HDMI issues new Denon 3313c

[RAJOD]

I just upgraded my old HT (65 inch mits, outlaw receiver) to

- 64 inch Samsung Plasma Smart TV (8000) series)
- Denon 3313c reciver.

The issues.

Blue ray and STB work fine connected directly to TV.

When going though amp its a chore to get the TV to find the signal. I have to fiddle around too much. Once I get it it stays.

In standbye mode I only get the TV picture for like 3 seconds then it cuts out and says No signal.

I have 4 comcast HDMI cables and one Monster 12 foot HDMI. Iver tried diff ports and rearanging them


I thought maybe if I buy 1.4 HDMI cables I might have better luck.

Its way too complicated for the wife and kids to get the TV running using the denon. Even for me its a pain. Its turn on TV, then grab denon remote, then grab comcast remote turn on in right order. Then grab denon remote and change from the 2 channel hdmi stero back channel to STB area ( it wont default to this) then wait 5 seconds for the HDMI to sync with TV and cross fingers then I get TV picture with sound.

So for now I am running the STB directly to TV and using TV internal speakers. So much easier.


If the standby mode of the denon worked it would be nice. Then could turn on TV and would get a picture.

Somehow its losing signal going from STB through the denon. And only by fiddling with the denon inputs on the remote will give me the picture.

Not sure if its the denon, the STB, the cables etc.

Any ideas on how to make this work?

Its 2012 and I feel my old analog was easier and better.

 

[TLS Guy]

I just upgraded my old HT (65 inch mits, outlaw receiver) to

- 64 inch Samsung Plasma Smart TV (8000) series)
- Denon 3313c reciver.

The issues.

Blue ray and STB work fine connected directly to TV.

When going though amp its a chore to get the TV to find the signal. I have to fiddle around too much. Once I get it it stays.

In standbye mode I only get the TV picture for like 3 seconds then it cuts out and says No signal.

I have 4 comcast HDMI cables and one Monster 12 foot HDMI. Iver tried diff ports and rearanging them


I thought maybe if I buy 1.4 HDMI cables I might have better luck.

Its way too complicated for the wife and kids to get the TV running using the denon. Even for me its a pain. Its turn on TV, then grab denon remote, then grab comcast remote turn on in right order. Then grab denon remote and change from the 2 channel hdmi stero back channel to STB area ( it wont default to this) then wait 5 seconds for the HDMI to sync with TV and cross fingers then I get TV picture with sound.

So for now I am running the STB directly to TV and using TV internal speakers. So much easier.


If the standby mode of the denon worked it would be nice. Then could turn on TV and would get a picture.

Somehow its losing signal going from STB through the denon. And only by fiddling with the denon inputs on the remote will give me the picture.

Not sure if its the denon, the STB, the cables etc.

Any ideas on how to make this work?

Its 2012 and I feel my old analog was easier and better.

Stories like yours come across here far too frequently.

The reason going direct to the TV is stable, is because the TV is an end device and just has to make one initial handshake. The receiver on the other hand receives and transmits HDMI, and is required to make repeater HDCP code handshakes.

Now you have a receiver well above the low end, and you have every right to assume that the unit is HDCP certified, and fully compliant with all HDCP codes.

STBs are generally not HDCP certified and frequently cause HDCP code handshake issues.

What is your BD player? Does the manual say whether or not it is HDCP certified.

The HDCP codes get ever more rigid and your receiver being new is probably a strict rule enforcer.

The only way I can think of to sort this out is to make sure you test this receiver with an HDCP certified peripheral device. If you still have this problem, your receiver is faulty and you need to return it if the other measures I suggest fail. Failure and problems with HDMI boards are probably the most common of receiver faults.

The other thing I would do is a reset of your receiver to factory defaults, and do your set up again. Also make sure your receiver has the latest firmware, if not download it. Unfortunately that fact that it is new is no guarantee it was loaded with the latest firmware.

