Apple sources into integrated amps.

[Craig klomparens]

It might and it might not be. However using a sub without proper bass management is difficult to predict. It all comes down to a lot of luck then. At least the Yamaha does have a sub line out but no means to cut the bass out of the bookshelves. Then it all depends on your listening habits. Bass management off loads the bass driver in small speaker. If your volume demands are moderate then this is not an issue as a rule.

The motor system in the SEAS Excel driver in the Salk speaker is going to be by far the most capable of all the drivers in the speakers under consideration.

If you want full bass management, then receivers offer it. However even more flexible is to have a separate pre and power amp and then interpose an electronic crossover between the pre amp and power amp. This will probably get you over budget.

If you want to keep it simple then use speakers with a good enough bass response that a sub is not essential.

Unless you like high volumes, play a lot of pipe organ music or a diet of rock music, then you will be fine without a sub.

If you are planning to use the system for a lot of movie watching, then getting a device with proper bass management and dedicated LFE output, would be best.

So to really answer your question then you need to advise us on how loud you intend to play the rig, and what you intend to play through it.

Having been an audio only guy for fifty years and then really getting into AV 10 years ago, I have to say I really like the marriage of good audio and video. I now think that pretty much all systems should now be AV.

Having said that, it does mean that you have to approach audio in a somewhat different fashion then we did prior to the AV revolution. This revolution has changed the demands and expectations of the audio part of the system.

This thread has caused me to take a step back which is a good thing.

To respond to a few things above.

I'm not a high volume rock n roller at this stage in my life but I do listen to the blues a bit.

I might pair the power source to one of the speakers suggested above. I've never heard any of them.

I am mostly interested in music and thought a 2 channel (perhaps with a sub) with an integrated amp would be best. In my day the receivers did lots of more things but most of the time did not do the basic things as well as an amp (integrated or not.) I doubt I will go beyond 2.1 so why, I thought, have a receiver with so many channels and stuff? That was my thinking. It will be used with a TV as well but that is the secondary consideration. I do watch a lot of movies but they are typically not high action thrillers with all the special effects. Most are older, even black and white! Dialog, and background music are important, but I am not listening to the Empire Striking Back very often.

Space and my wife will not allow floor standing speakers (the easy answer to full bass response.)

The simple thing is to have systems in front of you and listen, but where I live this is not going to happen.
I'm putting this together deaf and dumb!

I thought about separates and looked at stuff like Outlaw and Emotiva (which came up in my searches) but I'd like to try to keep it simpler than that if possible.

The Salk speakers mentioned above win on looks alone (lol)! At 83 db I would think I need a step up to drive them.


Thanks all.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

I would pass on the AirPort Express- it's old and what Apple calls a 'legacy' product and they no longer have any updates for it. Also, it doesn't work well with the newer operating systems, like Win7 and above. I would recommend the AppleTV if the equipment will be near an AV system so it can perform double duty. While it doesn't have an analog output, it's easier to use, works with networks above 802.11g and the last version is selling for $69 now.

True, the cheap airport express model I had linked is indeed limited to only 54Mbps wifi, but you only going to need about 1 or 2 Mpbs for audio streaming anyways. Why get ferrari for getting groceries?
Is it legacy product without ongoing support? True, but there is no evidence that it won't work out of the box and price (for me $10 throwaway is not big deal)
You could always opt for x10 the price, latest Apple's AirPort express model - which is much faster, supports all bells and whistles and possibly waste of money, but hey - it's not legacy

Win7 support?? Sorry - Not following you here. The OP's goal to stream from iPad/iphone using Apple's own Airplay . Last i checked Airplay is not native to windows. I can only guess you refer Apple configuration software won't work on newer windows versions?? I guess if OP has Mac at home - it shouldn't be an issue.

AppleTV is great device and a solid candidate for AirPlay receiver, However not only it's lacking analog port - it's also lacking any other port other than HDMI and given audio only centric system running on Integ Amp - makes it wrong choice.

