MKSound Loudspeakers are Back in Black!

[davef]

Dave your quite a knowledgeable and classy person. Thanks for adding this useful commentary about M&K. I was a big fan of their older products back in the day and glad to see another legitimately great high end speaker company back in the game!

Thanks Gene! I can say with complete confidence that there are, perhaps, no more than 5 people that know M&K products as well or better than I.

I still have an original pair of S-150s, having turned down some impressive offers for them.

It would be fun and informative to compare the M&K S-150s to the MK Sound S-150's from a purely technical standpoint as I am quite curious about the products the new company is manufacturing. Ken Kreisel has an astounding ear that could never be replaced.

 

[MK_SOUND]

Thanks Gene! I can say with complete confidence that there are, perhaps, no more than 5 people that know M&K products as well or better than I.

I still have an original pair of S-150s, having turned down some impressive offers for them.

It would be fun and informative to compare the M&K S-150s to the MK Sound S-150's from a purely technical standpoint as I am quite curious about the products the new company is manufacturing. Ken Kreisel has an astounding ear that could never be replaced.

Dave, it's good to hear that you have turned down offers on your S-150s. It's a sign that they have real value to you, which is a good thing! Regarding the M&K S-150 and MK Sound S150 (old version), these are virtually identical in performance. The drivers have changed a bit due to technologies and materials used by Peerless, but are technically and audibly a match. The biggest difference will be in the cabinet construction and finish, which honestly is better in the MK Sound S-150. However, the big test for you to conduct would be the difference between the M&K S-150 and the new MK Sound S-150MKII. I have done my listening and technical tests, but I would be more interested to hear what others have to say, including some reviewers, which will be happening soon.

Aldo

 

[johndbasssman]

Comparing Davef's old S150's to the new S150's per Aldo

I would love to see the graphical results (screenshot) of Dave's M&K Sound S150's vs the newest version of the MK Sound. As a matter of fact, being the pain in the, well, you know what, that I have been come to be known and despised for, I am going to pass this along to those who I'm sure will find this interesting. You see, I believe when the engineers who designed these in the first place left the company, that was the end in my opinion as I believe they were and are the best.

 

[johndbasssman]

One more thing

I would like to add that I totally agree with Davef's comment "Ken Kreisel has an astounding ear that could never be replaced" as he is the definition of "Golden Ear" not to mention his engineering and releasing some of the most highly acclaimed and spectacular direct-to-disc LP's, which are still considered by the world's audiophiles to be some of the best sounding LP's ever recorded. For more information, check out his website and especially the "Timeline" at kkprofessionalsound*com. The sub-woofers with the combined efforts of the M&K Engineers and Eminence Engineers under the guiding ears of the audio guru, Ken Kreisel, created the "Discover Deep Bass". Those were awesome days indeed. I've personally never heard bass like that and haven't since. For more detailed information, check out patent 5537479 "Dual-driver bass speaker with acoustic reduction of out-of-phase and electronic reduction of in-phase distortion harmonics" issued July 16, 1996 by inventors Ken Kreisel and the late, great Dr. Lester M. Field issued to Miller and Kreisel Sound Corp. (Culver City, CA). Now, all of the major sound re-enforcement manufacturers use this design. That can be viewed in full at the United States Patent and Trademark Office at patft*uspto*gov and under "PatFT: Patents" chose "Quick Search" and type in 5537479 in the "Term 1" text box. Scroll down to #13 and your good to go. Pretty fascinating and educating stuff.

By the way, a 1998 Supplier Loyalty Test on Home Audio/Speakers (inside-track-online*com) Resolution of Service, Return, Repair Issues, M&K Sound rated #5 out of all the speaker manufacturers.

 

[AthruC]

First time poster here, but long time listener!

I am truly excited to see MK Sound directly reaching out and dispelling some of the rumors that have started to accumulate in their seeming "absence." It seems that there is an almost "cult" following of both KK and the original M&K lines, and there definitely is an opportunity for MK Sound to capitalize on.

On that note, I was curious whether MK Sound had any plans on offering some sort of support for "legacy" products, or growing an accessory line to support former and current models. I would imagine there is a market for speaker stands that could support both former and current S150 speakers (or similar), replacement or upgraded tweeters that could be used with older S150 models, etc. I think that would be an amazing way to support loyal fans and help warm them up to the new MK Sound.

 

[Dwfuk]

History?

Please do excuse the first post, but this is something I've been wanting to ask for a while now, so I'd like to ask Aldo this question:

MK Sound were started in 2008, so can I ask why are you showing a Miller & Kreisel timeline going back to 1973, and claiming (as MK rather than M&K), all those awards, products, and firsts, including a 35th anniversary in 2009?

Regards

 

[BADDMO4]

New mk sound service is horrible!!!!