Once you know that your receiver will receive and transmit a signal from an HDCP certified device, you then need to ask your cable company if they have firmware updates for your STB or a newer model with the latest codes and or HDCP certified if the STB continues to cause problems.

HDMI issues like yours are alleged to be less common than they were. I remain to be convinced, we still get our fair share of posts like yours.

The draconian DRM associated with HDMI via the HDCP codes, still stop people enjoying what they paid for far too often.

 

[RAJOD]

Thanks for the reply.

My Blue rays is a Samsung BD-E5900 3D WiFi Blu-ray Disc Player

I can get it all to work, meaning I can get sound and video.

But when the receiver is in standbye mode and the TV is switched on, I can't get a video signal.

Not sure if my comcast HD STB is certified. But I can get it to play through the denon 3313c. Just can't get it to work reliably in standby mode.

Also blue DVDs seem to have more noise than Comcast HD TV signals. Will have to test the blue ray direct connect. to the TV.

So not sure if its handshacking or cables that are marginal or maybe the HDMI section of the receiver is faulty. Its all new so want to figure it out under warranty.

 

[TLS Guy]

Thanks for the reply.

My Blue rays is a Samsung BD-E5900 3D WiFi Blu-ray Disc Player

I can get it all to work, meaning I can get sound and video.

But when the receiver is in standbye mode and the TV is switched on, I can't get a video signal.

Not sure if my comcast HD STB is certified. But I can get it to play through the denon 3313c. Just can't get it to work reliably in standby mode.

Also blue DVDs seem to have more noise than Comcast HD TV signals. Will have to test the blue ray direct connect. to the TV.

So not sure if its handshacking or cables that are marginal or maybe the HDMI section of the receiver is faulty. Its all new so want to figure it out under warranty.

Standby mode is useless. If you want it to work, switch the receiver on.

 

[RAJOD]

I'm trying to think of the easiest way to set it up for everyone in my family.

If standby is a poorly implemented feature for HDMI pass through then I'll have to come up with something else.

1. Run all video directly to TV and run audio to the amp. The Denon does have two optical audio inputs.

DVD HDMI ---- TV ----Optical out-----> amp
STB HDMI ---->TV ---Optical out -----> amp

2. DVD and STB HDMI to AMP then AMP HDMI output to TV. Return Denon 3313c and find receiver with working HDMI standby


3. the ARC feature seems to allow HDMI to flow from TV to receiver, maybe could get TV to send audio to amp this way.

Someone on another forum said optical outputs can't do HD sound. ie. like DTS, dolby 5.1. Is this true?

That way I'm gauranteed a good sync on the video when I turn on the tv.

My cable box is a motorola RNG150N (DCX3200) - not sure if its compliant.

Also a easy to use universal remote to control them all. The comcast universal is not going to cut it. Any good ones out there? Is the logitech harmony good?



Thanks!

 

[TLS Guy]

I'm trying to think of the easiest way to set it up for everyone in my family.

If standby is a poorly implemented feature for HDMI pass through then I'll have to come up with something else.

1. Run all video directly to TV and run audio to the amp. The Denon does have two optical audio inputs.

DVD HDMI ---- TV ----Optical out-----> amp
STB HDMI ---->TV ---Optical out -----> amp

2. DVD and STB HDMI to AMP then AMP HDMI output to TV. Return Denon 3313c and find receiver with working HDMI standby


3. the ARC feature seems to allow HDMI to flow from TV to receiver, maybe could get TV to send audio to amp this way.

Someone on another forum said optical outputs can't do HD sound. ie. like DTS, dolby 5.1. Is this true?

That way I'm gauranteed a good sync on the video when I turn on the tv.

My cable box is a motorola RNG150N (DCX3200) - not sure if its compliant.

Also a easy to use universal remote to control them all. The comcast universal is not going to cut it. Any good ones out there? Is the logitech harmony good?



Thanks!

