UPS - queries

[Sylar]

I have just purchased a crown XLS 1500 to drive subs.

1. Do I need a UPS for this or would a servo stabilizer suffice? (The dealer selling Crown back home advised that a servo stabilizer should be sufficient. I earlier had faced an issue, where I needed to switch from a normal Stabilizer to UPS - on advice from TLS Guy. It worked out well, faced no issues since making the switch)

2. I have guys in forums back home, who use all kinds of UPS at crazy prices, like
- Emerson liebert online ups - medical grade
- Pure sine wave UPS
- Smart UPS
- Smart UPS On Line
- Servo stabilizer.

I am currently, using an APC Ups for my marantz AVR. Havent faced any issues, except battery draining out pretty quickly.
Should I chase a specific type/kind of UPS, or would any UPS do? These UPS from APC are available here.

Note:
This is the power environment at home. Highly unstable voltage. Fluctuates from 160 - 260 V (should be around 230V!). Sometimes has gone overboard to 300. Rapid fluctuations in voltage in short span is as common as everyday.

 

[panteragstk]

The power supply in the crown will be able to overcome just about anything short of a power outage. That amp will draw quite a bit of power so a ups would have to be pretty big. I wouldn't bother as it won't get you anything.

 

[TLS Guy]

I have just purchased a crown XLS 1500 to drive subs.

1. Do I need a UPS for this or would a servo stabilizer suffice? (The dealer selling Crown back home advised that a servo stabilizer should be sufficient. I earlier had faced an issue, where I needed to switch from a normal Stabilizer to UPS - on advice from TLS Guy. It worked out well, faced no issues since making the switch)

2. I have guys in forums back home, who use all kinds of UPS at crazy prices, like
- Emerson liebert online ups - medical grade
- Pure sine wave UPS
- Smart UPS
- Smart UPS On Line
- Servo stabilizer.

I am currently, using an APC Ups for my marantz AVR. Havent faced any issues, except battery draining out pretty quickly.
Should I chase a specific type/kind of UPS, or would any UPS do? These UPS from APC are available here.

Note:
This is the power environment at home. Highly unstable voltage. Fluctuates from 160 - 260 V (should be around 230V!). Sometimes has gone overboard to 300. Rapid fluctuations in voltage in short span is as common as everyday.

I don't normally advise UPS protection for stand alone power amps.

The reason, is you need a big one for little gain.

UPS systems I think are important to protect devices that have microprocessor boards, and other fragile chip based circuits.

Most power amps are relatively simple and easily fixed if a problem should occur.

I do not have personal experience of class D amps like your Crown. It is possible that they might present a special case, as their power supplies are much more complex and there are also complex clocking circuits, which might easily be damaged in power surges. Time will tell. It is for these reasons I have so far steered clear of class D amps.

I fix my own power amps when there is a problem, however I doubt I could trouble shoot a class D amp. I have heard first hand they are an absolute nightmare when problems develop.

At my age, I will likely always stick with current dumping amps. If you know a really good hole, why change and risk buying trouble.

 

[lsiberian]

A UPS and pro level amp are a bad match. I don't suggest this approach because your amp could easily cause issues with the UPS and quickly drain the battery. Use a UPS for projectors and tv's as well as game systems. Don't use them for Amps.

 

[Sylar]

A UPS and pro level amp are a bad match. I don't suggest this approach because your amp could easily cause issues with the UPS and quickly drain the battery. Use a UPS for projectors and tv's as well as game systems. Don't use them for Amps.

How about a voltage stabilizer? We encounter pretty wild variations in voltage.
Would it not cause issues?

 

[panteragstk]

How about a voltage stabilizer? We encounter pretty wild variations in voltage.
Would it not cause issues?

Pro amps are pretty good about overcoming imperfect power, but if it gets bad enough it can hurt the amp/performance. I've read a lot about voltage stabilizers and the good ones are pretty expensive. One thing, are you talking about a power conditioner or a voltage stabilizer/regulator (where it keeps the voltage constant no matter what the input is)? Power conditioners don't really do anything as far as voltage regulation goes.

 

[Sylar]

One thing, are you talking about a power conditioner or a voltage stabilizer/regulator (where it keeps the voltage constant no matter what the input is)? Power conditioners don't really do anything as far as voltage regulation goes.

I was targeting a voltage regulator. u recommend a conditioners?

 

[panteragstk]

I was targeting a voltage regulator. u recommend a conditioners?

No, a voltage regulator is much better, but probably unnecessary. I think a kill-a-watt will log your voltage fluctuation, if it is within normal tolerances, I wouldn't spend $2k on a voltage regulator. This is one of those things that you don't buy until you notice a problem.

 

[Sylar]

No, a voltage regulator is much better, but probably unnecessary. I think a kill-a-watt will log your voltage fluctuation, if it is within normal tolerances, I wouldn't spend $2k on a voltage regulator. This is one of those things that you don't buy until you notice a problem.

These arent normal tolerances. The swings are pretty wild.

There have been a couple of times when the power supply has abruptly cut off and come back on within a span of a second. I was advised this has high potential to cause damage since current draw will be high. I am not sure what is snake oil and am pretty much lost. I havent connected the amp yet since waiting on this.

