Subwoofer for inside and outside use

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Mountainear

Audioholic Intern
Hello and thanks in advance all for your input. I've read several threads here, most recently the best sub for $500.00. I am wanting a sweet sub, not wanting to spend more than I have to, as I think I'd like to get an A/V receiver as well. I'd like to keep sub under $1200.00. Hopefully my room and current and previous stereo experiences show up in my signature below. I like the idea of having 2 subs. However, I am wanting to use it/them outside as well, so one may be easier to move than 2. I've read so much positive here about SVS subs, I was thinking about their pc12+, as a much more experienced poster here noted that their cylinder sub was handy to move outside for backyard movies. They said it had a bit of a lip to grab onto and that they then laid it down on its side outside. I've looked, but I've been unable to find db specs on the pc 12+. Would 1 give a better true sub experience outside than say 2 BIC PL-200's? Two BICs would save me a good bit of $. I also see a used SVS PB 13 Ultra, circa 2009, with the 750 BASH amp, appears to be within my price range. It would be heavier to move, but on another thread, someone said it is better get a better sub than getting one that you'll want to be upgrading shortly. It appears any of the above would work fine inside for me. How about for backyard music and movies? I'd like one that plays music, not rap, but reggae and similar music well. I'd thought about a PA type Behringer sub for outside for impact, but it doesn't appear to dig as deep and I'd possibly be disappointed with it inside, cuts off at 35 Hz. It doesn't seem like the type that is reviewed here. To sum up, I'm looking for the sub(s) that provide best experience for backyard music and movies that won't sound like a one note car stereo boom-boomer inside. Extra points for ease of movement. Thanks again all!

P.S. Is it adviseable to try out a used sub with no access to a receiver or main speakers with a mp-3 player/Ipod? Better than nothing?
 
M

markw

Audioholic Overlord
Getting good bass is about moving air in a certain ares, or space. The bigger the speaker and the more power you feed it, generally the better and stronger bass you have. Likewise, the smaller the area that air to be moved is in, the better and stroner the bass will be.

Inside is no problem. Hsu, SVS, and many other manufactures can deliver that at reasonable cost. Many manufacturers ask for the cubic feet of the room it will be used in and offer suggestions for a suitible product.

Now, when you say you want a "Sub" woofer for outside, what are you shooting for? Getting mid/upper bass outside is problem enough (google "bass bins") but trying for true low/sub bass frequencies outside in the open air is going to be big, ugly and costly.
 
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G

Grador

Audioholic Field Marshall
Bass outside can somewhat work if you keep the subwoofer(s) very close to yourself, but as mark has said, don't be expecting to cover any area of the backyard with good bass.

Because of how difficult it would be to get good coverage for the backyard, I would take it out of the equation when looking for the best subs for your HT. It would be best not to compromise the quality of a good setup to chase a setup that will never quite work well.
 
M

Mountainear

Audioholic Intern
Thanks markw and Grador. I remember back about 1992 having a party in my parents' yard. I had a Velodyne Servo 1200 12" 100watt sealed box sub running with a large pair of Infinity speakers sitting on grass about 6 feet away from concrete block wall behind them. I think I only had the Infinity speakers handling >40Hz frequencies. I remember thinking the Velodyne made a noticeable difference in the sound in a good way, listening to Metallica and R&B. Not chest thumping, but nice. Now, most of the time, and all the time during 8 winter months, I'll be using it inside. I only have about 1400 cubic foot of space in my listening room, but with 7 ft opening to our kitchen/dining room; I am assuming all of the choices I mentioned in my original post would work nicely inside. I'm also hoping to get my first ever a/v receiver and a center channel to match up with my PSB Image 5Ts L/R floorstanders. I was impressed with sound and imaging my PSBs produced 2 summers ago when I showed a movie outside. I was thinking a sub would add to the experience and possibly take some of the workload from the PSBs. Its been many years since I bought a sub. The 2 A/V stores I stopped at in Wilmington, NC on vacation last week didn't have any subs that are discussed on this forum. I don't know how a BIC PL-200, Outlaw LFM-1 EX, SVS PC 12+, or 2009 SVS PB 13 would compare the Velodyne I had previously. I don't know if I want to try lifting a PB 13 around, even if I rigged up a strap system to help with it. I don't want to build a Bass Bin at this point in time. Forget the Behringer option I mentioned above. I'd rather have true sub. Would a PC 12+ produce significantly better sound/volume outside compared to 2 PL-200s or 1 LFM-1 EX? Inside, I don't think I would have the gain turned up much at all on any of the options. Thanks again for your input! As well, possibly 2 PB-1000s? They are only 46 lbs each. At what point does the Law of Diminishing returns for dollar spent kick in? Sorry for all the questions, but thanks again.
 