HDMI standby is not really a good idea. The board is in fact always on to quite a large degree, and will significantly impact your energy bills. It is not like having a cordless phone plugged in. The processor are live all the time and have very significant current draws.

Your plan to hook everything up to the TV is a bad one. As there are now flags on some discs to stop output from your TV to receiver and or downgrade quality from the TV optical outputs, and this will get more common.

I don't see the problem of the family using the receiver. All they need to know is the on button and how to change inputs, They never have to touch the TV other than to switch it on.

My TV does not have any speakers, it is just a monitor. Honestly, changing inputs on a receiver is no different than changing inputs on a TV.

There is the proverbial mountain being made out of a mole hill here.

As a bonus they get the best picture and sound quality, by the hookup which HDMI is now intended to force, peripherals, to receiver via HDMI and one HDMI cable to the TV. Anything else and HDMI is designed to severely downgrade quality and or just not work from here on out.

And yes, optical cables do not have the bandwidth for HD picture and the new loss less audio codecs.

Your family have really no choice but to learn to use the technology the way the "enforcers" want.

 

[BMXTRIX]

I'm trying to think of the easiest way to set it up for everyone in my family.

Then get a good remote control!

This is something people think of as frivolous or something else, but the bottom line is that a good universal remote is the ONLY device that your wife, in-laws, parents, and kids should have any clue how to use. From a decent Logitech Harmony to a URC remote professionally programmed, to higher end RF remotes, there are lots of possibilities, but the big thing about them is that when you have a good one it makes the system so that it actually works the way it is supposed to.

Hit the ONE button that says 'Cable' and the TV turns on, the receiver goes to the right input, the cable box turns on, the volume hits the receiver properly while channel control and all the buttons control the cable box the way it is supposed to.]

Any remote that requires more than that to get things started is not properly setup (unless it is capable of a lot more functionality).

You are not the first, nor anywhere near the last, person to come to these (or other) forums with the exact same issue. The end line is always the same: People with good universal remotes don't have this issue no matter how complex their system is to operate. It is handled by the remote and eveyrone in the family can use the system.

 

[TLS Guy]

Then get a good remote control!

This is something people think of as frivolous or something else, but the bottom line is that a good universal remote is the ONLY device that your wife, in-laws, parents, and kids should have any clue how to use. From a decent Logitech Harmony to a URC remote professionally programmed, to higher end RF remotes, there are lots of possibilities, but the big thing about them is that when you have a good one it makes the system so that it actually works the way it is supposed to.

Hit the ONE button that says 'Cable' and the TV turns on, the receiver goes to the right input, the cable box turns on, the volume hits the receiver properly while channel control and all the buttons control the cable box the way it is supposed to.]

Any remote that requires more than that to get things started is not properly setup (unless it is capable of a lot more functionality).

You are not the first, nor anywhere near the last, person to come to these (or other) forums with the exact same issue. The end line is always the same: People with good universal remotes don't have this issue no matter how complex their system is to operate. It is handled by the remote and eveyrone in the family can use the system.

You have heard it from a master system planner.

 

[Grador]

I'm trying to think of the easiest way to set it up for everyone in my family.

If standby is a poorly implemented feature for HDMI pass through then I'll have to come up with something else.

1. Run all video directly to TV and run audio to the amp. The Denon does have two optical audio inputs.

DVD HDMI ---- TV ----Optical out-----> amp
STB HDMI ---->TV ---Optical out -----> amp

2. DVD and STB HDMI to AMP then AMP HDMI output to TV. Return Denon 3313c and find receiver with working HDMI standby


3. the ARC feature seems to allow HDMI to flow from TV to receiver, maybe could get TV to send audio to amp this way.

Someone on another forum said optical outputs can't do HD sound. ie. like DTS, dolby 5.1. Is this true?

That way I'm gauranteed a good sync on the video when I turn on the tv.