I can easily get a good 2KV regulator within $250. But I am not sure if it will help? or what will help? or if I need any kind of protection at all?

I have also written to harmen on this, but so far no luck

 

[jinjuku]

Amps are built with their own protection and filtration. No need to worry about a UPS.

 

[panteragstk]

I can easily get a good 2KV regulator within $250. But I am not sure if it will help? or what will help? or if I need any kind of protection at all?

I have also written to harmen on this, but so far no luck

Are you sure that it isn't a brown out? If it is, then a VR isn't going to do anything for you. Plus, where can you get a VR for $250? They make them specifically for audio systems and they are very good, but very expensive.

EDIT: I did find a Furman for $550. It's rated at 15a, 120v, but I couldn't find one that much cheaper.

 

[Sylar]

...where can you get a VR for $250? They make them specifically for audio systems and they are very good, but very expensive.

EDIT: I did find a Furman for $550. It's rated at 15a, 120v, but I couldn't find one that much cheaper.

I live in India, and I remember i got this for about $100.

Are you sure that it isn't a brown out? If it is, then a VR isn't going to do anything for you

Brownouts, surges, spikes and voltage swings are common



From comments so far it seems this is not much of an issue.
I think I will use a voltage regulator anyways, more so not allow my device shut down too often since the device has a narrow operating range of 230V +/- 10%. The voltage regulator i think has a little wider operating range. (narrow for me cos it will jump out of this range often)

What is the VA rating would I need for the same?

 

[panteragstk]

Dude you could have stopped at "I live in India". One of my best friends is from there/still living there so I've heard the stories. I would use the regulator. Hopefully it will be able to do what you need it to.

 

[TLS Guy]

I live in India, and I remember i got this for about $100.


Brownouts, surges, spikes and voltage swings are common



From comments so far it seems this is not much of an issue.
I think I will use a voltage regulator anyways, more so not allow my device shut down too often since the device has a narrow operating range of 230V +/- 10%. The voltage regulator i think has a little wider operating range. (narrow for me cos it will jump out of this range often)

What is the VA rating would I need for the same?

That changes everything. You need a UPS with superior voltage regulation.

You need a UPS with a power requirement in watts that meets the maximum current draw of your amp, and the VA requirement, will be 30% above that.

 

[Gordonj]

I would recommend looking at a manufacture such as Surge-X -http://surgex.com/index.html

They have been around a long time and make some of the best surge protectors around. They offer a line for consumer and home use along with some very nice battery back-up units with surge protection. Their international web -site can be found here -http://www.surgexinternational.com/products.html.

Here is the link for India and the products that they offer - SurgeX International - The World's Most Trusted Name in Power Protection

I would recommend determining what you really would like to do, ie. keep the system live all the time of just "even - out" the power variables and clean and stabilize the power to your system. That will point you in the right direction. I would plan on cleaning and conditioning your power at the least. The products shown can take care of that. I am not sure if i would mess with putting the system and amp on a UPS, that may not be necessary for just cleaning the power.

Gordon

 

[TLS Guy]

I would recommend looking at a manufacture such as Surge-X -http://surgex.com/index.html

They have been around a long time and make some of the best surge protectors around. They offer a line for consumer and home use along with some very nice battery back-up units with surge protection. Their international web -site can be found here -http://www.surgexinternational.com/products.html.

Here is the link for India and the products that they offer - SurgeX International - The World's Most Trusted Name in Power Protection

I would recommend determining what you really would like to do, ie. keep the system live all the time of just "even - out" the power variables and clean and stabilize the power to your system. That will point you in the right direction. I would plan on cleaning and conditioning your power at the least. The products shown can take care of that. I am not sure if i would mess with putting the system and amp on a UPS, that may not be necessary for just cleaning the power.

Gordon

I think in his case a UPS will be required. A voltage regulator with battery backup will contain peaks within limits. But if voltage drops below the regulator set voltage at the its input, it can not boost voltage, for that a battery is required.

With the drop out and voltage fluctuations he describes, I feel a battery in the unit is required.

If he had not bought a class D amp, I would not be so concerned about his power amp.

 

[Gordonj]

I think in his case a UPS will be required. A voltage regulator with battery backup will contain peaks within limits. But if voltage drops below the regulator set voltage at the its input, it can not boost voltage, for that a battery is required.

With the drop out and voltage fluctuations he describes, I feel a battery in the unit is required.

If he had not bought a class D amp, I would not be so concerned about his power amp.

I agree, and as I said it goes back to what he wants to do. If he wants to keep the system up all the time a UPS will be good. However, there are surge and line conditioners that will help stabilize the variances and if, during a brown out, will shut the systems power down until the power stabilizes.

If he wants the system powered all the time and useable 100% of the time then a UPS will be required. Here are two examples of what I am referring too:

SurgeX International - The World's Most Trusted Name in Power Protection

http://www.surgex.com/retail/pdfs/SurgeX-PPUPS-Quick-Start.pdf

And very true about the D class amp. Since they are "at the mercy" of the power out of the wall there is very little tolerance for big swings or bad power. While the newer bread of D class amps are much better at dealing with power issues the nature of the beast still is what it is.

Gordon