I have a original and real M&K MX350 sub which needed new drivers. I contacted the new MK Sound directly. I dealt with Aldo Filippelli and Gert Christensen. They advised me MK Sound could not help me secure replacement drivers for my sub, they only supply replacements for new MK Sound subs. They left me out to dry. I found help in the only M&K professional, Ken Kreisel himself!!!!! He helped me diagnos problem and recommended soulution. I was able to obtain real M&K (new in box) drivers from a seller on Ebay. My sub sounds incredible. This is a testament to Ken Kreisel and his superb customer service. I only ask that any of you in the market for a sub to dismiss MK Sound as a option. Wait for Ken Kreisel's new subs that are to launch in 2012. You will never have a problem with Ken Kreisel the real genius behind M&K not the new imposters!

 

[zumbo]

I doubt you would post such without it being fact. I take it personal when I spend my hard earned money on something, and a company don't back their products up.

Well done.

 

[BADDMO4]

New mk sound service is horrible!!!!

Zumbo,

Ken Kreisel even helped me calibrate my MX350 and S150 system (via Email). Ken Kreisel still supports his product even though he doesnt have to. Who still offers customer service at this level. Would Bill Gates or the late Steve Jobs have responded to a client personally or have been so helpful? Ken Kreisel even offered to help me secure some of his new repalcement drivers if I couldn't secure original M&K. Ken Kreisel is truly a class act. This will be exemplified in his new endeavor.

 

[zumbo]

Zumbo,

Ken Kreisel even helped me calibrate my MX350 and S150 system (via Email). Ken Kreisel still supports his product even though he doesnt have to. Who still offers customer service at this level.

My personal experience with German Maestro, formerly MB Quart. These folks will go out of their way to service MB Quart products of the past, or provide replacement drivers. Not only that, I have personal numbers to top US associates within the company. What company lets you personally contact lead players?

And this isn't some company that just slaps someone else's drivers in a box, and calls it theirs. It's all in house driver design, built by German Maestro, with the upper-end drivers being hand built in the German factory.

 

[MK_SOUND]

I have a original and real M&K MX350 sub which needed new drivers. I contacted the new MK Sound directly. I dealt with Aldo Filippelli and Gert Christensen. They advised me MK Sound could not help me secure replacement drivers for my sub, they only supply replacements for new MK Sound subs. They left me out to dry. I found help in the only M&K professional, Ken Kreisel himself!!!!! He helped me diagnos problem and recommended soulution. I was able to obtain real M&K (new in box) drivers from a seller on Ebay. My sub sounds incredible. This is a testament to Ken Kreisel and his superb customer service. I only ask that any of you in the market for a sub to dismiss MK Sound as a option. Wait for Ken Kreisel's new subs that are to launch in 2012. You will never have a problem with Ken Kreisel the real genius behind M&K not the new imposters!

Unfortunately when M&K closed their doors in 2007, there were no spare parts, schematics, or service related items left to support the old products, and 90% of the old M&K vendors are either out of business or are no longer producing components that would work as suitable direct replacements. Speakers produced before 2005 are not under warranty and 95% of the replacement parts are not available; however, MK is willing to try to do whatever they can to assist with service and support, even if recommending a speaker reconing company or local service technician for the electronics, which was most likely shared with you when you contacted the company.

Ken is a good guy and I am happy to hear that he was able to help you with your old M&K product, and as you had stated, you were fortunate enough to find original replacement drivers on ebay, which were old production units that are no longer produced by the vendor/manufacturer of the drivers. we have contacted ALL of the old vendors that sold parts to M&K and of the many different companies that M&K purchased various parts from, only two of them had "any" level of stock of old components, which we have purchased and have been selling to those in need of such. Of course, we can contract companies today to produce drivers to the old specs and material standards, but since technology and production have changed much over the years, this would be an impractical and costly solution for everyone involved. Driver reconing is inexpensive and works well, as does repairing the old amplifiers when needed. Therefore there are solutions which are easily possible and which we recommend if we do not have the parts available.

I can share with you that I have a 9 year old GE Profile Signature refrigerator that cost $4,000 at the time. A motor in thye unit failed and I called service techs and searched high and low for a replacement part. None are available. I even called GE and spoke with their service manager and was explained that there is no cross reference part and nothing else that will work, and without it the expensive refrigerator is useless. I absolutely had no other choice but to purchase a new refrigerator. yes, i did purchase another GE Profile. Why, because it is a good unit that fits into the space perfectly (custom installed). It wasn't GE's fault that the manufacturer of the motor went out of business and no replacement parts are available. The situation we have at MK isn't much different, but we try in all ways possible to support the customers and the brand.

Going forward, there will not be any similar problems with our current and future models, with regards to accessing replacement parts even 15-20 years from now. The reason is because of who we are purchasing parts from and how we are controlling design and production. We also have recently purchased large quantities of spare parts for our speakers that are warehoused in Denmark, to stockpile for the future if needed.

 

[BADDMO4]

New mk sound service is horrible!!!!

Hi David.

MK sound Denmark do not honor the old M&K 10 year Warranty.
This is a matter between previous dealers and the old Miller & Kreisel – which I guess you will know is not possible caused by the M&K bankruptcy.

