Amplifier placement, power cables - truth or myths?

[drumace]

Hi,
I'm seeing a lot of audiophiles investing a fortune on amplifier (and other audio equipment) placement on expensive stands and on "high-end" power cables.
From my understanding, amps have no moving parts so why would an amp sound different on different stands or just putting it on the floor?
Also, I can't understand why would an amp sound better when used with expensive power cable? After all, the AC signal on it is converted to DC anyway...

Please explain

Thanks!

 

[Irvrobinson]

Power cables only need to be of sufficient gauge. Everything else is BS; the power cord that came with the amp is almost always sufficient. If you need a longer length, 12 or 14 gauge cable you buy at Home Depot is more than good enough.

Amp stands have no effect on sound quality whatsoever, but they can be very useful for protecting the amp from damage from vacuum cleaners and accidental kicks. If you have a carpeted floor amp stands can also improve cooling. I use an amp stand for these reasons.

 

[ImcLoud]

What Irv says is true, BUT keep this in mind, a guy spends $15K on an amp $25K on speakers, whats another $5K for cables and stands.... sure a system will sound the same with pyle brand wire strung along the back of the speakers, and the electronics sitting on a plastic milk crate, but add some cloth covered cables and 4" thick black walnut amp stands and it feels like it looks rite... Its all for the experience, I personally wont spend a TON of money on stands {mine are hand made from 1" woodstock" nothing fancy} but I see where this type of gear fits in the hobby...

 

[ski2xblack]

Drumace, the home audio marketplace is about the only place such claims [the wire nonsense] are given credence. To me that says a bit about the marketplace, and those catering to it, but very little about the technical merits of the various stuff you mention. Check the sources of such claims and apply some basic academic research standards to them and you'll separate the wheat from the chaff.

I've bought stands from A and M Fabrication, great transaction all around, I feel they're worth a recommendation. American made by a small mom and pop shop, the products are nicely finished and understated, and outrageously inexpensive compared to typical stands out there.

 

[Irvrobinson]

I use a Billy Bags amp stand. You can do a search to find them. They're nothing fancy, but they do the job.

 

[MidnightSensi2]

I think previous posters have explained the answer well.

As far as the 'why do these myths exist' .. I think some of it comes from the days where record players needed isolation in larger systems (the vibrations would cause the needle to 'skate,' or, at its worst, 'bounce.' The fancy cables are an aestetics thing, but also come from the understanding of how electricity can be induced into a wire - hence heavy shielding or using balanced connections (which is helpful with high sensitivity speakers and/or those with long runs - generally not applicable to home theater).

Real world? The suggestions made by our fellow audioholics above.

 

[ImcLoud]

I use a Billy Bags amp stand. You can do a search to find them. They're nothing fancy, but they do the job.

I love them stands, but they are expensive.. Even the small 1 layer amp stand is around $300 if I remember correctly... I like VTi stands for cost effectiveness,,, Amazon.com - BL404 Additional Shelf - 9" High Shelves: Cherry, Poles/Caps: Black Poles/Silver Caps - Home Speaker Stands

 

[MidnightSensi2]

I love them stands, but they are expensive.. Even the small 1 layer amp stand is around $300 if I remember correctly... I like VTi stands for cost effectiveness,,, Amazon.com - BL404 Additional Shelf - 9" High Shelves: Cherry, Poles/Caps: Black Poles/Silver Caps - Home Speaker Stands

Nice find!

 

[Irvrobinson]

I love them stands, but they are expensive.. Even the small 1 layer amp stand is around $300 if I remember correctly.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you think everything I buy, audio-wise, is too expensive. Quality costs.

 

[j_garcia]

The only problem with the VTIs is the thin shelves. Its fine for typical components, but really heavy amps and you might have a problem. I know, I have the rest of that VTI rack

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Yeah, I'm not putting $15,000-$20,000 worth of electronics on the floor or cheap stands.

Good quality stands will also have good air ventilation for the expensive electronics.

Expensive power cords are just silly, though. I can see the point if someone were a billionaire and just bored and wanted to spend frivolously. But not for the rest of us.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

The only problem with the VTIs is the thin shelves. Its fine for typical components, but really heavy amps and you might have a problem. I know, I have the rest of that VTI rack

My VTI BLG-404 glass shelves are tempered 10mm thick and support up to 300lbs. I've ordered custom-made glass before. The VTI glass is about as thick as they will make. They support my ATI AT3000 & AT2000 amps just fine.

http://www.vtimanufacturing.com/product_category/audio-video-rack-blg-series/

 

[j_garcia]

My VTI BLG-404 glass shelves are tempered 10mm thick and support up to 300lbs. I've ordered custom-made glass before. The VTI glass is about as thick as they will make. They support my ATI AT3000 & AT2000 amps just fine.

BLG Series - VTI Manufacturing

Mine aren't glass, because I don't like glass shelves.

 

[MidnightSensi2]

If I was going to stack, I'd get a rack. But, I'm weird.

I think amps look cool floor level like the smug Stereophile-esque setups. Like have those suckers to the right and left of the pre-processor sort of thing.

 

[ImcLoud]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you think everything I buy, audio-wise, is too expensive. Quality costs.

I am cheap, If I had your money I would burn mine, Irv...

I have a glass vti under my mono blocks and preamp... I bought it on ebay for $70!!!

Made this one, hard maple and black walnut....

These also made, I think it was oak and stained it rosewood... I also have a 1/2" thick piece of glass ontop of it now... They will make it for you, onedayglass.com tempered up to 1/2' it is super thick, very heavy..

yes I made cable lifts too.. so what...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Mine aren't glass, because I don't like glass shelves.

Oh, I see. The BL series (wood) isn't as thick as the glass (BLS) shelves. Looks like the wood shelves are rated for 200 lbs vs 300 lbs of the glass shelves.

But 200lbs is still pretty good.

 

[Ampdog]

Just a few extra cents from me: I find that most if not all myths come from intuitive conceptions. "No component is perfect thus all components must degrade the sound", "thicker cables, fewer losses", and the very convinving "it stands to reason, doesn't it!" (difficult to argue with that one). And, not to be unkind but certainly not least, the promotional blab written by .... well, certainly not a technical guy.

Maketh product, must maketh money, must laudeth product .... and I am sad to say (but no alternative left to anybody with the least savvy of how electricity works): Simple blatant profit making by misleading claims with little/no regard for scientific truth.

Perhaps not to post this - but there, I have pressed the 'post' key ....


PS: I am certainly not dissing the beautiful products pictured above - but they were all chosen for the right reasons; not to achieve some magical über-audio potion.

 

[herbu]

and the very convinving "it stands to reason, doesn't it!" (difficult to argue with that one)

I used to have a boss that liked to say, "Anybody with half a brain would know that XXX. What do you think?"
One day he did it to me in a meeting w/ the plant mgr. "Anybody with half a brain would know that XXX. What do you think, Herb?"
I replied, "You're right Ed. Anybody with half a brain would know that XXX. But anybody with a whole brain would realize that YYY."
The plant mgr howled... my boss, not so much.

One could debate whether it helped or hurt my career.