 

[highfigh]

True, the cheap airport express model I had linked is indeed limited to only 54Mbps wifi, but you only going to need about 1 or 2 Mpbs for audio streaming anyways. Why get ferrari for getting groceries?
Is it legacy product without ongoing support? True, but there is no evidence that it won't work out of the box and price (for me $10 throwaway is not big deal)
You could always opt for x10 the price, latest Apple's AirPort express model - which is much faster, supports all bells and whistles and possibly waste of money, but hey - it's not legacy

Win7 support?? Sorry - Not following you here. The OP's goal to stream from iPad/iphone using Apple's own Airplay . Last i checked Airplay is not native to windows. I can only guess you refer Apple configuration software won't work on newer windows versions?? I guess if OP has Mac at home - it shouldn't be an issue.

AppleTV is great device and a solid candidate for AirPlay receiver, However not only it's lacking analog port - it's also lacking any other port other than HDMI and given audio only centric system running on Integ Amp - makes it wrong choice.

Why would you NOT go for groceries in a Ferrari?

AirPort Express is $10? Really? Wow.

It's not the speed that makes me use the newer units, but I understand your point.

Sorry- I remembered the problem's details incorrectly. I have an AirPort Express that had been used for streaming music to an AVR that didn't have AirPlay and I was trying to set it up on a different network (mine). It didn't work, at all. I called AppleCare and was told that it's too old to work with the changes to AirPort Utility that have come since the newer models were introduced. I was on another project site and the AirPOrt Express that had been used for music was at least one update behind and it won't work at all with the latest, so I removed it- it's no longer needed and I think it was messing with the WiFi.

The OP wants to use AirPlay, but it still has to be set up by using a computer that can't revert to an older version of AirPOrt Utility.

Also, AppleTV has an optical port.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Why would you NOT go for groceries in a Ferrari?

AirPort Express is $10? Really? Wow.

Sorry, not $10 - only $8.5 - see ebay link earlier.

Also, AppleTV has an optical port.

http://www.macworld.com/article/2983252/home-audio/apple-tv-drops-optical-audio-out-how-to-pump-up-the-volume-again.html

 

[Seth=L]

This thread has caused me to take a step back which is a good thing.

Good, all too often I see folks leap headfirst into audio without any prior knowledge or they've been out of the circle for so long they may as well have no prior knowledge. They fall prey to the seemingly earnest salesman and end up putting their money in all the wrong places.

I'm not a high volume rock n roller at this stage in my life but I do listen to the blues a bit.

That is good for you, especially since you're considering inefficient bookshelf speakers. Speakers like the Salk TLS mentioned sacrifice efficiency for extension.

I might pair the power source to one of the speakers suggested above. I've never heard any of them.

Buying speakers blind is difficult to do, no doubting that. However, the amount of true hi-fidelity stores around the US is dwindling. It can even be hard to determine what's what in one of the Hi-Fi brick and mortar stores because of how their equipment is arranged.

I am mostly interested in music and thought a 2 channel (perhaps with a sub) with an integrated amp would be best. In my day the receivers did lots of more things but most of the time did not do the basic things as well as an amp (integrated or not.)

Economies of scale have changed the tide. It's is not only more economical to go with a multi-channel AV receiver over stereo receivers, but they also most often offer higher performance per dollar.

I doubt I will go beyond 2.1 so why, I thought, have a receiver with so many channels and stuff? That was my thinking. It will be used with a TV as well but that is the secondary consideration.

Considering the above, you might as well go with an AV receiver anyway, just in case.

Space and my wife will not allow floor standing speakers (the easy answer to full bass response.)

Better quality is almost always had by getting similar cost bookshelf / standmount speakers alternative to floor standing varieties.

The simple thing is to have systems in front of you and listen, but where I live this is not going to happen.
I'm putting this together deaf and dumb!

Which is why we turn to the known best values in speakers for recommendations. Chances are if you chose any of BSA's recommendations you'd be smitten with them.

I thought about separates and looked at stuff like Outlaw and Emotiva (which came up in my searches) but I'd like to try to keep it simpler than that if possible.

