Confusing existing layout and setup

[wingnutty1]

We moved into a new house a while back and I'm finally getting around to setting up the home theater system. There are existing in-wall speakers, but I'm a little confused on their placement and the wiring and could use some assistance. All the connections for the speakers run into a built-in cabinet and the TV location is directly adjacent on the wall. I'm running a Harmon Kardon AVR 1700 (just purchased).

So the basic setup is a 5.1, but the speaker layout is kinda weird. Picture 1 shows the layout.

Picture 1: Layout

There are 3 in-wall speakers and 2 in-ceiling speakers and they are as follows:

Speaker 1: center speaker (I assume), I can't get the grill of to determine make/model. This speaker doesn't have a 'normal' speaker connection (see below) and I can't figure out how to hook it up.

Speakers 2&3: In-wall, both are brand JBL

Speakers 4&5: In-ceiling, Pioneer S-910's.

I guess i am unsure of how the entire system was designed as it doesn't fit the typical layout? When I wire my speakers to my AVR, which one's should I put in which spot?

Now the really tricky part, I only have wires for 4 of the speakers; I am missing the wires for what I assume is center speaker, above the TV. I have some plates with RCA connections, and it appears I could hook to the speakers either via the RCA connections, or by the loose wires, but again, on this primary plate, the connections for the center speaker are absent (pic. 4). It doesn't appear to be an oversight, as the system was likely professionally installed and it looks pretty clean. I have a 2nd plate that runs the old AV connections out to the TV, with a matching plate where the TV hooks in on the wall (picture 5); on this plate, there are RCA jacks that say "power base" and "to c/speaker". I assume the power base if for the subwoofer that I'll need to purchase and the "to c/speaker" is for the center speaker??? But why in the heck does the center speaker connect off of this AV plate? How would I hook this into my AVR? Any ideas? I'm totally confused!

Picture 4: speaker plate

Picture 5: AV Plate (in cabinet) with matching plate above TV: Notice "power base" and "to c/speaker" jacks...

Could anyone offer any assistance/advice? I'm a little confused on this whole thing.

 

[ImcLoud]

the F#ck? i have no idea, Im thinking its time for some re routing, maybe some of them speakers are for an intercom and have nothing to do with ht... I would buy a sheet of drywall some plaster and paint and get a normal non built in 5.1 and call it a day..

 

[wingnutty1]

Thanks for the reply, yeah, this thing is so confusing, I'm pulling out my hair!

So my budget right now is not going to allow me to scrap the entire audio system, I'd like to try and salvage what I can and make due for a while. I have speakers 2-5 hooked up (via bare speaker wires), but don't have speaker #1 hooked up (I assume this was the center speaker) because it only has an RCA jack to plug into.

So, how would I go about hooking into speaker #1? I don't want to damage my AVR, if this is a line-level (terminology???) input? There is a separate 'powered base' RCA jack on the plate (picture 5) as well, so I wouldn't think that the center speaker is also line-level, but I don't know how to find out for sure?

Any help would be appreciated

 

[Adam]

Welcome to the forum, and Happy New Year!

Wow, yeah - that layout is a bit tricky. We can tackle that next.

First, though, I'm curious how you hooked up the wall and ceiling speakers with bare wire. The photos of both wall plates show RCA connections, and the labeling seems consistent with line level (you got the terminology right) connections. It seems that there is (or was) a multi-channel amplifier somewhere in the system that the previous owner used to power all of the speakers (including the center channel).

Oh, and I've got to say - this is the first time that I've seen full-size floor-standing speakers mounted into the ceiling.

 

[wingnutty1]

Thanks for the response and good question! So, the plate has BOTH RCA jacks and speaker wire. The RCA jacks are on the plate (as shown) and the speaker wires extend from below the plate (visible in the blurry picture).

I can tell that the previous owners used the wire connections because they were already stripped and had obviously been used.

There are wires/RCA connections for the intercom and for some additional speakers in another room; the speakers in the other room were removed/replaced with their own seperate system from what I can tell and we won't be using or caring about those. The intercom is pretty old school and I think I can positively say that none of the speakers in the TV room were integral to the intercom system at all.