We are not either offering current MK sound drivers to older subs as we have to keep these reserved for current products.
I know the old products are treasured and valued by many many users - but MK sound Denmark do only offer service for the current product lines.

The exception is a for a few older products like satellites where we have some original parts to offer.

Sorry I have to provide this negative info – but I can’t offer to help you getting your old sub “going again”

Regards
Gert.


This is the exact Email I received from Gert Christensen from MK Sound. Not once did he recommend alternative solutions to sub repair. So please don't patronize me by saying alternative solutions were offered. MK Sound just dismissed a regular guy trying to get his sub fixed. Ken Kreisel would never be so informal or dismissive! His new company will prove me right!!!

 

[zumbo]

Going forward, there will not be any similar problems with our current and future models, with regards to accessing replacement parts even 15-20 years from now. The reason is because of who we are purchasing parts from and how we are controlling design and production. We also have recently purchased large quantities of spare parts for our speakers that are warehoused in Denmark, to stockpile for the future if needed.

Seriously?

 

[oltos]

MK S150 and MPS2510p

Hi Davef, I need a pair of medium to large bookshelf speakers to provide very natural and transparent sounding 2.2 stereo.

I don’t pretend to be an expert on loudspeaker design. But I think I know what music lovers and speaker designers strive to obtain from any kind of loudspeaker system: Natural sounding mids, delicate, airy, highs-without brightness and robust but clean, articulate bass.

Of course, these goals must all be accomplished with very low distortion, excellent horizontal and vertical dispersion, while reaching respectable SPLs in a medium sized living room.

I’ve only just discovered Ken Kreisel, the originator of the famous S150, and now the reissued version by the newly formed MK Sound, who I’m hoping kept their S150 very faithful to Kreisel’s design.

But compared to any speaker at the same price point, does anyone know how a pair of the “new” MK S150 would do purely as an audiophile music speaker (not for movies)?

Being a fairly small sealed box speaker, the S150s are obviously intended to work with a subwoofer. But above 80Hz, how well can a pair of S150s’ compete against higher end “hi-fi” bookshelf speakers from B & W, Dali, Decware, Harbeth, James, KEF, Lipinski, Speaker Art, Surroundtec, System Audio, Teresonic, Thiel Audio, Westlake Audio, YG Acoustics, et al?

And above 80Hz, compared to the sound of the Klein & Hummel O 300?

Also, is the S150 basically a near-field speaker, where it’s best to hear a pair of them not much more than 8 feet away-at least for music listening? Actually, 8 feet is fine with me; just curious.


Of course, all of the above would also be true of the active version, the MPS2510p, correct?

Finally, if I didn’t want to go with the MK subwoofers (too big & $$), what do you think about a pair of Rythmik F12SE subs?

 

[ski2xblack]

Hello Oltos-

Be patient and hold out for the real thing. KK's new product should be coming out very soon!

For sneak peaks, check out:

Ken Kreisel Sound and Design | Facebook

 

[oltos]

MK S150 or MPS2510p

Hello Oltos-

Be patient and hold out for the real thing. KK's new product should be coming out very soon!


I know, I've seen that but both models are beyond my budget. And I still have the main speakers to get first, plus I've heard nothing but raves about the Rythmik F12SE (see the enjoythemusic.com review). What I really I need now is for someone who owns (or owned) a pair of the S150 the MSP2510p to answer my questions!

 

[BADDMO4]

S150

Hey Oltos,

I have a original M&K S150 trio and SS150 surround system (5.1). Not the new imposters. They are very musical. I use them to listen to SACD/DVD-A. They are compact and considerd book shelves, but they are musical. Granted a full size tower would probably reproduce music better, but where can you find a home theater speaker that does movies above and beyond expectation and music very well? I recommend you try to secure a trio of original M&K S150. Ebay is always listing them for very reasonable $$$. I would not recommend the new MK Sound versions. I know first hand how the service is terrible. Second all of the accolades they post about the S150's are when Ken Kreisel had the company. So those accolades are Ken's, not MK Sound! Go with the originals, they might be used, but will be real deal!

D

 

[Sam Ash]

Out of interest, has anyone had any experience with the new range - S150MkII ?

Gene, have you had a chance to review these and the new sub-woofer range ?

 

[gene]

Out of interest, has anyone had any experience with the new range - S150MkII ?

Gene, have you had a chance to review these and the new sub-woofer range ?

Sam, not sure what happened with M&K after our announcement. They seem to have gone silent.

 

[avengineer]

My MK S150s are anything but silent!

I just got an MX350 MKII sub, great deal, it's a close-out model (I'm actually demo-ing it). Playing with it today. Walking across the room on the LFE waves! This thing sounds almost barometric! But it's now old tech, they have introduced a ponderous new sub line, the SX series. Funny too, since the "K", Ken Kreisel, is also producing an even more ponderous sub line as Ken Kreisel Sound. Check the Quatro-Quatro configuration...12,000 Watts continuous, 32,000 Watts True Peak!!! 4 stacks of Quatros! Gotta love the bass.

But M&K is alive and well, and the MX-350 II closeout probably won't last long.