My cable box is a motorola RNG150N (DCX3200) - not sure if its compliant.

Also a easy to use universal remote to control them all. The comcast universal is not going to cut it. Any good ones out there? Is the logitech harmony good?



Thanks!

Follow the above advice on remotes, I have a harmony one and think it's quite good.

If you did not want to do that ARC should work in your case, though frankly i find this a more difficult setup than using a good remote.

Optical does support DTS and Dolby Digital 5.1, HD audio [like DTS MA-HD and Dolby Digital True HD] are the codecs not supported by optical and are only found on blurays.

 

[RAJOD]

Thanks for all the good replies. Yes I think a good remote is the answer.
I'll probably get that harmony unless there is a better one in that price range.


The other day 4 highschool kids are over when I was out and none of them got the sound from the amp to turn on or sync properly. Lol. 5 remotes, 2 for TV, 1 for STB, 1 for DVD, 1 for Denon. 1 good remote should solve that.

On the Denon, yes it appears to be on all the time even when I shut it off.
It just says "Main - off" but its still on. If I touch the top of it, its quite warm. Not sure why its so warm if its not doing anything. Anyway short of pulling the plug out it appears its sort of always on even when its shut off via remote of the front power button.


Right now I have the STB going to the TV directly and using built in speakers.

Blue ray goes though the Denon then to the TV, so for DVD movies I get DTS etc.

STB ---- HDMI TV input 1
Blue ray ---- Deonon ---- HDMI TV input 2

Even if I am watching TV using the TV input 1. If i turn on the denon it will cut the internal speaker sound to the TV yet it will not play any audio from the TV. Its like it sends a signal to the TV via TV input 2 (Note i'm watching TV using input 1)

Anyway I am getting an optical cable tomorrow for TV 5.1. Netflix, and most HD comcast shows are 5.1 which the optical should handle easy.

I was surprised at how well netflix streams from router on the 3rd floor to the TVs internal wi fi. If you want a good wiresless router get the
ASUS RT-N66U Dual-Band Wireless-N900 Gigabit Router.

 

[nthydro]

Stories like yours come across here far too frequently.

The reason going direct to the TV is stable, is because the TV is an end device and just has to make one initial handshake. The receiver on the other hand receives and transmits HDMI, and is required to make repeater HDCP code handshakes.

Now you have a receiver well above the low end, and you have every right to assume that the unit is HDCP certified, and fully compliant with all HDCP codes.

STBs are generally not HDCP certified and frequently cause HDCP code handshake issues.

What is your BD player? Does the manual say whether or not it is HDCP certified.

The HDCP codes get ever more rigid and your receiver being new is probably a strict rule enforcer.

The only way I can think of to sort this out is to make sure you test this receiver with an HDCP certified peripheral device. If you still have this problem, your receiver is faulty and you need to return it if the other measures I suggest fail. Failure and problems with HDMI boards are probably the most common of receiver faults.

The other thing I would do is a reset of your receiver to factory defaults, and do your set up again. Also make sure your receiver has the latest firmware, if not download it. Unfortunately that fact that it is new is no guarantee it was loaded with the latest firmware.

Once you know that your receiver will receive and transmit a signal from an HDCP certified device, you then need to ask your cable company if they have firmware updates for your STB or a newer model with the latest codes and or HDCP certified if the STB continues to cause problems.

HDMI issues like yours are alleged to be less common than they were. I remain to be convinced, we still get our fair share of posts like yours.

The draconian DRM associated with HDMI via the HDCP codes, still stop people enjoying what they paid for far too often.

For a beginner like me, just reading about the complexity of HDMI already scares me. I hope they find a way to dumb down the whole process. Right now its a mess. Component was so much easier.

 

[BMXTRIX]

For a beginner like me, just reading about the complexity of HDMI already scares me. I hope they find a way to dumb down the whole process. Right now its a mess. Component was so much easier.

Yup, that one cable solution is just way to complex!