So all I care about is the actual surround sound system at this point.

Oh, and I've got to say - this is the first time that I've seen full-size floor-standing speakers mounted into the ceiling.

Come on over and I'll give you a tour of some of the other ????? issues in this house I won't go into detail on the overly-expensive steam shower/jacuzzi tub in the master bath that has a telephone and looks like a space ship, but leaks in like 10 spots that are impossible to get to We bought this place for a good deal as a foreclosure...previous owners ran a ponzi scheme and are in prison! (seriously!)

 

[mtrycrafts]

...

Oh, and I've got to say - this is the first time that I've seen full-size floor-standing speakers mounted into the ceiling.

Yes, that must have been a task.
Now I wonder with those angled lag bolts if the cabinet is up there or just the baffle.

 

[mtrycrafts]

...previous owners ran a ponzi scheme and are in prison! (seriously!)

Welcome.

WOW, better go over that house with a magnifier. Maybe there is a hidden stash of $$$ as you may need it to fix it up.

 

[wingnutty1]

So I took the RCA plate off where the "powered base" and "c/speaker" are labeled and this is what is shows (red wire to one RCA post, black wire to 2nd RCA post and neutral to, I assume a ground?):

So does this tell me that the speaker that is fed by these wires is a powered bass, or is it just a normal speaker that I can hook directly to the AVR? Is there a way to tell for sure that this is or isn't a powered bass? It is labeled as such.

 

[wingnutty1]

Ok, thanks all for your patience and assistance

So I went ahead and clipped that speaker wire off of the RCA connection and connected that center speaker to the AVR by splicing it to some more speaker wire to reach the AVR.

I agree that this is a hack job of a setup. I'll plug it all in and see if it is workable until we decide to upgrade speakers and redo it all at some point in the future...not looking immanent as we have twins due in a few months

What would be your recommondations on making the system most functional at this point without a complete tear-out? I could add a speaker or two and then disconnect one of the existing speakers I suppose? Any ideas?

 

[Adam]

Rearranging the furniture might make the speaker arrangement slightly less odd, but I don't see it, yet.

Here's what I'd do at first:
Speaker #1 - Center channel (that was an easy one )
Speaker #2 - Front Right
Speaker #3 - Surround Left
Speaker #4 - Front Left
Speaker #5 - Surround Right

The whole wall/ceiling arrangment makes me think that won't work that great, but that arrangement matches up with the orientation the best to me.

 

[ImcLoud]

Rearranging the furniture might make the speaker arrangement slightly less odd, but I don't see it, yet.

Here's what I'd do at first:
Speaker #1 - Center channel (that was an easy one )
Speaker #2 - Front Right
Speaker #3 - Surround Left
Speaker #4 - Front Left
Speaker #5 - Surround Right

The whole wall/ceiling arrangment makes me think that won't work that great, but that arrangement matches up with the orientation the best to me.

have to agree here, that is your best option, what else can you do Except I would bet a $140 jamo 426 5.0 will sound better and be less work....

 

[GO-NAD!]

Rearranging the furniture might make the speaker arrangement slightly less odd, but I don't see it, yet.

Here's what I'd do at first:
Speaker #1 - Center channel (that was an easy one )
Speaker #2 - Front Right
Speaker #3 - Surround Left
Speaker #4 - Front Left
Speaker #5 - Surround Right

The whole wall/ceiling arrangment makes me think that won't work that great, but that arrangement matches up with the orientation the best to me.

Yeah, I agree with Adam's suggestion, to make the best of a bad situation. But the first words that come to mind, looking at that layout and the photos, are: dogs breakfast. You certainly have your work cut out for you, so I hope you're handy. Besides the speaker layout, they didn't even have the decency to install the in-walls vertically. Good luck!

 

[panteragstk]

Wow, I haven't seen RCA connectors used for speaker level since the 80's. Those pioneer speakers are supposed to be pretty good. Old, but good. I would imagine this was a quadraphonic setup installed in the 80's. You don't see that much anymore, and I bet that's why you don't have a center channel, there isn't one.. I would honestly rip everything out and start over (when you get the cash of course).