also their capacity is very low compared to China.

the people who would make these decisions are the people I talk too. Many would happily use american manufacturing for parts. They tell me almost none exists and no extra capacity exists to take on the effort.

also in looking at that list, a few I am personally familiar with are not really manufacturing facilities. They are R&D plants and can only fabricate very small quantities. They primarily develop parts that are scaled in China or used by military contractors. In fact I’ve been told the limited American semiconductor manufacturing is largely supporting mission critical production. Things like medical, military, aerospacE.

that list you link makes clear that China has more capacity in 5 plants than the entire USA. That’s the issue. The plants we do have make mostly higher tech stuff.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
Almost all of those companies make advanced computer chips, advanced sensors, etc. I don’t believe any of them make beans. There are very few advanced parts used in home audio equipment.

also their capacity is very low compared to China.

the people who would make these decisions are the people I talk too. Many would happily use american manufacturing for parts. They tell me almost none exists and no extra capacity exists to take on the effort.

also in looking at that list, a few I am personally familiar with are not really manufacturing facilities. They are R&D plants and can only fabricate very small quantities. They primarily develop parts that are scaled in China or used by military contractors. In fact I’ve been told the limited American semiconductor manufacturing is largely supporting mission critical production. Things like medical, military, aerospacE.

that list you link makes clear that China has more capacity in 5 plants than the entire USA. That’s the issue. The plants we do have make mostly higher tech stuff.
The vast majority of automotive chips are produced in the USA. Many accelerometers and other sensors too.

I'm not saying that the USA is the hotbed for semiconductors, but there is much more semiconductor mfg domestically than most people realize.
 
Speedskater

Speedskater

Audioholic General
Edsel Murphy (RIP) must have a law about one part for which no substitutes exist.
 
Matthew J Poes

Matthew J Poes

Audioholic Chief
Staff member
The vast majority of automotive chips are produced in the USA. Many accelerometers and other sensors too.

I'm not saying that the USA is the hotbed for semiconductors, but there is much more semiconductor mfg domestically than most people realize.
I think you are really proving my point. That isn’t what is used in audio equipment. It’s the SMD capacitors, resistors, opamps, transistors, dac chips, etc. As far as I know those are all almost exclusively made in China anymore.

I believe automotive is considered mission critical.
 
Matthew J Poes

Matthew J Poes

Audioholic Chief
Staff member
Edsel Murphy (RIP) must have a law about one part for which no substitutes exist.
thats actually One of the problems in the CE industry right now. Certain types of parts are not available and can’t be replaced without a redesign. Whole capacitors and resistors are in short supply you can still get them. Just maybe not the exact brand you want. Opamps often have equivalent replacements but because certain types are liked for their performance, drop in replacements can degrade performance. So if they become unavailable you have to wait and the product is held up. DSP chips are one of a kind. You design around the chip. If it’s not available you are hosed. PGA’s are common in high end equipment and if they become unavailable it would be no different than if a dac or DSP chip.

this is actually what’s causing many of the product delays right now. It is also why some new products have been delayed or canceled.
 
K

Kleinst

Senior Audioholic
You know it seems like the used market is a little bare too. Makes sense if people can’t upgrade new they aren’t passing along their stuff. I want to get another Rythmik but they are rare to find used. I got lucky earlier this month and love it.

Glad I got in on a good deal on JBL 590s too.

but not as manygood used amps on craigslist or eBay.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
I think you are really proving my point. That isn’t what is used in audio equipment. It’s the SMD capacitors, resistors, opamps, transistors, dac chips, etc. As far as I know those are all almost exclusively made in China anymore.

I believe automotive is considered mission critical.
Gotcha! Yup, you are correct on the point of caps, resistors, general SMDs, etc.
 
Kvn_Walker

Kvn_Walker

Audioholic Field Marshall
I know that some of the home exercise equipment companies have been doing very well!
Until they run out of stock...

I'm selling my rower for a good clip more than I paid for it. Waiting for the auction to end next week, but the highest bid is already 50% more than purchase price. I've gotten offers for almost double, but ebay rules won't let me put "buy it now" back in.

No one can buy that model from the manufacturer right now, which is why used ones are worth so much. I wonder what else I could offload for some spare change to help with moving this summer.
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
I can attest to that as I recently bought 2 treadmills for my house. :D
Two ... so it doesn't take too much effort to get to a treadmill when you need exercise, right?! :p

Or are you working up a new Karaoke routine!?
 
Last edited:
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
I wonder what else I could offload for some spare change to help with moving this summer.
Freezers are in high demand with the concerns about meat/food supply issues!
I think the really big ones are still available, but if you want one in the 4-7 cu.ft. (typically $250 - $500) range, you can't walk out of a big box store with one these days!
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Two ... so it doesn't take too much effort to get to a treadmill when you need exercise, right?! :p

Or are you working up a new Karaoke routine!?
Well, I bought one treadmill for the study room. I play the Wii - table tennis game - while running on the treadmill! :D

But my wife wanted another treadmill in our Master Bedroom for her to use while watching Netflix. So how can I refuse the chance to SPEND MONEY? :D
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I spoke with a speaker distributor around the first week of April and they said they were not moving much product. I suspect that is a reflection of the awareness of loss of income.
That was early on and I think there probably has since been some thought about how to improve the "shelter at home" experience. I know that some of the home exercise equipment companies have been doing very well!
Agreed, until people get their jobs back, they are not going to spend on non essential items so demand drops, while manufacturers cut back on production due to cities lock down or stay at home orders. That means production cost is up, while supply and demands are both down. So the overall supply/demand balance is more or less maintained, net result is a moderate price increase due to increased production cost and probably shipping cost too.
 

Latest posts

newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top