I'd say get something like the Marantz SR-5009. It's got plenty of power for any of the speakers BSA recommended. It has preouts so if you really do need extra power you can get a bigger amp (wouldn't be necessary with any of BSAs recommendations however). It has Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, host of HDMI connectivity, very intuitive bass management, and plenty more that you won't necessarily need right now but could later. And remember, just because it has all these features does not make it lesser quality than an integrated amplifier of the same price. In fact it's most likely superior to any integrated amplifier at this price because of economies of scale. Having more features is not a detriment to the simplicity of daily operation either. The auto setup features of these units make getting it up and running easier than it ever was in the past.

http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/marsr5009/marantz-sr5009-7.2ch-100wpc-4k-receiver-wi-fi/bt/airplay-sale-reduced-70/1.html

The Salk speakers mentioned above win on looks alone (lol)! At 83 db I would think I need a step up to drive them.

The above receiver will handle them with gusto.

 

[TLS Guy]

Seth, I agree with everything you have to say.

It seems this is going to be an AV system.

Frankly it is awkward to use gear with no HDMI now if you are doing any significant video. I know, I have one system that is built round a two channel preamp, a crossover for the subs and a power amp. It uses and HDMI switch. However my wife does get in a tangle with that one.

She is much more at home in the big AV studio and the system I set up at Eagan. The reason is simple, as they both use AV pre pros so there are no awkward workarounds.

I'm glad we have the OPs ear and he is listening and has not bought a bunch of gear that is not right for him.

The OP definitely will be better off with an AV receiver. His wife will be happier, and actually may want to box his ears if he has an awkward system with an audio integrated amp and no HDMI.

This guy absolutely needs an AV receiver, a decent pair of bookshelves and a sub.
.
There in now no doubt in my mind that original equipment he specked will not meet his needs

 

[highfigh]

Sorry, not $10 - only $8.5 - see link earlier.


http://www.macworld.com/article/2983252/home-audio/apple-tv-drops-optical-audio-out-how-to-pump-up-the-volume-again.html

The old AppleTV is $69 and that's the one I was referring to. They're still very available an that's what I would use.

 

[Craig klomparens]

Thanks Everyone. I've looked around a bit for a couple days. It looks like the Marantz SR 5009 receiver suggested above at $430, which is a lot less than I thought I'd spend, and the Ascend Sierra 2s, which are a bit more.

I'm already looking at subs, but want to hear the S2s first. It will be a few days before I pull the trigger so if anyone has any ideas or comments re above or a sub it's appreciated.

Cheers,

 

[Seth=L]

Thanks Everyone. I've looked around a bit for a couple days. It looks like the Marantz SR 5009 receiver suggested above at $430, which is a lot less than I thought I'd spend, and the Ascend Sierra 2s, which are a bit more.

I'm already looking at subs, but want to hear the S2s first. It will be a few days before I pull the trigger so if anyone has any ideas or comments re above or a sub it's appreciated.

Cheers,

I know you didn't intend to spend as much on the speakers, but I gotta tell you that money is far better spent on speakers than on everything else. After purchasing those two, what does that leave you with budget wise?

 

[Craig klomparens]

Well, I've looked around a little and seen some subs from Ascend, Hue, SVS and others in the $700 and less range. Hoping that will do the trick. That leaves me $900 for Audio Quest wire!!

I also looked at the Philharmonic 3 way "BMR" speaker that is the the same price as the Sierra 2s.
Might as well just flip a coin.

 

[Seth=L]

Well, I've looked around a little and seen some subs from Ascend, Hue, SVS and others in the $700 and less range. Hoping that will do the trick. That leaves me $900 for Audio Quest wire!!

I also looked at the Philharmonic 3 way "BMR" speaker that is the the same price as the Sierra 2s.
Might as well just flip a coin.

I think you mean HSU. I've eyed this one myself.

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/uls-15mk2.html

Why stop at $900 for AudioQuest wire? They have an HDMI cable for about $13k.

 

[highfigh]

I think you mean HSU. I've eyed this one myself.

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/uls-15mk2.html

Why stop at $900 for AudioQuest wire? They have an HDMI cable for about $13k.

Why stop at $13K when Synergistic Research has cables that cost far more?

 

[Seth=L]

Why stop at $13K when Synergistic Research has cables that cost far more?

I'm not made of money, yeesh.