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M

Mountainear

Audioholic Intern
Maybe a Rythmic fv15hp? It appears to be less than 120 lbs after shipped.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
Maybe a Rythmic fv15hp? It appears to be less than 120 lbs after shipped.
I think placing a powered sub outside is a bad idea, even just for the summer.

A sealed solution would also be poor. Loudspeakers are poor coupler to the air anyway and outside awful. A good port will couple to the air outside much better than a loudspeaker cone in the deep bass.

I would recommend a passive vented sub for outside, with a woofer cone that is plastic or metal and definitely not paper.

That way you can keep all your electronics inside.
 
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fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
I agree with TLS Guy. For outside use you definitely want passive and ported/horn loaded.

You can pretty easily build one of these, with driver and amp for around $500. Throw in an extra $100 for some outdoor finishing and you've got a tremendous outdoor subwoofer.
 
M

Mountainear

Audioholic Intern
Thanks TLS Guy and fuzz092888. On second thought, I would consider building one, if it would be usable inside as well. However,........ are you thinking I'm wanting a sub I can just leave outside during the summer? That is not what I would be doing. I would only be taking it outside for a little music and a movie, then returning it inside the same evening.
 
fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
Thanks TLS Guy and fuzz092888. On second thought, I would consider building one, if it would be usable inside as well. However,........ are you thinking I'm wanting a sub I can just leave outside during the summer? That is not what I would be doing. I would only be taking it outside for a little music and a movie, then returning it inside the same evening.
Then the one I suggested might be a little big, but the recommendation stands. Plus, building your own allows you to add wheels and handles without fear of damaging the finish that would have been there if you had just purchased one, making it much much easier to move back and forth between inside and outside. There are other, smaller designs on that website and obviously many other designs out there.

There are great designs right here on the forum in the DIY section with simple ported designs.
 
M

Mountainear

Audioholic Intern
Thanks again fuzz092888. Would you point me towards the specific one you were talking about? The link in your post takes me to a dog humping a guy on Youtube... Happy Father's Day?
 
M

Mountainear

Audioholic Intern
Do you mean the Infinity Kappa build sticky on the DIY page?
 
M

Mountainear

Audioholic Intern
Okay, I'm sold on the DIY route. I just need to nail down specifics.
 
fuzz092888

fuzz092888

Audioholic Warlord
Do you mean the Infinity Kappa build sticky on the DIY page?

You could do the Kappy, the infinity reference, or just ask for suggestions and give a budget. You may also want to venture over to the parts express tech talk forum.

As to the dog video, audioholics force inserts links into specific words. I choose to not allow that to happen and insert my own links from time to time.

I don't know why, but there was supposed to be another link in that post. Nestor shared the link I was trying to get to you anyways.
 
M

Mountainear

Audioholic Intern
Okay, I took a look at Nestor's thtlp's. I bet the sound is wonderful. However, in looking around at over at fuzz's recommended Part's Express DIY tech talk page, speaker builder's bible, I saw cylinder subs, big one's larger than SVS pc 13 ultra. Then I found this thread How To Make A DIY Cylinder Subwoofer (AKA A Sonosub). It sounds easier to build that a horn, and could possibly use outside and inside both, better WAF..? How would a say 20" or 24" diameter sonosub with height of about 46" compare to the thtlp? Should I copy this to the DIY thread? Thanks again Nestor and fuzz.
 

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